Mustang Posted February 8, 2003 Share Posted February 8, 2003 Why do I never see dud rounds in combat mission? I know that a lot of german 88 shells ended up being duds. More than once, germans were killed when there potato mashers went off early. And sevral V-1's were found unexploded in britan becuase a certian cocking ring was installed backwards. Hmm... I seem to recall that Jewish forced labor was used to manufacture each of these weapons mentioned above... gee I wonder... But still... Is dud rounds modeled into the game and I am to stupid to see it? Or is it that it just isn't there? ****DISCLAIMER**** I in know way consider myself to be an expert in any matter discussed above. I have no extensive knowlage or collage degrees in European History, and all ideas and/or thoughts expressed above is made with the understanding that it is probably mostly wrong and incorrect. ****DISCLAIMER**** [ February 08, 2003, 10:50 AM: Message edited by: Mustang ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mud Posted February 8, 2003 Share Posted February 8, 2003 Not modeled. ISTR that, according to previous dicussion, that it wouldn't be unless research uncovered enough information to do it realistically -- for instance, for each and every type of round what percentage were duds, a value that might change with time and place due to manufacturing glitches. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus Posted February 10, 2003 Share Posted February 10, 2003 It could be worse... at least we're not using US navy torpedoes... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeeDog Posted February 10, 2003 Share Posted February 10, 2003 For most weapons, my guess is that the dud or hang fire rate was low enough that it's just not worth the trouble of modeling, however there might be cases where a certain type of ammunition during a specific time period was especially unreliable. As you mention, one does wonder about late-war German ammunition, what with many resources being in short supply and the labor base being rather... unreliable. As noted, though, the difficulty is coming up with enough reliable historical data on just how unreliable the ammunition was would be difficult. Weapons systems reliabilty issues could extend all the way down into small arms. For example, I have read accounts that in the winter of 1941, many German infantry units completely lacked supply of lighter-weight, winter grade machine oil for their automatic weapons. As a result, their MG34s (which apparently didn't do well in the cold anyway) and MP40s were basically useless. I've read anecdotal stories of infantry squads throwing their automatic weapons away as a result and fighting armed solely with bolt-action rifles. 'Twould be interesting to see such a thing modeled in the game. Once again, though, it would be difficult to come up with hard data as to the extent of the shortages, though. I like your disclaimer, btw. Cheers, YD 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gen. Longstreet Posted February 10, 2003 Share Posted February 10, 2003 Well, I've seen rounds go straight throug the tank and exploding on the ground under it, the tank wasn't even damaged. Designer flaw ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mustang Posted February 11, 2003 Author Share Posted February 11, 2003 Good points all. US navy torpedos? Lol, yeah, I heard about that. I remember a row a while back about snipers, (or assault boats?) and somebody wanted them to be equipped with armor and torpedos. But if they were those famous dud Magnetic detonating torpedoes, it would be a moot point, wouldn't it? You really have to consider all angles of a problem. (Like sailors draining alchohol out of the torpedo's firing mechinism, straining it through bread to make "torpedo juice.") And, YD, exellent point about the cold weather fighting. The Russkies always let the Russian winter defeat the enemy, so Perhaps modeling that in to the russian campains would be very important. Did I just hear a programmer groan? (Large solvac man stands up. Mustang instantly regrets using the term "Russskie".) ****DISCLAIMER**** THE ABOVE HUMOR IS SELF-DEPRICATING AND IS MEANT TO CONVEY A SENSE OF HARMLESSNES ON THE PART OF THE AUTHOR OF THIS POST. PLEASE DO NOT TAKE OFFENSE AT ANYTHING POSTED ABOVE. BTW, SEE DISCLAIMER IN FIRST POST AND CONSIDER AS WELL ****DISCLAIMER**** 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offtaskagain Posted February 11, 2003 Share Posted February 11, 2003 MGs do jam more in the cold and extreme heat in CMBB. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeeDog Posted February 11, 2003 Share Posted February 11, 2003 Originally posted by panzerwerfer42: MGs do jam more in the cold and extreme heat in CMBB. Yes, but the stories I was reading about were talking about German automatic weapons becoming *completely* non-functional in the extreme cold. Again, I don't know how often it happened (and therefore whether it's really worth modeling), but apparently the failure was due to a lack of lighter grade lubricating oil (yet another thing the General Staff forgot to supply, apparently). It's a situation much like putting summer grade motor oil into an auto engine in the dead of winter (which also happened to many German vehicles). Below a certain temperature, the oil completely loses it's lubricating properties, and the engine doesn't work *at all*. Similarly, without the winter grade oil, the action on the MG34s and MP40s would apparently just freeze shut - you couldn't even work the bolt to chamber a round, let alone fire the weapon. Again, this is all purely anecdotal, so take it with a grain of salt. Cheers, YD 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brightblade Posted February 12, 2003 Share Posted February 12, 2003 It´s true that there wasn´t a fitting machine oil for fire arms in extreme cold. That´s why German soldiers were told to boil their weapons in hot water, removing even the slightest bit of oil. The wear on the moving parts was higher that way of course, but considered acceptable as else the weapons couldn´t be used at all. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.