Guest Rollstoy Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Gunny Bunny, it is time for you to realize that Combat Mission (in its present form) would not benefit from a GeForce card in terms of lighting. Again the reasons: For vertex based lighting (as in "TnL") you need a high number of polygons to achieve smooth brightness fields and therefore, satisfying results. While they might be calculated automatically for the terrain, they would have to be created manually for all the vehicles, leading to a tremendous increase in modelling work and polygon load. Forget it. Bump Mapping makes sense only if you have a moving point light source close to a surface. And even then it can be done only for a few polyons per scene. Forget it. The GeForce card does not support the creation of shadows in any way. This is still an algorithmic problem. A big one! So forget it. So what is the point of advocating this card? It would not help anyway. Maybe I was impressed by the reflecting pool in the tech demo, but only until they showed that it consisted of thousands of triangles. Yeah, great. For one square pool of water. Simply forget it! Did you watch the cathedral demo movie? How many reflecting surface did they have? One tiny little pool in the whole cathedral! Does this tell you something? Did you watch the tree demo movie? Did you see any shadows on the ground? No? Me neither! So you have dozens of shaded leaves, damn impressive ... and absolutely irrelevant to any game! The only thing I can think of that would make sense would be to drop a dynamic light map on the terrain for any explosion or fire. But I do not know if this is technically possible. Regards, Thomm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Regardless of whether or not their special feature sets are or will be implemented in the CM series, from personal experience I'd highly recommend GeForce-chipset cards, unless you play a lot of older games that are optimized for the Glide API. Now that Nvidia is consistently moving from strength to strength (and the game industry is fully cognizant of that fact) and 3dfx is essentially moribund, those looking for a new card would do well to consider a GeForce-chipset card, imo. Disclaimer: I'm not associated with the graphics card industry, just opining ------------------ New to Combat Mission? Visit CM Boot Camp at Combat Missions for tips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karch Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Originally posted by aka_tom_w: Hi Karch "They use AGP graphics and can use system memory when it runs out of VRAM. A very slick trick." I thought ALL iMacs and all iBooks could do this trick. I play CM with all the new high res mods on a Tangerine iBook with only 8 megs of VRAM and it looks great. I think that all macs produced in the last year or two since the orignal iMac came out can do this little trick because they are VERY clever those Apple computer designers. -tom w Thanks Tom, I'm going to try out sme HR mods tonight! Scott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Originally posted by karch: Thanks Tom, I'm going to try out sme HR mods tonight! Scott Hi Karch Don't forget to configure Combat Mission to use as much ram as you have. Look under the apple menu for "About this Computer" (you must be in the finder to do this) and look at your RAM allocation. how much do you have available and how much is your system using. Then add 5 megs to how much the system using (my rough guess at what "should" be "free" spare ram) and then subtract 5megs plus the Ram the system is using (I'm running 9.1 and it is using 55 megs now) from your available on board RAM to determine what letft over for CM then get info on combat mission and crank up its memory allocation as high as you can by setting its memory usage higher than the "factory default" it comes with, which is generous to start with, (around 35 megs I think). The more ram you can allocate to Combat Mission that happier you will be. any comments from the other mac techs? -tom w [This message has been edited by aka_tom_w (edited 02-01-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisl Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Originally posted by aka_tom_w: any comments from the other mac techs? I always had 1.05 set to about 80MB, but forgot to do this for 1.1 and just noticed that it was set for about 43MB or so and it's been fine (though I haven't played any really big scenarios). I just increased it since I noticed. I use a PB G3/300 and it can actually run CM pretty reasonably in software rendering mode (I can only use HW rendering for 640x480), but then you don't get transparency effects (high quality smoke, transparent buildings, etc.) I normally use 640x480 so I can get the nice effects, but I get higher resolution (more detail on faces, vehicles etc) in SW render mode. ------------------ "If you can taste the difference between caviar on a cracker and ketchup on a Kit-Kat while blindfolded, you have not had enough aquavit to be ready for lutefisk." (stolen from some web page about lutefisk) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Germanboy Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Tom, when did you buy your Tangerine? Bought mine in May last year in Canuckland, and it has only 4MB VRAM. I always thought the only one with 8MB VRAM is the lime coloured iBook. ------------------ Andreas Der Kessel Home of „Die Sturmgruppe“; Scenario Design Group for Combat Mission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Heidman Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Originally posted by Germanboy: Tom, when did you buy your Tangerine? Bought mine in May last year in Canuckland, and it has only 4MB VRAM. I always thought the only one with 8MB VRAM is the lime coloured iBook. Jeez, if I want more RAM in a Mac I have to choose the right color???? Jeff Heidman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Originally posted by Germanboy: Tom, when did you buy your Tangerine? Bought mine in May last year in Canuckland, and it has only 4MB VRAM. I always thought the only one with 8MB VRAM is the lime coloured iBook. Good point Sorry it is my wife's, I play with my friends sometimes head to head on it. It was purchased some time last year shortly after they first came out. It is not in front of me now and you may be correct. It may only have 4 megs of VRAM but is looks as good as the G3 400mHz Power book that I'm on right now and I know the G3 has the full 8 megs of VRAM. That tangerine iBook is a quick little computer and it works great, plays CM with all the mods I STUFF it with no problem. I'll have to check, I could very well be VERY mistaken about the 8 megs of VRAM I "think" it has. But if it has 4 megs it works fine anyway. -tom w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karch Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Originally posted by Germanboy: Tom, when did you buy your Tangerine? Bought mine in May last year in Canuckland, and it has only 4MB VRAM. I always thought the only one with 8MB VRAM is the lime coloured iBook. I bought a indego iBook December 30th and it has 8M VRAM. At least all of the last round of iBooks, Indego, Lime and the DV Graphite and DV Lime all have 8Meg. Theses models have been out since MacWorld NY last July I think. Scott And I have 196M of ram in both my iBook and iMac. I give CM about 80M most of the time and have little problem with slowdowns on either. It is slower than my G4 at work, but that's to be expected. Any Mac users that can swin an Airport base station and card, DO IT. It is great sitting in the front room or kitchen or bedroom playing CM over IP on my laptop. Absolutely love it. Much more relaxed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karch Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Originally posted by aka_tom_w: I'll have to check, I could very well be VERY mistaken about the 8 megs of VRAM I "think" it has. But if it has 4 megs it works fine anyway. -tom w Run the Apple System Profiler. It should be in your Apple Menu unless you moved it. It will tell you about EVERYTHING hooked up to your Mac. Scott (btw, thanks everyone for the posts. I'm a Mac tech in charge of 30 Macs and about 10 Win boxes so if anyone has any Mac / PC networking questions please email me, I'd be happy to help) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Originally posted by karch: I bought a indego iBook December 30th and it has 8M VRAM. At least all of the last round of iBooks, Indego, Lime and the DV Graphite and DV Lime all have 8Meg. Theses models have been out since MacWorld NY last July I think. Scott And I have 196M of ram in both my iBook and iMac. I give CM about 80M most of the time and have little problem with slowdowns on either. It is slower than my G4 at work, but that's to be expected. Any Mac users that can swin an Airport base station and card, DO IT. It is great sitting in the front room or kitchen or bedroom playing CM over IP on my laptop. Absolutely love it. Much more relaxed. I was going to ask if anyone had played CM head to head over an Airport yet? what is the bandwidth your airport is connected to? I have a cable modem and I'm converned about commpatibilty? I understand the airport assigns DHCP IP's as it only needs one IP but mulitple computers can use it and network from it? Its good to hear TCP/IP on CM haed to head via an airport is no problem. -tom w [This message has been edited by aka_tom_w (edited 02-01-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 My take on the whole Mac world is I don't like to feed the pockets of the giants. What I'm saying is that for every thing you get/buy for a Mac is that you're feeding the pockets of Steve Jobs. However with PCs, yeah sure you're most likely to have to feed Bill Gates' pockets with your operating system, but I don't have to buy Microsoft video cards, memory, etc. Just like I like and use Netscape, I despise Microsoft Internet Explorer. I REFUSE TO FEED THE MONOPOLY!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 What Microsoft video cards and memory? ------------------ New to Combat Mission? Visit CM Boot Camp at Combat Missions for tips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Originally posted by Maximus: My take on the whole Mac world is I don't like to feed the pockets of the giants. What I'm saying is that for every thing you get/buy for a Mac is that you're feeding the pockets of Steve Jobs. However with PCs, yeah sure you're most likely to have to feed Bill Gates' pockets with your operating system, but I don't have to buy Microsoft video cards, memory, etc. Just like I like and use Netscape, I despise Microsoft Internet Explorer. I REFUSE TO FEED THE MONOPOLY!!! I can't think of amore progresive and user friendly monopoly than Apple to feed. I have NO beef with Steve Jobs. While he was at Pixar he brought us Toy Story! GREAT movie! Now we are feeding a monoploy that is bringing to us the Titanium G4 Powerbook which a work of Industrial design friggin' ART!! Sorry but I have no problem making Apple and Steve Jobs richer and more profitable. Thanks for the rant! -tom w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rune Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Must resist.....feeling weak...cannot resi... I use my computer near Ohare Airport, but not over it. I expect they have a lot of bandwidth, some of those jets get really wide. My next flight however, I will challenge the Captain of the plane to head to head play while over say....Clevelend. Will let you know... Rune Originally posted by aka_tom_w: I was going to ask if anyone had played CM head to head over an Airport yet? what is the bandwidth your airport is connected to? I have a cable modem and I'm converned about commpatibilty? I understand the airport assigns DHCP IP's as it only needs one IP but mulitple computers can use it and network from it? Its goof to here TCP/IP on CM haed to head via an airport is no problem. -tom w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Originally posted by rune: Must resist.....feeling weak...cannot resi... I use my computer near Ohare Airport, but not over it. I expect they have a lot of bandwidth, some of those jets get really wide. My next flight however, I will challenge the Captain of the plane to head to head play while over say....Clevelend. Will let you know... Rune Yes Rune, I'm chuckling -tom w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Weiss Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 I think Rollstoy is correct, and obviously knows more about the technical aspects of graphcis than I do, but I would agree with Gremlin also in that I don't think one can go wrong in upgrading to Nvidia. I run a Voodoo5, as Gremlin says I have some older Glide apps that run better than in D3D, but CM looks great on this card. An up to date Nvidia could only do better. Egads, I've run straight into a nest of Mac resistance forces. ------------------ "Gentlemen, you may be sure that of the three courses open to the enemy, he will always choose the fourth." -Field Marshal Count Helmuth von Moltke, (1848-1916) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Originally posted by Bruno Weiss: I think Rollstoy is correct, and obviously knows more about the technical aspects of graphcis than I do, but I would agree with Gremlin also in that I don't think one can go wrong in upgrading to Nvidia. I run a Voodoo5, as Gremlin says I have some older Glide apps that run better than in D3D, but CM looks great on this card. An up to date Nvidia could only do better. Egads, I've run straight into a nest of Mac resistance forces. We MAC resistence forces just naturally FLOCK enmasse to any thread that has the word "graphics" in its title. We can't help our selves. Now where's all that Eye Candy?????? -tom w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Germanboy Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Originally posted by Jeff Heidman: Jeez, if I want more RAM in a Mac I have to choose the right color???? Jeff Heidman Jeez, if I have a PC and want more VRAM, I have to buy a new video card? What kind of trolling is that Jeff? Don't like the fact that other people use Macs? Why not just keep it to yourself? FWIW, they are different models, mine is a pre August 2000, and there were some changes after that to specs. Of course that never happens with PCs. Why don't you go and look lovingly into Maximus eyes somewhere, you two would make a nice couple. ------------------ Andreas Der Kessel Home of „Die Sturmgruppe“; Scenario Design Group for Combat Mission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Madmatt Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Yes, please keep the Mac vs. PC element out of this thread or it will be closed, which after re-reading its contnet probably should have been done long ago. Madmatt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Germanboy Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Originally posted by Madmatt: Yes, please keep the Mac vs. PC element out of this thread or it will be closed, which after re-reading its contnet probably should have been done long ago. Madmatt Slacking off, are we? Or just run out of padlocks? ------------------ Andreas Der Kessel Home of „Die Sturmgruppe“; Scenario Design Group for Combat Mission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Weiss Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Well I'd have to say the padlocks are not really bleeding edge anyway. Their small and hard to see, and they don't click when locked. Furthermore, the technology is available now to show a 32 bit rendering of a cyper lock with shaded numbers and a lighted LED display rather than the old 16 bit key lock. Substandard really. ------------------ "Gentlemen, you may be sure that of the three courses open to the enemy, he will always choose the fourth." -Field Marshal Count Helmuth von Moltke, (1848-1916) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Germanboy Posted February 1, 2001 Share Posted February 1, 2001 Originally posted by Bruno Weiss: Well I'd have to say the padlocks are not really bleeding edge anyway. Their small and hard to see, and they don't click when locked. Furthermore, the technology is available now to show a 32 bit rendering of a cyper lock with shaded numbers and a lighted LED display rather than the old 16 bit key lock. Substandard really. Seen from that perspective, it is no wonder BTS is using them... Question is, how fast do these modern padlocks allow the key to turn? ------------------ Andreas Der Kessel Home of „Die Sturmgruppe“; Scenario Design Group for Combat Mission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunny Bunny Posted February 2, 2001 Author Share Posted February 2, 2001 Originally posted by Madmatt: Yes, please keep the Mac vs. PC element out of this thread or it will be closed, which after re-reading its contnet probably should have been done long ago. Madmatt Put your Death Ray gun away, the thread was doing fine until you threatened it. Regards, GB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin Posted February 2, 2001 Share Posted February 2, 2001 That won't win you brownie points, not that people should be looking for them Anyway, there are some serious, imo, issues being discussed here in an intelligent manner. No need to put an end to that just to stop those who don't choose to pursue the topic in the same manner. ------------------ New to Combat Mission? Visit CM Boot Camp at Combat Missions for tips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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