Curry Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 Hey all For those of you playing in the German Panzerliga league and in Kuni's world league are you mainly still using the 1:8 system in bidding? Or are you now using a different system? Just curious, We have many new players in the SC PBEM league. One new player told me he has several games going in various places and hasnt gotten any bonus MPP to play allies with. Shame on anyone to take advantage of a new player and not giving a new player points. I usually always give a healthy bonus to new players. So I was then thinking well maybe the bidding system has changed. Thanks for an answer in advance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poots Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 What does 1:8 mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curry Posted February 17, 2004 Author Share Posted February 17, 2004 Bidding on a 1:8 basis would mean that when you make the bid you are bidding to play the axis side and willing to give mpp points to the allies On a 1:8 basis it means you are willing to give the following if the bid is 100. 100 mpp points to the UK and 800 mpp points to the USSR so the allies start the game with those extra mpp points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonheart Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 The more used system is now 1:5:20 which means that allies get GBP 200 USA 1000 UDSSR 4000 on a bid of 200. Additionally some play with irak rule which means that irak stays neutral and can only attacked by allies if the first unit comes from the west when Barbarossa begins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Friendly Fire Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 Hey Dragon, with that system what are players typically settling on as far as bids? You mentioned 200, is that seen as approx balanced? FF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonheart Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 In my most recent games ag Zapp in the Winterstormtourney...i got axis with 215 and 200 points which represents quite a huge bid. So arround 200 is quite an adequate levl for two expierienced players. Others should use arround 150 lvl IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Ranger Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 Learning to play SC without a bid might be the best idea, without the handycap your forced to think and plan from the very begining. Of course its also best for the games to mirror (like PL) so new players can see the moves from both sides of the board. Bidding on any 'fair' system will work. 1-5-20 seams to be taking root for some of the 'top' players. I prefer using the Russian Readiness %, but that seriously distract from the air war so some will not like it. 1-8 is still a good standy. But if you think the games should be even; the 42 game is grand and fast paced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terif Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 The bid level depends on the experience level of both players. Axis gameplay in the original 1939 Fall Weiss has improved a lot compared to ancient times. Experienced players use the 1:20 (UK:Russia) or 1:5:20 (UK:USA:Russia) system in the meantime with a fair bid of ~ 200. UK should never get more than 400 mpp starting Bonus (better <300), otherwise they can and most probably will defeat Germany in France. Intermediate players still use the 1:8 or 1:10 system with also an average bid of around 200. New players still can and do use the original Fall Weiss without any bonus mpp. Of course if a more experienced one plays against a newer player, he should give the other one the appropriate bonus if he is fair and wants a good game - not only a slaughter . Especially in the Panzerliga this is not so much a problem, since a game is played in mirror modus and most players are newer players, i.e. same experience level. One complete PL game consists of 2 single games, one as Axis, the other one as Allies. Standard is to play it with the same bid level and therefore both sides agree to an appropiate one for both games. In veteran vs new player games bid level is asynchronous (higher bonus for the new player). But another good possibility is to play a more balanced Szenario than the original Fall Weiss. In my opinion the best balanced Szenario - for intermediate to expert players - at the moment is Amonas 1939 Fall Weiss Mod2 (can be downloaded at the PL homepage: http://www.panzerliga.de/dt/docs/szenarien/szenarien_sc_1.php Only required houserule: no allied declaration of war on Italy allowed (allies are very strong in the Med, so an invasion in Italy would be unfair). Axis will have a good start, but Allies can grow very powerful in the long run. There will be heavy fightings in the Med and around Spain that both sides can win. 1942/43 Allies usually have the chance to turn the tide with a strong Russia and USA (including higher research levels + IT Lv5). [ February 18, 2004, 07:03 AM: Message edited by: Terif ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curry Posted February 18, 2004 Author Share Posted February 18, 2004 Thanks for all the comments. Very helpful. I'm an intermediate player, and a bit ol fashioned so I still like the 1:8 or 1:10 system. But will have to try the new system. I like the fact that it gives the US a bit more influence in the game which would be a bit more historical. I like the mirror system best and I think it is fairest. That whatever you agree to both players play a game as axis and then allies. I think this is also best for newer players who need to learn both sides. Thanks again for the help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zappsweden Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 Originally posted by Dragonheart: Additionally some play with irak rule which means that irak stays neutral and can only attacked by allies if the first unit comes from the west when Barbarossa begins. The definition of Iraq-rule is : "Iraq may only be DOW by Allies and the first unit to enter Iraq must come from west (Vichy) or Southwest (Egypt)" So, that means Allies CAN attack iraq before Barbarossa too if they wanna try a Mediterranean strategy. Also, it means Germany can fight for Iraq if Allies are invading it. So, Egypt still is important in the Iraq-rule scenario because beware if Allies have units in Syria or eastern Egypt when Barbarossa begin, Russia can support the Iraq invasion after that first unit entered Iraq from west/southwest (neutralising the rule against entering Iraq). [ February 18, 2004, 09:07 AM: Message edited by: zappsweden ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zappsweden Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 The difference between bidding systems is that some of them benefit UK more and some of them make USA and/or Russia stronger. Playing with the 1:4, 1:6 or 1:8 systems, give UK more MPP than playing with 1:10, 1:20 or 1:5:20. When UK have too much starting MPP (300+) they become "UK - the Gambit Nation" because the help that was supposed to help the weak Allied mid-game and compensate for the huge Germany vs UK MPP gap once Germany get France, minors and neutrals will instead encourage hazardous sharp gaming that abruptly ends the game without Axis having a chance to win by their own. For example, the LC gambit is almost a guaranteed win if Allies suceed and have 300+ MPP as bonus. If Axis do not immediately roll lucky, they will never pass the river. Another example is the Spain Gambit. It was probably a product of the bigger and bigger bids for being Axis and the huge amount of UK MPP bonus. [ February 18, 2004, 09:50 AM: Message edited by: zappsweden ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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