Help with the Numbers

[jacobs_ladder2]

Just looking at a pretty decent site and came across this . It looks like it might be a good source of data, but I don't know enough to say for sure.

MGs firing PmK ammo look pretty threatening to say the least. How often would they have a supply on hand?

Cheers

Paul

[JasonC]

Why do you say so? I see 8mm penetration, to 13mm for the highest number given by any source. That first entry is an angle, not a number of mm of thickness. In CM, I regularly see 10mm armored cars KOed by German MGs at several hundred yards, and I regard 7mm and 8mm halftrack thickness armor as essentially unarmored when facing Germans.

[jacobs_ladder2]

Originally posted by JasonC:

Why do you say so?

Not sure. What did I say?

I see 8mm penetration, to 13mm for the highest number given by any source. That first entry is an angle, not a number of mm of thickness. In CM, I regularly see 10mm armored cars KOed by German MGs at several hundred yards, and I regard 7mm and 8mm halftrack thickness armor as essentially unarmored when facing Germans.

So, for example, the BA-20 with 6mm armour in most places would be a sitting duck. I thought so.

Not sure I understand you. The 30 degrees refers to the angle of the armour right? So in the first row a 7.92mm Patr SmK round will penetrate 8mm of sloped armour at 100m or 3mm at 500m. Is this not accurate?

Also, what is the difference between Patr SmK, SmK, SmKH and Patr SmK Kurz?

Cheers

Paul

[JasonC]

With AP they will hole armored cars at short range, that is correct. At medium range, an AC is proof against them. These are typical figures for 30 cal ammo, as long as it isn't carbine ammo. 50 cals can penetrate 25mm, 14.5mm can penetrate 30mm. I just did not see anything "pretty threatening to say the least" about 30 cal penetration figures that show they are defeated by a half an inch at point blank and practically any armor at medium range.

[jacobs_ladder2]

Originally posted by JasonC:

With AP they will hole armored cars at short range, that is correct. At medium range, an AC is proof against them. These are typical figures for 30 cal ammo, as long as it isn't carbine ammo. 50 cals can penetrate 25mm, 14.5mm can penetrate 30mm. I just did not see anything "pretty threatening to say the least" about 30 cal penetration figures that show they are defeated by a half an inch at point blank and practically any armor at medium range.

Ah, I see. As you know, I've been looking at armoured cars and tankettes lately. I never realized just how vulnerable they are to MGs and small arms.

JasonC, it seems to me (and please correct me if I am mistaken) that in your last few posts you are taking most of what I say as statements of fact when in fact they are anything but.

I am not an expert and in fact visit these forums to ask for advice/help from people far more qualified than myself. I am sorry for any misunderstanding.

Cheers

Paul