kump Posted June 11, 2000 Share Posted June 11, 2000 Posting again after a couple more games. I'm convinced, CM is the best WWII wargame put on a computer yet. Looks like my SP games are going to finally get a well needed rest. Tanks are lovely, even more so in CM. Always signifying power and strength, many players fixate on them as being the best thing on the battle field, including myself. Its the vehicles that capture my imagination. Infantry seems to be something thrown in to support the vehicles in a secondary role, sometimes not being of much import at all, more times than not thrown in as an after thought. My goodness, has CM done something right here or what? CM's treatment of infantry is refreshing and to my surprise, quite exciting! My first few games saw me replaying the movies of the tank duels over and over, loving the effects and detail. But during a vicious fire fight between apposing infantry, I found myself totally captivated and surprised. Watching the HMGs and mortars suppress at range, deadly pockets of death where cross fires were carefully planned out, and artillery lousing up a well laid infantry attack really all sets the blood boiling. And the king of the battle field, the almighty tank? Still wonderful, but even it fears the infantry as well it should. Now my tanks feel very threatened without friendly infantry scouting ahead. WWII combined arms tactics has finally been captured in a computer wargame. If CM2 comes out for the Eastern Front, my wargaming dreams have been fully answered. ------------------ Garry Kump Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest aka PanzerLeader Posted June 11, 2000 Share Posted June 11, 2000 And another addict joins the board! Geesh, BTS must have really done something special here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Posted June 11, 2000 Share Posted June 11, 2000 kump, you are absolutely right! CM is the only wargame system that has captured the combined arms tactic as well as this. CM is actually more of a Infantry game than a Armor duel game like it tends to be in SP or Talonsoft's Campaign series. Without CM's infantry, the game would be over in a very short time. This is mainly due to the small scope of battles in CM, ie. Battalion sized-battles and smaller. 'Cause even in a battle the size of VoT, with only a total of 7 tanks total (with no % advantage) the game would only last a few turns until all the tanks got knocked out. The real joy of CM *is* the infantry fights. In fact, usually, if all your infantry gets chewed up, the game is basically over. 'Cause without infantry support the remaining tanks won't last long. I played a PBEM game several months ago, I still had two Shermans left, but very little infantry to do anything with. I surrendered. The enemy had plenty of infantry left so it was only a matter of time. This game teaches you that the tank isn't the "super-weapon" that everyone thinks it is. ------------------ "The greatest risk...is not taking one." [This message has been edited by Maximus (edited 06-11-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Notnowjohn Posted June 11, 2000 Share Posted June 11, 2000 The tank may be the king of the battlefield, but the infantry is surely the queen. Chess game anyone? NNJ..."F*** all that, we gotta get on with these!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Time Software Posted June 11, 2000 Share Posted June 11, 2000 Garry - thanks. Getting the balance correct between tanks and infantry was one of our major design goals. (Monty Burns voice on) Exxxxxxxcellent...(Monty Burns voice off) Combat Mission #1 costs $45. Then, once you're hooked, Combat Mission #2 costs $30,000. Just kidding! Charles [This message has been edited by Big Time Software (edited 06-11-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Germanboy Posted June 11, 2000 Share Posted June 11, 2000 Kump, welcome. I am sure you will enjoy this game. Personally, I am sure that the best bit of it is the infantry combat. I don't care for tanks, really. ------------------ Andreas The powers of accurate perception are often called cynicism by those who do not possess them. (forgot who said it) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kump Posted June 12, 2000 Author Share Posted June 12, 2000 Thanks for the replies. $30,000 for CM2? I better start saving now I have to admit I'm a tank person. I'm not buying CM for infantry combat, I'm enthralled with the armor. CM delivers in spades on this aspect as well. Those CM vehicles look awesome. But the CM infantry combat has captured my attention. Manuevering those "useless" two legged units around used to be of little reward, now in CM its a joy and pays off in big ways. Finally, I can now use and appreciate the unarmored variety. ------------------ Garry Kump Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Formerly Babra Posted June 12, 2000 Share Posted June 12, 2000 This thread raises the question for me: What sold you on CM? I have to admit that the tank rendering in CM was a big, big factor for me. Not the only factor, but if, say, the game was the same but the graphics were cheesy by comparison, I likely wouldn't have shelled out the dough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest *Captain Foobar* Posted June 12, 2000 Share Posted June 12, 2000 Note to self: when playing Kump in random scenarios, buy lots of AT-guns..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Germanboy Posted June 12, 2000 Share Posted June 12, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Formerly Babra: This thread raises the question for me: What sold you on CM? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> The first game against the AI with the Beta in November.. I knew there and then that I had to have this game, and that my PhD was in trouble. ------------------ Andreas The powers of accurate perception are often called cynicism by those who do not possess them. (forgot who said it) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pathfinder Posted June 12, 2000 Share Posted June 12, 2000 What sold da path on CM? having been a board wargamer wayback when and a Steel Panther fan....not to metion 24 years service in the US Army. In the National, Guard and Active service, this is the only game that gets the "feel" of the "real thing" IMHO.... ------------------ unca pathy will show ya the path, if only he could find it himself! [This message has been edited by pathfinder (edited 06-11-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freyland Posted June 12, 2000 Share Posted June 12, 2000 I do not even remember how I stumbled on the Alpha AAR. I remember wasting valuable Study time in the hospital reading each turn, laughing at Fionn's and Moon's more humorous descriptions, while holding my breath at the points of contention. I was so pissed that the last 10 turns wouldn't load. I had to know! That was enough for me. Any game with enough atmosphere in a turn-based setting to keep me on the edge of my seat is the game for me. I am playing 5 PBEM's today, and three of them are just heart-stoppers. Jonathan ------------------ You said wet shirt no break, not piss-shirt bend bars! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobC Posted June 12, 2000 Share Posted June 12, 2000 Infantry/combined arms may be king in the wooded/urban terrain of Western Europe, but the tank will dominate the battles in the desert (of North Africa) or the steppes of Russia. Will there be any North African scenarios in CM or CM2? RobC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kump Posted June 12, 2000 Author Share Posted June 12, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>This thread raises the question for me: What sold you on CM?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> The sound caught my ear. The beautiful graphics caught my eye. The game play caught my brain. Graphics made me take note, but its turning out to be the sum of all of CM's parts that is delivering what I have always wanted most in a wargame. PS: The real time nature turned me off initially, but I'm a convert. Okay, I admit it, I'm finding a system based on sequential turns to be a load of fun, sprinkled with a hefty dose of anxiety as one hits the "GO" button to discover if the last plotted movements lead to satisfying gains or all too often horrifying surprises. ------------------ Garry Kump Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jager 7 Posted June 12, 2000 Share Posted June 12, 2000 Years ago I envisioned a computer rendition of Advanced Squad Leader that would allow the player to concentrate on tactics and good gaming vice wading through the rules and counter rules to get it right on the board. A friend and I day-dreamed about the day that some talented soul would deliver a game with cool graphics and realistic playability that captured not only the feel and excitment of a good ASL game but the historical and topographical accuracy of the real thing. Steve and Charles have done it with CM. That day is finally here! (Ok...not quite yet..but perhaps next week) ------------------ When the situation is obscure....attack! CGen. Heinz Guderian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stenmur Posted June 12, 2000 Share Posted June 12, 2000 Just yesterday I watched a documentary on PBS about WWII. Specifically on German Tanks. It was very interesting to watch real footage of the tanks in battle and to hear the history. I am no expert on the subject but am very interested in it. Anyway, it mostly talked about how in the beginning of the war Germany's Tanks were technologically below that of the other european countries (due to the treaty of Marsi (sp)) also there numbers were well below Frances and Englands. It talked about the Panzer I thru Panzer VI. How at first even though the german tanks were not as good they still won due to there tactics. And how in such a short time the germans created some of if not the most deadly tanks. (Although they did copy a lot from the russians) ***Spoiler*** Anyway, it was quite interesting because I had just finished a game of VoT as the Germans. I was getting my butt kicked because I lost my anti tank guns early on and only took out one of there tanks. I was able to hold them off at the town but they pretty much had me when, the distinctive rumble came, closer and closer until I could almost smell the diesel there was my Panther. within 3 mins 4 of there tanks were scrap. I won the scenerio all due to that one tank. Now, without my infantry I could never have won but in combination, wow. It just shows that in combination and the right tactics, you can still win. As I watched the documentary, A lot of things they said, I had just experienced in the game. There are many reports of Allied shells bouncing right off the Panzer armor and many a time did I get that particular sound from the game. They did say that the Tank made up the core of the unit and the infantry was used as support. And that is exactly how I won. So to ask "Tanks or Infanty?" I'll take both Thank You. Stenmur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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