japinard Posted January 28, 2004 Share Posted January 28, 2004 In case you missed it we're talkin about countries and their tendancies of Axis vs. Allies. Very good discussion. http://www.battlefront.com/cgi-bin/bbs/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=18&t=003340&p=2#000044 However I'd like some infomration that states something like this (hisorically of course) Germany had thia many army units, air wings unit, Battlships, U-Boats etc. Netherlands had an Army Group I consisting of 2,000 troops. The USA had blah blah blah then ramping up production. I can use a database or refernece to really make this scenario come alive. Can somone point me in the right direction and give me some links? LIke army totals for all countries in 1939? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaka of Carthage Posted January 29, 2004 Share Posted January 29, 2004 Yes, I can tell you how to gather that information. My DSL at home isn't working, so I can't give you the info right away, since I can only send stuff thru the work computer. I assume all you really want, are enough numbers so you can build '39 Order of Battles for the major nations? I can give you, in a day or so, the number of divisions that each nation had in 1939. There are a couple of things you have to determine how to handle however... difference in relative combat power between the various divisions of different nations. neutral nations in SC, if you are gonna activate them or not. how to mesh the different to&e's into the generic units that SC uses. Those three should give you enough to start thinking about how to handle the problems. Lastly, if you wanted to purchase one book that has this information, I'll give you the name later on, since I can't remember it exactly now. (JerseyJohn or anyone else, you remember the name? Ellis something or other, Statistical survey something or other? The one that lists the economic numbers and military strengths of the majors pre and during WWII?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubert Cater Posted January 29, 2004 Share Posted January 29, 2004 Originally posted by Shaka of Carthage: Lastly, if you wanted to purchase one book that has this information, I'll give you the name later on, since I can't remember it exactly now. (JerseyJohn or anyone else, you remember the name? Ellis something or other, Statistical survey something or other? The one that lists the economic numbers and military strengths of the majors pre and during WWII?) I think the one you are talking about here is "World War II: A Statistical Survey" or "World War II: Databook" by John Ellis (they appear to be the same reference with two different names for some reason). Great book and in fact a primary source of reference for SC1. Hubert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaka of Carthage Posted January 30, 2004 Share Posted January 30, 2004 Thank you Mr H, that would be the book. There are some inaccuracies in the book, but "reading" it should give you an idea if you want to pursue this sort of thing. Most people don't want to bother with this level of detail. Ok, now to the number of divisions I promised you: NATION ...... 1939 ........ 1940 ...... 1941 Germany .......78............189.........235 (includes areas absorbed by Germany, but not nations allied to Germany) Hungary.........6.............7..........10 Romania.........11............28.........33 Bulgaria........12............14.........14 Italy...........66............73.........64 Finland.........14............17.........19 Poland..........43.............2..........2 Netherlands.....12 (3 were in NetherEastIndies) Belgium.........22 Yugo............34 France..........86............105 UK..............9..............34.........35 (remember, this is worldwide) Australia.......0..............7..........10 India...........3..............5..........10 New Zealand.....0..............1...........1 South Africa....0..............0...........3 Canada..........0..............1...........3 Russia.........194............200.........220 US...............8.............24..........39 Since the above is global, might as well include the rest. China......... estimate around 300 .......... Japan...........36.............36..........39 The above do not include divisions that were never intended for frontline combat. So security, training, inactive, coastal, garrison, etc divisions are not above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaka of Carthage Posted January 30, 2004 Share Posted January 30, 2004 Without bothering you with the details of how I calculated it, here are the results I came up with... Corp = four (4) divisions Army = eight (8) divisions Tank = four (4) divisions (should be mechanized or armor divisions) US, because of the liberal amounts of artillery and non-divisional support units, become Corp of 3, Army of 6. Should not have Tank units. Italians, because of lack of artillery and two regiment division, become Corp of 6, Army of 12, Tank of 6. Russian "Army" (post Barborossa), is a SC Corp. I don't remember if I manipulated the number of divisions in that unit. Russian "Shock" or "Guard" Armies should be a SC Army or Tank unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
japinard Posted January 31, 2004 Author Share Posted January 31, 2004 Thank you guys! My posts on this thread were crunched when the server went down. But I had asked if the book has lots of maps? I LOVE maps And if it's interesting reading, or just dry numbers? That might be a book I'd like to buy, but I see at Amazon.com it's $95! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubert Cater Posted January 31, 2004 Share Posted January 31, 2004 IIRC there are a few maps but it is mostly information listings, charts, data tables etc., but if you are lucky (like I was for SC1) you might be able to find it as a resource at your local library. Hubert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaka of Carthage Posted January 31, 2004 Share Posted January 31, 2004 I'd also suggest that you find a copy at the library before you decide to purchase it. This is not really a book that you "read". Its more of a reference. Also be aware, that Ellis is really a starting point for having a understanding of the topics other authors write about. For example, "The Ineffective Soldier: Lessons for Management and the Nation" by Greenberg, has three books about the US mismangement of its manpower. Really helps in understanding how the US had problems with combat soldiers for 90 divisions, while the Germans and Russians were cranking out hundereds of divisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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