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Nabla

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Posts posted by Nabla

    Attention tournament lovers: Nabla system manual now available

    in Combat Mission: Barbarossa to Berlin

    Posted

    As a first impression I must say that I'm not too fond of the idea of a proportional split.

    Let's say we have a scenario with a nasty armor fight and a flag that's really difficult to keep, at least when the other party still has tanks available. Both parties try to maneuver so that they can knock each others tanks out. Now let's say that player A knocks player B's tank out, and that the score is now 15-5 for him.

    After this all the pressure on making the next move is on B, because the end result after proportional split will be 75-25 if he can't improve the situation. Let's say both parties now have a chance to commit to a fifty-fifty duel with tanks. If A wins the duel, the score will be 25-5. If B wins it, the score will be 15-15. This means that the final end results after split in these two cases would be 83-17 and 50-50, respectively. So A can only improve his score by 8 in that situation, while his score can drop by 25 points. For B the situation is the opposite. So I don't think A would be interested in anything like that, while B certainly would.

    So a scheme like this can cause heavily asymmetric risk seeking and risk avoiding behaviour in the players. To put it another way, very different types of play styles are rewarded by the scoring system for the two different sides.

    This is of course just one example. Have you seen any other discussions about this issue on the board?

    EDIT: I also have to admit that I would need the equation which gives the CM score (the one that includes flags and forces) before I can analyze this further. I just don't remember how the flags, destroyed forces and remaining forces affect the score. I haven't got the manual here (I'm not even sure whether the equation is in the manual), but I've seen it on the board and on some web pages. I'll try to find it, but in case you remember where it is could you please tell me.

    EDIT2: Ok, found it. Using this notation

    pa = total points of allied casualties (allies captured count double their casualty value)

    pg = total points of german casualties (germans captured cout double their casualty value)

    f = total value of flags

    fa = point value of flags controlled by allies

    fg = point value of flags controlled by germans

    a = allied score

    g = german score

    The formulas are

    </font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">

    ( pg + fa )

    a = ---------------

    ( pa + pg + f )

    ( pa + fg )

    g = ---------------

    (pa + pg + f )</pre>

    0

    Attention tournament lovers: Nabla system manual now available

    in Combat Mission: Barbarossa to Berlin

    Posted

    The Nabla system has become the de facto -standard in solving the non-trivial task of scheduling and scoring tournaments. The system generates schedules which are as optimal as possible, can handle unbalanced games, and also provides solutions to issues such as balancing the importance of different scenarios and determining the relative importance of big vs. small victories. The system itself consists of a set principles and an implementation of these principles in software.

    Due to the widespread use of the system we (i.e., I and Treeburst155) decided to write a manual describing the principles of the system and the use of the software. The manual can now be downloaded here. I suggest that you print the document rather than try to read it on screen.

    Have fun!

    Nabla & Treeburst155

    0

    Biltong's Campaign Rules - Cont.

    in Combat Mission Archive #4 (2002)

    Posted

    Originally posted by Biltong:

    The other factor is a degree of realism that no other CMBB play technique offers.

    In QB's, PBEM's and all designer scenarios you always have a “balanced” opponent, but that is near idiotic – on the East Front this hardly ever happened.

    "...no other CMBB play technique offers"? Bzzz! Wrong answer! :D See my signature.

    Anyway, it's a nice concept. Salute!

    0

    The "debate" about CMBB's Infantry Modeling

    in Combat Mission Archive #4 (2002)

    Posted

    Originally posted by JaegerMeister:

    Interesting debate this. I still have a problem with some of this infantry behaviour, particulary the 'panic and get shot to pieces/wiped out' mode.

    [snip]

    This isn't a statement about the actual issue, but I think that it might help a bit if people ended these messages with:

    I have the save file/video, which can be requested from me either on this forum or via email at address ...

    [ November 21, 2002, 08:09 AM: Message edited by: Nabla ]

    0

    The "debate" about CMBB's Infantry Modeling

    in Combat Mission Archive #4 (2002)

    Posted

    Originally posted by Battlefront.com:

    Nabla,

    </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />So if during the computation of the action phase the unit receives a strong negative stimulus, which makes it abandon its current order, it already has knowledge of what it was trying to do at that time.

    This is not what we call memory. Of course the system knows what it is doing now when it makes a new decision. The problem is that once the new decision is made there is no record of what it has done before that. So if a unit is Advancing under fire to a spot of woods, and the unit decides it needs to crawl, the system can easily switch it crawl and maintain its current location.</font>
    0

    The "debate" about CMBB's Infantry Modeling

    in Combat Mission Archive #4 (2002)

    Posted

    Originally posted by Battlefront.com:

    This and the above MG team example are direct results of units having no memory. It is not possible for a unit to remain wedded to something without seriously negative side effects.

    Here is how the TacAI works now...

    A unit goes bumbling along following the player's orders to the letter. It will continue to do so unless it receives some sort of negative stimulus bad enough to make the unit disregard the player's orders (this is a very complex decision making process and is highly situationally dependent).

    The unit is now instructed by the TacAI to perform some sort of evasive action, either controlled or in Panic. Let us say it is to go in Panic from open terrain to a patch of woods 20m to the left.

    The unit starts to go to the left, but a turn later receives enough fire that the TacAI decides the unit is in trouble. Depending on where the unit is, its condition, the nature/direction of the enemy fire, proximity to known enemy units, etc. the TacAI will make a decision about what to do. Often it will choose the same exact course of action already being embarked upon. However, it might not.

    The TacAI makes a new decision completely and utterly in ignorance of the decision/s that came before it. It has zero concept of what the TacAI previous ordered it to do, not to mention what the player originally intended. This means the TacAI has zero concept that the unit was moving towards that patch of woods, nor the reason for it. The TacAI always thinks in the NOW and never in the PAST or FUTURE. That is what I mean by it has no memory.

    [snip]

    No folks, until we can afford the computing time, RAM, and file space we can't allow a unit to have memory. And until a unit has memory, there isn't much we can do. Fortunately, the new engine will be written for hardware that can afford this overhead and so it is in the plan to introduce this sort of "smarts" into the TacAI.

    This would seem to me as a very good explanation of what people have seen.

    But regarding RAM and file space problems, isn't it still true that the system now already has some sort of short-term memory? Consider a unit which has been ordered, either by the TacAI or by the player, to advance to location X. Obviously during the computation of the action phase there is knowledge in the system (in memory, in PBEM file) that the unit is trying to advance to location X. Otherwise the action phase could not be computed, and the information could not be retained for the next round (for orders which are not completed during that turn).

    So if during the computation of the action phase the unit receives a strong negative stimulus, which makes it abandon its current order, it already has knowledge of what it was trying to do at that time.

    If my logic above has been correct, then the TacAI knows its current order when it chooses the evasive action. This first-order short-term memory could be used in making the decision.

    Well, maybe the main difference in the above is the definition of what memory is. smile.gif But let me continue.

    Let's say we add a very small amount of memory, say three bits for each unit, implementing a counter (0-7). This counter would contain the number of times the TacAI has taken evasive action since the last human order. It would be reset whenever the human would give an order to the unit.

    Together with knowledge of the last order, this counter could be used to implement the idea of "don't tend run around in circles when the sh*t hits the fan". The TacAI could be designed to retain its current order with an increasing probability when the counter is high. Or the direction of sneak or run could be computed as a weighted sum of current direction and suggested new direction, where the weight of the current direction would increase with the counter.

    Hack? Yes. Side effects? Well, if the counter would be high, and the unit would run into certain death, it would tend to underestimate the seriousness of the new threat. Unless the probability / weighting functions would also include a seriousness factor... Complex, definitely, but what wouldn't already be complex in this fantastic game? :D

    But the main point is that there is already some memory, and a teeny weeny bit of additional capacity might improve the situation. We've seen before that Charles is capable of doing small miracles. :D

    [ November 20, 2002, 05:51 AM: Message edited by: Nabla ]

    0

    1.1 Patch question

    in Combat Mission Archive #4 (2002)

    Posted

    I don't think the list above is the final, complete one. For example, the Finnish FO radio issue is not in that list. So let me borrow Matt's posts from this page.

    Have fun! smile.gif

    UNIT DATA CHANGES/FIXES/ADDITIONS:

    * Finns have some radio-equipped forward observers.

    * Slight corrections to armor ratings of captured Panther A, Panzer IIIJ, and T-34 M42.

    MODIFICATIONS:

    * Finnish 75mm AT gun is first available July 1943.

    * Troops imported into a quick battle have their ammunition replenished.

    * HQ units, when hiding, are slightly less likely to open fire on enemy units (i.e. "start" an ambush).

    * ATRs have some minimal capability against infantry.

    * Smoke from burning vehicles blocks LOS a bit more.

    * German Sd Kfz 7 Gun Tractor will not be misidentified as a fully-armored halftrack, or vice-versa.

    MODELS:

    * Lowered crewman in PSW 222.

    BUG FIXES:

    * If a TCP/IP game is saved during setup phase and reloaded as a PBEM, setup will not be skipped for the second player.

    * Romanian BA-10 shows the correct 'icon' side view.

    * Hiding units with covered arcs won't be triggered to stop hiding by a dead unit inside the covered arc.

    * Troops carrying molotovs or magnetic mines are not prohibited from using grenades against pillbox rear doors.

    * Ordnance and good-order units are less likely to be 'bumped' out of an area that becomes overcrowded.

    * Soviet pistols don't look like German pistols in the gun rack interface after loading a saved game.

    * Corrected a problem that caused pillboxes sometimes to cancel their covered arcs.

    * (French version) Exit-zone graphics are in French text.

    * (French version) The +/- editor buttons for setting the number of flags

    in a battle appear normally.

    [ November 19, 2002, 10:52 AM: Message edited by: Nabla ]

    0

    Ideas Wanted

    in Combat Mission Archive #4 (2002)

    Posted

    Originally posted by Michael Dorosh:

    Kilo India Alpha - if you are talking about actually doing some programming for someone with some ideas....I am working on some "campaign" rules that would be very much aided by someone with a knowledge of "C"

    What sort of software were you thinking about?
    0

    Finn wav's w/approximate translations

    in Combat Mission Archive #4 (2002)

    Posted

    Loistavaa! Excellent!

    Tässä samat fraasit järjestettynä aakkosten mukaan, mikä nopeuttanee listan käyttöä pelien aikana. And here's the same list, sorted alphabetically, which should speed up the use of the list during games.

    Olkaatten hyvät. You're welcome.

    MUUTOS: Linuxin sort sekoitti järjestyksen skandinaavisten merkkien osalta, korjasin. Kaikki mikä viittaa Suomeen ei sittenkään ole überiä.

    EDIT: Linux sort got confused with umlauts, fixed the problem. Everything related to Finland is not über after all.

    Aah, liekkejä! Ei! Argh, flames! No! 00041900.wav

    Aah, mä on tulessa! 00041903.wav

    Aah, mä on tulessa! Arg, I'm on fire! 00041902.wav

    Aijaijai, polttaa! Armoa! Argh, it burns! Mercy! 00041901.wav

    Ammukset vähissä! 00041504.wav

    Ammukset vähissä! Ammunition low! 00041501.wav

    Ampuja, pellit auki (basically) Gunner, fire at will! 00040003.wav

    Ampuja, tuhoa auto! Gunner, target enemy vehicle! Fire! 00040401.wav

    Ampuja, tuli vapaa Gunner, fire at will! 00040002.wav

    Ampuja, tulita vihollisen miehiä! 00040204.wav

    Ampuja, tulita vihollisen miehiä! Gunner, fire at enemy men! 00040203.wav

    Ampuja, tähtää autoon, tuhoa se! Gunner, target enemy vehicle! Fire! 00040400.wav

    Ampuja, tähtää noihin miehiin, tulta! Gunner, target those men! Fire! 00040200.wav

    Ampuja, tähtää tykkiin, tuhoa se 00040101.wav

    Ampuja, tähtää tykkiin, tuhoa se Gunner, target gun. Destroy it! 00040100.wav

    Ampuja, uudestaan! Gunner, again! 00041202.wav

    Ampuja, vihollisen miehiä, tulta! 00040202.wav

    Ampuja, vihollisen miehiä, tulta! Gunner, enemy men! Fire! 00040201.wav

    Ampuja, vihollisen vaunu, tulta! Gunner, enemy tank! Fire! 00040300.wav

    Ampuja, viholliskohde, tuhoa se 00040001.wav

    Ampuja, viholliskohde, tuhoa se Gunner, enemy target! Destroy it! 00040000.wav

    Anna kuteja! Give me ammo! 00041500.wav

    Antaa mennä nyt! Let's go now! 00044101.wav

    Antaa mennä! Let's go! 00044306.wav

    Antaa soitta! (essentially) Go get 'em, boys! 00043902.wav

    Antaudumme! We surrender! 00043006.wav

    Antautukaa! 00042903.wav

    Antautukaa! Surrender! 00042902.wav

    Aseet käteen ja taistelkaa! Weapons in hand and fight! 00042206.wav

    Asemiin! Nopeaan! Into positions, hurry up! 00043700.wav

    Auttakaa kaverit, sattuu! Help me buddies, it hurts! 00041804.wav

    Auttakaa! Help! 00041802.wav

    Auttakaa, helvetti! Muhun osu! Help me, damnit! I'm hit! 00041803.wav

    Ei, hyvä Jumala! No, good God! 00041805.wav

    Ei, mulla ei ole mun jalkaa! No, I haven't got my leg! 00041801.wav

    Ei, mä en pysty! No, I can't! 00042105.wav

    Ei, perkele! Mä lähen karkuun! Hell no, I'm outta here! 00042107.wav

    Ei, perkele, mie en pysty tähän! No, damnit, I can't do this! 00042100.wav

    En pysty! I can't! 00042104.wav

    Ensisidettä! First aid! 00041807.wav

    Eteenpäin! Eteenpäin, miehet! Forwards! Forwards, men! 00044103.wav

    Eteenpäin! Forwards! 00044100.wav

    Eteenpäin! Mars! 00044107.wav

    Eteenpäin! Mars! Forwards! 00044105.wav

    Hakkaa päälle! Go get 'em 00043500.wav

    Hakkaa päälle! Go get 'em! 00044004.wav

    Hakkaa päälle, Suomen poika! Go get 'em, Finland's boys! 00044005.wav

    Heikosti tehos'! Tulta vaan! Not much effect, just keep firing! 00041205.wav

    Heittimiä! Mortars! 00041705.wav

    Helvetin raukat! Bloody cowards! 00042207.wav

    Helvetin raukat! Bloody cowards! 00043503.wav

    Helvetti, vihollisen osasto, tuli sinne! Bllody hell, enemy troops, target and fire! 00040702.wav

    Helvettiin täältä! Let's get the hell out of here! 00042103.wav

    Heti maihin! Hit the ground, now! 00042004.wav

    Hienoo, hyvin ammuttu! Excellent, fine shooting! 00041004.wav

    Hitto vie, ammu vaan niin perkeleesti! Damnit, just shoot like hell! 00041201.wav

    Hitto, mie osasin! Bloody hell, I got it! 00041001.wav

    Hitto, ne tulee suoraan päin! Hell,they're coming straight at us! 00042109.wav

    Hitto, tulevat kohti! Hell,they're coming straight at us! 00042101.wav

    Huomio miehet, kuunnelkaa! Attention, men! Listen up! 00043300.wav

    Hypätkää kyydistä! Get out! 00043705.wav

    Hypätkää kyytiin! Get in! 00043601.wav

    Hypätkää kyytiin! Get in! 00043604.wav

    Hyökkäykseen! 00044002.wav

    Hyökkäykseen! Attack! 00044001.wav

    Hävittäjä, vihollinen! Fighter, enemy! 00042802.wav

    Ilmahälytys! Air alarm! 00042800.wav

    Ilmavaara! Air alarm! ("air danger!") 00042801.wav

    Jeesus Kristus, perkele! Jesus Christ, damnit! 00041800.wav

    Johan on perkele! Goddamnit! 00041206.wav

    Jumalaut', ne motittaa meidät! Goddamn, they're surrounding us! 00042106.wav

    Jumalauta, motissa ollaan! Damnit, we're surrounded! 00042108.wav

    Jumissa, perkele! Stuck, damnit! 00043100.wav

    Juoksevat, lähetään myöki! They're running, let's go too! 00042111.wav

    Kaikki mukaan! 00043606.wav

    Kaikki mukaan! Everybody in! 00043605.wav

    Kaikki ulos! 00043702.wav

    Kaikki ulos! Everyone out! 00043701.wav

    Katsokaa, tykki! Tulta sinne! Look, gun! Target and open fire. 00040601.wav

    Katsokaa, vihollinen! Look, the enemy! 00042309.wav

    Kiipeä sisään! Get in! 00043600.wav

    Kimppuun! Go get 'em 00043502.wav

    Kimppuut, pojjaat! Go get 'em, boys! 00043901.wav

    Kohde vihollisen vaunu! Ampuja, anna palaa! Target enemy tank! Gunner, fire! 00040301.wav

    Kohti vihollista! Towards the enemy! 00040502.wav

    Korjattu on! 00043201.wav

    Korjattu on! It's repaired! 00043200.wav

    Kranaatti! 00041601.wav

    Kranaatti! Grenade 00041600.wav

    Kranaattikeskitys! Mortar barrage! 00041704.wav

    Kuolema tulee! We're gonna die ("Death is coming") 00042110.wav

    Kuonot kii' ja silmät auki! Shut your mouths and open your eyes! 00043315.wav

    Kuunnelkaa tarkasti! Listen carefully! 00043309.wav

    Kuunnelkaa! Listen up! 00043308.wav

    Kyllä, herra kapteeni! Yes, captain! 00043307.wav

    Kyllä, herra kersantti! Yes, sergeant! 00043304.wav

    Kyllä, herra luutnantti! Yes, liutenant! 00043305.wav

    Kyllä, herra! Yes, sir! 00043301.wav

    Kädet ylös! 00042906.wav

    Kädet ylös! Ruki vehr! Hands up! ("ruki vehr" meaning the same in Russian) 00042905.wav

    Lapaan osui! 00041809.wav

    Lapaan osui! My shoulder's been hit! 00041806.wav

    Lataa! 00041301.wav

    Lataa! Load 00041300.wav

    Liikettä! 00044108.wav

    Liikettä, liikettä! 00044300.wav

    Liikettä, liikettä! 00044301.wav

    Liikettä, pojat! 00044303.wav

    Liikkeelle siitä! Move it! 00042205.wav

    Liikkeelle! 00044109.wav

    Liikkeelle! Move it! 00044106.wav

    Liikkeelle, miehet! 00044104.wav

    Liikkeelle, miehet! Move it, men! 00044102.wav

    Lipas on tyhjä! Magazine empty! 00041506.wav

    Maahan! Hit the ground! 00042003.wav

    Maastoutukaa! Take cover! 00042000.wav

    Maihin! 00042002.wav

    Maihin! 00042008.wav

    Maihin! Hit the ground! 00042005.wav

    Mars, mars! 00044302.wav

    Mars, mars! 00044307.wav

    Me antaudutaan! We surrender! 00043001.wav

    Me kuollaan tänne! We're gonna die here! 00042102.wav

    Me luovutetaan! We give up! 00043005.wav

    Meidän ammukset käy vähiin! Our ammunition is running low! 00041502.wav

    Miinoja! 00043403.wav

    Miinoja! Mines! 00043400.wav

    Minuun osui! I'm hit! 00041808.wav

    Mun ase on tyhjä! My weapon's empty! 00041505.wav

    Mun käsi! My arm! 00041813.wav

    Mä osuin siihen! I got it! 00041005.wav

    Nappiin osui! Kuoli! Bullseye! It died! 00041000.wav

    No niin, miehet. Lähdetään! All right, men! Let's move! 00043903.wav

    No nyt mennään! Here we go! 00043906.wav

    No, johan on perkele! Well, goddamnit! 00041207.wav

    Nouskaa kädet ylhäällä! Get up with your hands up! 00042904.wav

    Nyt juostaan, perkele! 00043905.wav

    Nyt juostaan, perkele! Let's ****ing run! 00043904.wav

    Nyt pitää olla tappamisen meininki! Now you have to be in the mood for killing! 00041200.wav

    Nyt ulos, liikettä! Get out! Move it! 00043704.wav

    Nyt ylös, jumalauta! Now get up, damn you! 00042204.wav

    Osu! Ammu uudestaan! A hit! Fire again! 00041204.wav

    Osu, perkele! A hit, bloody hell! 00041003.wav

    Osuma! A hit! 00041002.wav

    PST suoraan edessä, tulta! ATG straight ahead! Fire! 00040602.wav

    Palavat, perkeleet! They're burning, bastards! 00041100.wav

    Panoksia, saatana! Ammo, damnit! 00041503.wav

    Panssarintorjunta, ammu sinne! Anti-tank, target and fire! 00040603.wav

    Pelkurit, perkele! ****ing cowards! 00042200.wav

    Perkele! Jumissa! ****ing hell! We're stuck! 00043101.wav

    Perkele, pois täältä! Let's get the **** outta here! 00044201.wav

    Piiska! ATG! ("piiska" is a nickname for "pst-" or atg-guns) 00042500.wav

    Pistimet kiinne! Attach bayonets 00043501.wav

    Pitäkää asemanne! Hold your positions! 00043306.wav

    Pojat, maahan! Boys, hit the ground! 00042006.wav

    Porukka, naama turpeeseen! Guys, face to the ground! 00042007.wav

    Pudota se! Kädet ylös! 00042901.wav

    Pudota se! Kädet ylös! Drop it! Hands up! 00042900.wav

    Pysykää liikkessä! Eteenpäin! 00044305.wav

    Pysykää liikkessä, eteenpäin! Stay on the move, forwards! 00044304.wav

    Päälle vaan, perkele! Just ****ing get 'em, damnit! 00043900.wav

    Rynnäkköön! 00044007.wav

    Rynnäkköön! Assault! 00044006.wav

    Saakeli, tykkitulta! Oh ****, artillery! 00041701.wav

    Se jäi siihen! There it stays! 00041006.wav

    Se siitä! That's it then! 00043312.wav

    Seis, tuolla on vihollinen! Halt, enemies over there! 00043801.wav

    Seis, vihollinen edessä! Halt, enemy ahead! 00043800.wav

    Sekaan vaan! Let's get 'em! 00044000.wav

    Selvä on, kessu! 00043311.wav

    Selvä on, kessu! All right, sarge! 00043310.wav

    Siihen osu! 00041008.wav

    Siihen osu! Hit it! 00041007.wav

    Siinäs palat! There you burn! 00041103.wav

    Sil' palo perskarvat! His asshairs got burned! 00041102.wav

    Sillon liikkuu! Let's go! 00044308.wav

    Sisään siitä! Get in! 00043602.wav

    Suojaan! Take cover! 00042001.wav

    Säästäkää ammuksia! Save your ammunition! 00041404.wav

    Säästäkää pateja! Save your ammo! 00041403.wav

    Taakse, taakse! Fall back, fall back! 00044202.wav

    Tapelkaa, saatanan paskiaiset! Fight, you ****ing bastards! 00042202.wav

    Tappakaa ne, tuli vapaa! Kill them! Fire at will! 00040500.wav

    Tarvitaan lisää ammuksia! We need more ammunition! 00041507.wav

    Tervemenoa helvettiin! To hell with you! 00041101.wav

    Tulee kohti, piru vie! Incoming, bloody hell! 00041703.wav

    Tuli kohti pst-tykkiä! Direct fire at ATG gun! 00040604.wav

    Tuli seis! 00041401.wav

    Tuli seis! 00041406.wav

    Tuli seis! Tuli seis! 00041402.wav

    Tuli seis! Tuli seis! Hold fire! Hold fire! 00041400.wav

    Tuli seis, perkele! Hold your fire, damnit! 00041405.wav

    Tuli sinne! (essentially) Fire! 00040504.wav

    Tuli vapaa! Fire at will! 00040506.wav

    Tulta munille! (essentially) Fire at will! (implies aiming at the groin level) 00040507.wav

    Tulta! 00040505.wav

    Tulta! Fire! 00040503.wav

    Tuol' on vihulaisia! Enemies over there! 00042307.wav

    Tuolla ne menee, vihollinen! The enemy's moving there! 00042300.wav

    Tuolla on vihollisen miehiä! There's enemy men over there! 00042403.wav

    Tuolla, piiska! 00042502.wav

    Tuolla, piiska! There, ATG! 00042501.wav

    Tuolla, tuolla on viholaisen tankkeja! There, enemy tanks over there! 00042600.wav

    Tuolla, vihollisen kärry! (essentially) Enemy tank! 00042700.wav

    Tuolla, vihollisen miehiä! There, enemy men! 00042402.wav

    Tuolla, vihollisen panssarivaunu! Kimppuun, pojat! There, enemy tank! Attack, boys! 00040802.wav

    Tykistökeskitys! Artillery barrage! 00041700.wav

    Tykki, ammu! Gun, fire! 00040600.wav

    Tähtäys, tulta! Aim! Fire! 00040501.wav

    Tähtää ajoneuvoon! Tulta! Target vehicle! Fire! 00040902.wav

    Tähtää vihollisen panssariin! Target enemy tank! 00040806.wav

    Tää jämähti! This got stuck 'ere! 00043102.wav

    Täältä pesee, saatana! Come and get it, damnit! 00043504.wav

    Ulos ja heti! Out! Now! 00043703.wav

    Ulos, vauhdilla! Get out fast! 00043706.wav

    Varmistakaa sivustat! 00043314.wav

    Varmistakaa sivustat! Secure the flanks! 00043313.wav

    Varmistakaa tuo! Secure that! 00043316.wav

    Varokaa! Look out! 00042302.wav

    Varokaa, miinoja! Look out, mines! 00043402.wav

    Varokaa, täällä on miinotettu! Look out, minefield! 00043401.wav

    Varokaa, vihollisen ajoneuvo! 00042704.wav

    Varokaa, vihollisen ajoneuvo! Look out, enemy vehicle! 00042703.wav

    Varokaa, vihollisen vaunu! Look out, enemy tank! 00042604.wav

    Varovasti! Be careful! 00043302.wav

    Varovasti, varovasti! 00043303.wav

    Vaunu suoraan edessä, tulta! Tank straight ahead! Fire! 00040805.wav

    Vetäytykää! 00044203.wav

    Vetäytykää! Fall back! 00044200.wav

    Viel' on hengissä! Helvetti! It still lives! Damn it! 00041203.wav

    Vielä kerran, pojjaat! One more time, boys! 00044003.wav

    Viheltää! Incoming! (actually "whistling") 00041702.wav

    Vihollinen lähestyy! Enemies approaching! 00042304.wav

    Vihollinen näkyvissä! Enemy in sight! 00042306.wav

    Vihollinen! Tulta, perkele! Enemy! Fire, goddamnit! 00040508.wav

    Vihollisen PST. Enemy ATG! 00042503.wav

    Vihollisen ajoneuvoja edessä! Enemy vehicles ahead! 00042701.wav

    Vihollisen ajoneuvoja, edessä! 00042702.wav

    Vihollisen kulkuneuvo edessä, hyökätään! Enemy vehicle ahead, let's attack! 00040900.wav

    Vihollisen kärri suoraan edessä! Enemy vehicle straight ahead! 00040901.wav

    Vihollisen miehiä edessä! Enemy men straight ahead! 00042401.wav

    Vihollisen miehiä edessä, ampukaa pojat. Enemy men ahead, fire at will boys! 00040700.wav

    Vihollisen miehiä havaittu! Enemy men sighted! 00042400.wav

    Vihollisen miehiä, tulta munille! Enemy men ahead, fire at will boys! 00040701.wav

    Vihollisen panssari edessä! Enemy tank ahead! 00042603.wav

    Vihollisen panssari edessä! Enemy tank straight ahead! 00042305.wav

    Vihollisen panssari, tuhotkaa se! Enemy tank, destroy it! 00040800.wav

    Vihollisen tankki edessä! Enemy tank ahead! 00042605.wav

    Vihollisen tankki havaittu! Enemy tank sighted! 00042602.wav

    Vihollisen vaunu edessä, päälle! Enemy tank ahead, attack! 00040801.wav

    Vihollisia! Enemies! 00042301.wav

    Vihollista, edessä! Enemy, straight ahead (this one's a bit odd, or I misheard it) 00042303.wav

    Vihollistankki! Enemy tank! 00042607.wav

    Vihollisvaunu, tulta, tulta! 00040804.wav

    Vihollisvaunu, tulta, tulta! Enemy tank! Fire! Fire! 00040803.wav

    Vihulaisen tankki eessä! Enemy tank ahead! 00042606.wav

    Vihulaisia nähty! Enemies sighted! 00042308.wav

    Vihulaisten tankki! Enemy tank! 00042601.wav

    Ylös siitä, saatana! Get the **** up! 00042203.wav

    Äiti! 00041811.wav

    Äiti! 00041812.wav

    Äiti! Mommy! 00041810.wav

    Älkää ampuko! 00043002.wav

    Älkää ampuko! Don't shoot! 00043000.wav

    Älkää ampuko, tuli seis! Do not shoot, hold fire! 00041407.wav

    Älkää ampuko, älkää ampuko! 00043003.wav

    Älkää ampuko, älkää ampuko! 00043004.wav

    Älä jauha paskaa, ylös! Don't bull**** me, get up! 00042201.wav

    [ November 02, 2002, 09:55 AM: Message edited by: Nabla ]

    0

    ROW Vets: Deliberately Unbalanced Scenarios

    in Combat Mission Archive #4 (2002)

    Posted

    Originally posted by kunstler:

    I think unbalanced scenarios can be alot of fun, as you try to make the best of a bad situation.

    The only complicating factor for me is the orders you are given for the scenario.

    [snip]

    Second, tho, were my orders. I was supposed to take those cross roads, if I remember correctly. Now, if I was a real commander, could I just call off my attack and say to my superior, well, gee, there were, like, these big tanks there, so we decided not to.

    Can an officer actually decide this in real life? I don't know much about real military affairs, but I've read of commanders being chewed out for being insufficiently aggressive, getting sacked, whatever, for not attacking, even when it would be a botch.

    [snip]

    Ok, I'm nit picking here but that's what occurred to me. Moving right along . . .

    No, you're not nit picking at all, this is a very important aspect of (possibly) unbalanced scenarios, and yet another thing which complicates their design. I wrestled with this quite a bit when preparing the scenarios for Nordic Championships.

    What you've described above is the lack of fallback conditions (I hope this term makes sense in English). That is, for an unbalanced scenario to be credible, you have to have some statements which tell you what to do in case of an unbalance (surprise). An example was given by TB - "...unless you feel resistance is too heavy". Without statements like this you really don't know whether you are allowed to change your goal or not. In real life you'd have to contact your superiors, and you can't do that in CM (although I even thought about acting as the superior in the Nordic Championships, but abandoned that idea pretty quickly).

    Now in Nordic Championships all scenarios which I designed contained fallback conditions, even those that were not intended to be unbalanced. Why? Because if only truly unbalanced scenarios had fallback conditions, they'd spoil the surprise. Therefore, if my logic has been correct, in tournaments with unbalanced scenarios, all scenarios must have fallback conditions. I hope the B&T guys are listening... Well, I can motivate them by noting that fallback conditions are also a very neat way to save the ass of the designer in the case of an unintentional unbalance. :D We already saw a potential case like this above.

    There are different types of fallback conditions you can use. Right now I remember two distinct types which I've used. One is that mentioned above already - what to do if enemy forces are too strong. Another is flexibility w.r.t. the goals. For example, you can tell the player that he has flexibility in selecting the objectives (flags) he takes over, or enemy units he tries to destroy (hit and run -type of scenario). Hmm, maybe these are the two types. I'll have to think about this.

    Thanks for bringing up this important issue.

    [ October 30, 2002, 04:08 AM: Message edited by: Nabla ]

    0

    ROW Vets: Deliberately Unbalanced Scenarios

    in Combat Mission Archive #4 (2002)

    Posted

    Originally posted by Holien:

    Anyway, I think the approach being taken in trying for balance but leaving the door open for something special is absolutely fine.

    The games designed must above all be fun and interesting and provide a challange to skill and ability.

    Give players an interesting situation, which allows the players to make informed decisions (well as informed as possible) and the ability to use their skill in battle.

    Holien,

    The design of wildly unbalanced games is very difficult, especially because there are some features in the current game engine which fit balanced games perfectly, but complicate successful design of unbalanced games. In the Nordic Championships (and Nordic Wannabe) tournament I had to triple check the logic behind the more unbalanced scenarios. This is because in most real situations, you would be expected to take a hike if your forces are greatly inferior to those of your opponent.

    The current engine makes the situation worse because exit of a unit off the map can only be bad (normal scenarios) or good (exit conditions), never neutral. Therefore you can't leave it to the player to decide whether he should retreat from the map. This is a really big problem. I've tried to discuss this with BTS, but wasn't able to convince them to add a flag for neutral exit in scenarios. I'll try this again for the engine rewrite. However, I was able to convince them to not show the exit zone to the opponent. This helps things a bit.

    (BTW, could someone confirm that in the final version the exit zones are no longer visible to the opponent. I still haven't got the final version - my first copy disappeared, and a repost is on its way.)

    [ October 29, 2002, 05:56 AM: Message edited by: Nabla ]

    0

    ROW Vets: Deliberately Unbalanced Scenarios

    in Combat Mission Archive #4 (2002)

    Posted

    Hello everyone!

    The initial motivation for the development of the scoring system was to add another level of suspense into the game. I love the game, even with balanced scenarios, but I felt that knowing that you faced a balanced situation made it a bit boring. You knew too much about what to expect. Especially after knocking out a couple of really important enemy assets, you knew that you could rule the battlefield.

    With (possibly) unbalanced scenarios this is not the case. First of all, you can have a lot of those 60-40 games, where the balance is "slightly" (difficult to define) in favor of one side. Therefore, at the beginning of a game the default can be that the situation is unbalanced. Second, if you know that there is a real chance that the scenario designers have made an extremely unbalanced game, you have to be constantly on your toes. There's a real chance that you might be hit by a ton of bricks, at any point in a scenario.

    It is also true that the scoring system facilitates the work of scenario designers. No longer do they have to worship the god of balance, which in a tournament would strike upon them with fury in the form of feedback whenever balance had not been achieved. And hopefully this can be experienced by the players by having more and better scenarios, because time can be invested in other things than achieving a perfect balance. This is of course a very nice thing.

    However, after some recent discussions with TB155 I was a bit worried that the initial motivation, my mission :D , might be lost in the process. This is why I urged TB155 to start a discussion with the B&T team about how the suspense would be retained.

    The solution is here:

    Originally posted by Treeburst155:

    From this small sampling of ROW vets it appears that most like things the way they are now, with no EXTREMELY unbalanced scenarios. The problem is, players may begin to take for granted that the scenarios will not be way out of balance. I'm going to throw in some uncertainty. :D

    Boots & Tracks have my blessing if they decide to throw in a WILDLY unbalanced scenario in any future tourney. This fact will be added to the tourney manual for ROW III.

    [snip]

    This way you guys will never really know what you're up against. Nothing can be taken for granted. Chances are that any given scenario will be reasonably balanced in the interest of fun for both players; BUT, you can never be sure. Your company may be assaulting a dug in battalion someday.

    This is basically all that is needed at this point. The B&T team do not have to state any probabilities, the don't even have to reply to TB155's message. All that is needed is that the players know there is a real chance of a lopsided scenario.

    There is one more detail. Now the suspense is there, but to keep the threat real, every once in a while that ton of bricks, or half a ton, has to be dropped. This can not be avoided.

    I'm sure you'll have some nail-biting tournaments in the near future. ;)

    [ October 29, 2002, 03:53 AM: Message edited by: Nabla ]

    0

    Cost of units need revision

    in Combat Mission Archive #4 (2002)

    Posted

    Originally posted by JimF:

    Perhaps BigTime could make available a tool that would allow the player(s) to modify these costs, with a default button that would return all values to those shipped with the game.

    Jim,

    I think that this post would fit nicely into a current thread whose name is The longest wait.

    Just kidding, just kidding... ;)

    0

    The Great (but not über) Finnish Thread II

    in Combat Mission Archive #4 (2002)

    Posted

    Originally posted by Battlefront.com:

    Keke,

    </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Aren´t the scale of CM just right for specialized destruction teams anyway?

    Yes, and this is what the tank destruction teams are supposed to represent. I remember something about why there are no satchel charge teams in CMBB for the Finns, but I can't remember why. I will ask Charles about it but do not expect an answser soon (he is away for a while).</font>
    0

    feature request for the rewritte, feel free to post your request here too ;)

    in Combat Mission Archive #4 (2002)

    Posted

    Originally posted by Schoerner:

    ...and it works quite well.

    Mm... This reminds me of a game where my opponent was attacking, and drove around my defense area with a recon vehicle (the gamey sob ;) ).

    Anyway, at one point I noticed that I could use this situation to my advantage. I had a Tiger near his probable route - I hid it, and gave it an ambush order away from the estimated route of the recon vehicle. The recon vehicle drove happily just behind the Tiger, and didn't see it.

    Later on the Tiger was quite a nice surprise asset... smile.gif

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