Michael Dorosh Posted January 31, 2003 Share Posted January 31, 2003 Can anyone point me to a source naming the regimental commanders of the PzGren Rgt GD from August 1944 onwards? All the official histories I've found in English don't go into any detail - as I pointed out to JonS in a recent email, German histories tend to be long on heroics, short on details of equipment or command slots... Also, if anyone can provide any info on the Panzerkorps Fusilier Regiment GD (not to be confused with the Panzerfusilier Regiment GD which was a divisional unit), including commanders, I would appreciate it. The Panzerkorps Fusilier Regiment was a corps level unit; I believe the Panzer Korps GD was supposed to be similar to the HG Panzerkorps discussed in Mark Gallear's thread, only GD actually managed to expand to corps size, by absorbing the Brandenburg Division and, as JasonC noted with respect to HG, spreading some vehicles around. [ January 31, 2003, 04:48 PM: Message edited by: Michael Dorosh ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon Posted February 1, 2003 Share Posted February 1, 2003 I am sure you know the unit's two volume history by Helmuth Spaeter, published by Federowicz? Some commanders are mentioned in text. A (very) quick search turned up a Major Schwarzrock who had "regimental command" on Oct 7th, 44 (page 406, 2. volume). I am sure others are mentioned, too. Martin 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Weiss Posted February 1, 2003 Share Posted February 1, 2003 Spreading them around apparently was precisely right. I'll give you what I have. I figure you probably already have this, but hope it helps. Excerts From: Panzer Grenadier Division Grossdeutschland, by Horst Scheibert, Squadron Signal Publications, 1977. PP-154 1- 1/1-11: "GD" Division and Korps staff "GD" - Involved in the formation of Pz. Korps "GD" - are transferred into the Willenburg area (south of the East Prussian border), as OKH reserves. "At the start of this last year of the war, the Korps staff "GD" under General of Panzer Troops von Sauken and the Korps troops of "GD" Division itself, are all in East Prussia, Pz. Gren. Div. "Brandenburg" under Gen. Maj. Schulte-Heuthaus is on the way to East Prussia, and the two "Fuhrer" brigades are fighting on the Western Front. "FBB" and "FGB" are also expanded to Panzer Divisions - more on paper than in fact - during the hurried, often extemporized reorganizations in early 1945. There is no time for adequate training or developing esprit-de-corps as a unit. The war burns with increasing intensity as the strengthened Allied powers press in on a weakened Germany, each day coming closer to the German homeland. Allied aircraft range the length and breadth of Europe - many sport exposed metal surfaces, for camouflage is no longer necessary. Panzer Korps "GD" and its related units are shifted from battle to battle. "Brandenburg" is separated from the rest of "GD" and never returns. Even the most dedicated units cannot hold against overwhelming enemy forces and the lack of Luftwaffe air support is another critical factor in the defeats to come. Lack of replacements and equipment, and the capitulation of many of their "Allies" leaves the Germans to fight alone. Past reputations don't count in the spring of 1945, and once-proud units - Army and SS alike- are reduced to quickly reformed, poorly equipped "gap-plugging" formations, often existing officially only on paper. Survivors of one actions regroup to form the next "unit" for the next desperate defensive action. Scattered groups of replacements augment the veterans but with no time for proper unit training, these groups are destroyed and in the end, they cannot even delay the inevitabled end of the war in Europe." PP-158 w/picture Commanding General of Pz. Korps "GD" General der Pz. Tr. Von Sauken Commanding General of Pz. Gren. Div. "Brandenburg", Generalmajor Schulte-Heuthaus PP-164 w/picture The Div. Kdr. of the Panzer-Grenadier-Division "Kurmark" Generalmajor Langkeit, formerly Kdr. Pz. Rgt. "GD". PP-168 w/picture Last consultation (Right, the Div. Kdr. "GD" Generalmajor Lorenz), at the steep coast at Kahlholz before crossing over to Pillau and onto the Frische peninsula. PP-172 w/picture The commanders of the Fuhrer-Divisions: Generalmajor Remer (FBD); Generalmajor Mader (FGD). [ January 31, 2003, 06:42 PM: Message edited by: Bruno Weiss ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbb Posted February 1, 2003 Share Posted February 1, 2003 Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: All the official histories I've found in English don't go into any detail - as I pointed out to JonS in a recent email, German histories tend to be long on heroics, short on details of equipment or command slots... I'm working on scenarios using the book "The History of Panzerregiment 'Grossdeutschland'" by Jung and have noticed the same thing. The author seems to mention the various regimental commanders only in passing, making it difficult to figure out who was in command at what time. Otherwise, the book is great -- lots of good scenario possibilities. CBB 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted February 1, 2003 Author Share Posted February 1, 2003 Thanks Bruno - I was actually looking for the regimental commanders; you've given the divisional ones. Thanks for the effort, though, it is appreciated. I was hoping someone might have access to texts I don't have - I do have the book by Jung that cbb mentions, as well as all three volumes of Spaeter, the new one by Novotny, the Squadron Signal book, the Vanguard book, the one by Spezzano and McGuirl, the pictorial by Spaeter and the one by Lucas. Unfortunately, no one was too interested in documenting the regimental commanders. Hmph, even. There is a big GD archive somewhere - I know that Omar Bartov researched using it - maybe someone in Deutschland knows more....? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbb Posted February 1, 2003 Share Posted February 1, 2003 Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: I do have the book by Jung that cbb mentions, as well as all three volumes of Spaeter, the new one by Novotny, the Squadron Signal book, the Vanguard book, the one by Spezzano and McGuirl, the pictorial by Spaeter and the one by Lucas. Unfortunately, no one was too interested in documenting the regimental commanders. Michael, do you recommend the Spaeter books? They are just about the only Fedorowicz publications that I do not own. I found a site that offers a discount if you buy all three and I was thinking about breaking out the credit card. CBB 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Weiss Posted February 1, 2003 Share Posted February 1, 2003 Well you can add "The German Order of Battle, 1944", nothing I could find in there. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted February 1, 2003 Author Share Posted February 1, 2003 Thanks again, Bruno. cbb - depends on what you are looking for. The style is similar to Jung's - very storybookish; short on dates, few maps showing where the placenames mentioned in the text actually are (though if you have the Squadron Signal book already, they redid some of the Spaeter maps in a more readable form, so it is a good companion), and absolutely NO INDEX. This is a big problem with Fedorowicz's translated histories AFAIK - and makes me wonder why I paid so much. Unfortunately, Spaeter is the only in-depth history (such as it is) in English. By 1942, there were so many elements of the Division that were engaged seperately or in different battle groups (six seperate infantry battalions, an armoured recon battalion, an engineer battalion, an anti-tank battalion, a StuG battalion, a FlaK battalion, and by summer 1943 there were three battalions of tanks (not counting the signals, artillery, MP, supply etc. units)). So there is a limit as to what Spaeter can do. Add in the several dozen Knight's Cross awardees, most of who have at least a paragraph or two devoted to them.... ...and then add in the Führer Begleit's history, the Führer Grenadier, the Brandenburg, the GD replacement units (inlcluding Mot. Battalion 1029), the Wach Battalion in Berlin (and the July Plot), the Panzerkorps units... You can see where it may be lean on detail. If you want an overview of the division in general, the history is very readable, but not written in the modern style (ie with footnotes). If you are looking for scenario fodder, you will get the most basic of ideas, but absolutely no kind of details on terrain or forces. And of course, as is common in most WW II histories, the enemy's side has not been researched the tiniest bit; no enemy units are identified below the Army level, generally speaking (not even to Division level), and of course not a single Russian soldier was interviewed or quoted in the book. The faceless untermenschen remain just that. It was written in a different era of historical research, so take it for what that is worth. If you are dying to know about the GD, it is almost the only ball game in town. If it is a passing interest to you, there are much better divisional histories out there featuring other units, that are written with much more detail. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viceroy Posted February 1, 2003 Share Posted February 1, 2003 Michael, I found something that might be useful to you in "Grossdeutshland" by M. Sharpe & Brian Davis, which has an old picture of your website in the reference section at the back The book is only 96 pages, but has some nice photo's, good TOE's and is generally a better intro to the Unit's history and organization than the Lucas book. Anyway, according to them from 3 Sept '44 to 18 Feb '45, the commander of Panzer-Fusilier-Regiment Grossdeutschland was Oberst Heinz von Brese-Winiary. The book is not so specific about the Panzergrenadier Regiment, but indicates that Oberst Lorenz was commander until June '44 and from July '44 Major Kriegk was in charge. How long Kriegk was CO is not shown in the book. Hope that helps a little. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted February 1, 2003 Author Share Posted February 1, 2003 Oops, forgot to mention that I have that one too. Yeah, kind of a shock to see my website there. Too bad I changed URLs in the meantime! Thanks for the info though... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted February 1, 2003 Share Posted February 1, 2003 MD I haven't been able to find anything past Lorenz either. I'll keep looking though. I had the same problem while designing a Bulge scenario trying to find commanders for the 26th VGD. Good luck. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.