Relevant in my opinion (but you decide)

[Les the Sarge 9-1b]

Hmmm, ok I KNOW this is an SC forum (that is plainly obvious to someone with eyes that function), but two things make this post relevant (in my opinion).

Ok thing one, its in regards to grand strategy gaming.

Thing two, a lot of comment has been made about Pacific versions therefore.......

I have to say.....just last night I played the board game Pacific Axis & Allies.

Yes I know, that is a board game, and SC is a computer game, and where is the connection.

Ok a lot of people here are commenting on realism this and realism that, playability this and playability that.

Then there is the "I want Pacific crowd".

Now it is important to state, that both the European as well as the Pacific Axis & Allies games are bloody great. They are also multiplayer capable, they are incredibly easy, and they play with no problems.

I will say that at 25 bucks, you will find it easier to get SC than the 65 dollar (Canadian, so you will have to get a US price independently), priced Pacific or European Axis & Allies games.

I know that is a hefty price tag, but hmmmm what can you do, it's knee deep in very nice miniatires and a great looking map (the miniatures are now nation specific too which is nice).

Yes they are board games, duh!! so you won't have any online capacity, but then again, when was the last time you enjoyed a face to face wargame without pulling teeth with non total wargamers eh?

I am still plugging for SC, but after seeing Pacific Axis & Allies, and I have also seen the other just not played it yet, I will have to say, that these two board games do it better.

Production, politics, inter nation strategy, warfare on air land and sea, it's all there.

The only downside to these games is just the price. And to me, its not a downside. (although I don't even want to think of the shipping costs to those Euro dudes that enjoy getting reamed at the border by their governments).

[Panzer Cmdr]

Yes, Axis & Allies is fun. Do you have the computer game? It is ok but I think it is pretty boring compared to SC. It is a bit to cut and dry; no terrain benifts, unit experience, HQ's (leaders) and the AI did not seem very good. It is just a bit too basic and the effects (die rolls and exploding pieces) did not wow me after the first day.

The board games are great but it can get hard to get people together to play, and then you got to worry about the cat jumping onto Europe and sending those Ruskies into the Atlantic. Especially for us married with young kids it is hard to find time to get a gameboard group together, you can play the computer game at night when the kids get their baths and go to bed.

With the more powerful computers and some new but simple rules I think a full scale SC-World War is doable. So what if you need a Pentium 4 or game graphics card to play. Us die hards would have to just upgrade. Hubert will have to find the line between what changes are doable and worthwhile (versus those that have no value added) or perhaps what changes can be made and then give players the options to put those changes in effect.

[iolo]

I think Les the Sarge is referring to the new theater-specific Axis and Allies board games:

Axis & Alliles: Europe

and

Axis & Allies: Pacific

They look like fun to me and I hope they port them to PC someday. But it certainly isn't 50km hexes

[Les the Sarge 9-1b]

Yep was definitely referring to the new ones.

The Computer A&A games first release was well a frickin dud to say the least. One of the most outrageous examples of totally worthless AI designs.

But the game in the Iron Blitz Edition version(while having an AI only marginally smarter), makes a superb online option.

True the game doesn't have quiiiiiite the penache of SC or for certain Advanced Third Reich, but it excels at what it does do, and that is deliver fast instant play value.

To be sure, me and my friends last night had an easy intro to the game, as we have played original A&A a zillion times, so we only needed to read how the Pacific version was new (and there are some really nice new things as well).

but I have trouble accepting that people will shy away from a game like this on the basis of not being able to find players, or cats (that should locked up during game time if need be).

Most of my gaming companions are married old farts with families and kids and jobs the whole deal eh. We MAKE the time available for what's important to us.

Hmm come to think of it, one of my buddies is a newly wed. His wife specifically wants him to have his time with the guys (she used to game in a rolegaming group with him).

Personally him being a newly wed, I think its odd he can tear himself away from her (she is damn cute). But they have known each other a couple of years anyway.

So in the final analysis, there just isn't any credible reason for not liking these two games based on simulation level or complexity for new players, or ability to attract others that might not have time to wargame a lot.

SC makes a good mid point game between Advanced Third Reich the ultimate experience, and Axis & Allies (the new versions) which are very user friendly (accept for that price tag).

To be very fair, even SC as it stands, is not my idea of a "complex" simulation. It is really just a more involved A&A when you get right down to it.