Commissar Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 I am wondering how the gun depression abilities on Soviet armor were. Modern Soviet tanks tend to have a pretty low profile which is great for taking advantage of terrain but crappy for hull down positions. Granted, WW2 Soviet armor is not as low profiled, but I am still curious what the values are and what that'll mean for hull down position ability in CM2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyrene Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 Gun depression before or after Prozac? Gyrene Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Username Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 Gun depression wont be modeled in CM2 either I believe. I had asked that it be abstracted into the new Hull Down command. The abstraction being the better the gun depression, the more likely HD status is reached. BTS never responded. Lewis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Posted July 27, 2001 Author Share Posted July 27, 2001 That's odd. Considering how much hull down positions are used, gun depression rates should be important in the modeling I would think. It could make a big difference in combat results or how one plays a particular force. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Weiss Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 I get depressed ever time I think about Soviet guns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dittohead Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 IIRC Soviet gun depression was the leading cause for the overconsumption of Vodka in the Soviet Union. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Username Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Commissar: That's odd. Considering how much hull down positions are used, gun depression rates should be important in the modeling I would think. It could make a big difference in combat results or how one plays a particular force.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Its a combination of gun depression and gun height. So a small tank like the PIII has a much greater chance than a large tank like the IS2 of gaining HD status on reverse slopes. Other intangibles are the drivers vision ports, height difference between tank commander, gunner and driver, crew experience, tranny low gear, intercom, etc. these could all be abstracted a little. lewis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpl Carrot Posted July 27, 2001 Share Posted July 27, 2001 IIRC BTS said that the reason gun depression was not modelled and will not be modelled until an engine rewrite, was the difficulties in getting the TacAI? to understand why it can see the target but not shoot it. Once again it is another 'nice' thing to have but hard to implement (probably). I'm sure BTS have it high on their "things that need improving" wish list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Username Posted July 28, 2001 Share Posted July 28, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Cpl Carrot: IIRC BTS said that the reason gun depression was not modelled and will not be modelled until an engine rewrite, was the difficulties in getting the TacAI? to understand why it can see the target but not shoot it. Once again it is another 'nice' thing to have but hard to implement (probably). I'm sure BTS have it high on their "things that need improving" wish list.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Modelling is one thing but I am talking about an abstraction. a good abstraction can capture the effects without the modelling. BTS care to comment? Lewis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpl Carrot Posted July 28, 2001 Share Posted July 28, 2001 Username I'm not sure I understand. Surely if you abstract something you still have to model it somehow. How did you think it could be abstracted to? Cpl Carrot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Username Posted July 29, 2001 Share Posted July 29, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Cpl Carrot: Username I'm not sure I understand. Surely if you abstract something you still have to model it somehow. How did you think it could be abstracted to? Cpl Carrot<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> To me, modeling would be if there was a parameter that was used in an equation if X tank can shoot down Y slope. An abstraction, is when you capture the heart of the effect. In this case giving soviet tanks some difficulty (if their depression is very limited) in reaching hull down. Theres also the gun depression issue of minimum range that this abstraction doesnt address. Lewis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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