Tank Hunters & Destroyers

[dunc]

Could someone please explain the differences between these two vehicles?

Also, what were they used for in real life?

Thanks.

[Gremlin]

Check out this thread: http://www.battlefront.com/discuss/Forum7/HTML/000422.html

The terms seemed to be used fairly loosely and interchangeably for German AFV's. The Jagdpanzer IV ("tank hunter," roughly) was also called a Sturmgeschütz ("assault gun"), for instance. The Jagdpanther was also known as a Panzerjäger, terms which both roughly mean "tank hunter." Off hand, I can't think of any German AFV that was literally called a "tank destroyer" ("Panzerzerstörer"). Not so for American ones like the M10.

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War is cruel and you cannot refine it. --Sherman

[This message has been edited by Gremlin (edited 01-01-2001).]

[dunc]

anyone else got an answer, becuase that didn't really answer my question.

[Gremlin]

See my edited post above and check that thread again The nomenclature doesn't mean as much as the specifics of the particular vehicle (turreted or not, armor thickness, gun type). Tank hunters/destroyers were typically turretless vehicles (with very limited hand-cranked gun traverse) mounting anti-tank guns. They were generally cheaper and easier to design and manufacture, sometimes using outdated tank chassis. They're somewhat like assault guns, but those had guns designed primarily for firing high explosive ammo at soft targets.

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War is cruel and you cannot refine it. --Sherman

[Sailor Malan]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by dunc:

Also, what were they used for in real life?

Thanks.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is a wide question. It depends on nationality and timeframe. The Germans (and the Russians to an extent) invented the tank destroyer as a mobile AT gun. The first one was the Panzerjaeger (sp?) 1 with the 47mm IIRC. Generally they were less armoured, heavier gunned vehicles than tanks, intended to take on tanks at long range. In order to fit the gun in, they generally didn't have turrets, so work best in fixed positions (but don't get the wrong idea - fixed doesn't mean 'never moves' - think lie in wait, fire a couple of shots, scoot out backwards, turn round, and head for the next postion). They evolved into the later JagdPanzers (IV, Panther etc) - which did a cross between the above role, and a substitute tank (cheaper to build with no turret). The assault gun (STuG) role got thoroughly mixed in with this as well, late model StuG are effectively TD's. The Germans relied on TD very heavily at the end of the war. The Russians actually went away from them late war, with their excellant JS11 etc, largely removing the need. for the SU85 etc.

Allied practice was rather diffent - the British did play with mounting the 2pdr on a truck but found this excessively vulnerable, after this, the only one I can think of was the Archer (a stop gap, 17pdr on a Valentine hull, fixed rearwards arc of fire. Accounts vary as to their use. But tactically, you would pretty much have to set up, take a couple of shots and then scoot!) Apart from this, the British hunted tanks with tanks (they did have a few lend lease M10, called Achilles). The main role of the Cruiser tank was to take on tanks (in fact most early ones couldn't fire HE!)

US had a quite different theory. Tanks (such as M4 series) did not hunt tanks (in theory) - tank destroyers did. They were generally lighter armoured, heavier guns, (as Ge), but with turrets. Main ones are M10, and M36. The only snag with this, is that Ge weren't fussy, and would shoot tanks without waiting for the TD to turn up! I think this is why the TD fell into disuse after the war. The modern Main Battle tank has the best gun and armour it can manage, and has a primary role of killimg other tanks. In a way it is the successor of the US TD idea (or the British Cruiser).

Hope this helps

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The conception of such a plan was impossible for a man of Montgomery's innate caution...In fact, Montgomery's decision to mount the operation ...[Market Garden] was as startling as it would have been for an elderly and saintly Bishop suddenly to decide to take up safe breaking and begin on the Bank of England. (R.W.Thompson, Montgomery the Field Marshall)

[Jarmo]

To make the explanation short&simple:

Both sides had vehicles whose main purpose was killing tanks.

Allies called these tank destroyers.

Germans called them tank hunters.

[This message has been edited by Jarmo (edited 01-01-2001).]