maxm2

Thanks for reminding me about the hex difference. As for "how many shots does it take...", lots, apparently. In CN, no matter what the range, it sure does seem like once a tank and another tank or gun have spotted each other, one or the other will be dead within a few shots. In SPW2, there are lots and lots of missed shots, and when they hit, maybe definitive damage and maybe not. It has certainly meant developing a whole new style of armor deployment for me. And hey, cool tag line, OBG!

Actually, one point I tried to make above was that it's probably impossible not to get into political issues or historical issues with current social issue overtones, because we're talking about (in at least some cases) issues that people decided to kill each other over. When those issues still echo today, I think it's almost impossible not to stray into social/political territory in some discussions. So I don't think you did anything, Zamo, that many of us haven't done. It's just so enticing to "set the record straight!" One question, though: pardon my ignorance, but what's VoT?

Can't let that Zamo's comment stand, but won't add any more to this now off-topic discussion. I know a lot about the ACW and don't agree, Zamo. Although I agree with you about how people perceived what they were fighting for, in terms of root causes, would there have been a Civil War if there had been no slavery and no slavery issue in terms of new states coming in slave or free, etc.? I don't think so. I can't imagine you would either.

Interesting how it's difficult to avoid political issues when discussing war and games about it. You'd think that war had something to do with politics! (Altho, I thought I addressed several war game type issues about the use of the CM engine to make an ACW game)

Concerning the War to Protect the Right to Own Slaves Masquerading as a States Rights War (heh-heh): As a long-time American Civil War gamer (anyone else here part of the ACW Club?--wonderful gaming/role-playing club for people playing the Battleground series of Talon ACW games), I've thought about using the CM approach to the ACW, but I'm not sure how much fun it would be. The big battles had tens of thousands of troops and hundreds of arty pieces. The small battles...well, they don't sound very dramatic from the descriptions. Remember, we're talking about "get in a line and fire as fast as you can at the other line" type infantry tactics, except for the cav, so there isn't a lot of need to swing your "camera" around behind a unit of 50, 100, 500 troops to enjoy the "quick action" that follows when they're spotted by an enemy unit of 50 to 1000 troops. Small unit tactics simply weren't used much except in special cases. Having said all that arguable stuff, I would still love to have a 3D Gettysburg or Antietam battlefield with most of the troops represented. And right after I get my 20gighz processor and 1 gig video card computer, I'm going to buy that game..... : )

I already asked this of my gaming pal Mark Ezra (who plays both games) but wondered about any other opinions: In re-learning Steel Panthers: World at War (SP from here on) I was struck with the much lower accuracy and kill rate of SP armor compared to CM. Shots by stationary tanks at other stationary tanks five or six hexes away come up with odds of hitting in the range of 5 or 6% sometimes,and never seem to go above 25 or 30% unless the firing tank is sitting stock still and has been for at least a turn or two, and the target tank is similarly unmoving. I have even moved a tank up to an enemy tank on an adjacent hex and gotten a 3 or 4% chance of hitting a tank I've approached from behind! Even if I've got the mechanics of SP wrong, the flow of the battle is MUCH different from CM...in CM all my shaky-sighted SP tanks would be dead within a few shots of sighting each other! And I assume we have all had the experience of a StuG and a Sherman spotting each other in the CE scenario on the beta demo and knowing that one or the other might be dead depending on who gets their shot off first! ------------------ Max Molinaro [This message has been edited by maxm2 (edited 05-15-2000).]

Yes, sad to say, so many employees' productivity has tanked since the Gold Demo came out that employers of wargame enthusiasts in the US have filed a class action suit in Federal District Court naming BTS as acting "In restraint of work..." and asking for 20 million dollars in damages or at least a CD of the Gold Demo and the first copy of game. And if you believe the above, I have some bridges and fabulous chain letter opportunities to sell you..... : ) Guess I have to get back to work now.....

I was just about to post the same thing...please, please--especially now that it's all so new and misty--DON'T REVEAL INFORMATION ABOUT AI FORCES PLACEMENT WITHOUT A "SPOILER" HEADING!! I hope we don't have to have this little chat again....

I'd second all of the above. Just seeing the hills that look like hills was sooo nice. And I remember "you are there" with Walter Cronkite intoning: "It is the year 2000; the Combat Mission Gold Demo is about to come out. Suddenly hundreds of monkeys begin clicking on "refresh," bringing the once-mighty BTS server to its knees and----YOU ARE THERE!"

THIS is what I waited all this time for....THIS is the Gold Demo?????? I thought it was going to DEMOnstrate how to turn base metals into GOLD. Sh*t. Imagine my disappointment.... Guess I'll just have to settle for a wonderful game. : ) --Max

I don't believe I've ever actually seen a monkey click on "refresh" ("reload" for those of us with the wisdom to use Communicator instead of IE5, also known as "virus point of entry".... Now, I have seen certain primates hit F5, and sometimes F9....and they definitely hit each other sometimes. Is there a program for repeating "reload?" If so, that's a really bad idea......

Can anyone tell me why the--thing--the older gent is carrying in the POTD featuring "grandpa" is so awful, graphically (no shading, jaggies out the wazoo, looks like a construction paper cutout), and the wheels on the truck in the previous day's POTD are hexagons (or sexagons), for God's sake, which must make for a very bumpy ride?? Compare grandpa's uniform with his, uh, weapon. One looks good, the other is a bad cartoon. And I know CM's artists can draw circles--I've seen them. Whuzzatanyway, huh? Polygon count?

Just wanted to address Iggi's concern about Laura not wearing any pants: they were torn off when she entered the hedge.....

Trooper is right...the site is a scream!

Johan, I was going to suggest the FAE route also (air-burst fuel vapor), but Mark IV (that's not Lincoln Continental Mark IV, its it?) beat me to it. My second suggestion, slightly more expensive, is a tactical nuclear device in the 5 to 10 kiloton range, which should be available at any Home Arms Depot (if you have those in SA). I like the 5 to 10K range delivered as an air burst because you get minimal fallout (neighbors sometimes fuss about that) while you get optimum vaporization of pets and livestock. Good for headaches, too. Now finish that turn, for golly-gosh sakes and stop paying attention to secondary issues! --Max

I also feel strongly about this issue in favor of regular updates, and here's why: 1. It is not useful to say that you shouldn't provide updates because some people won't be satisfied with any update you give them. Some people won't be satisfied with anything you do. You have to make decisions on some basis other than whether everyone is satisfied. So that's not a telling argument. If some people don't want to read updates, fine, don't read them. 2. My guess is that there are many of us out here who enjoy seeing how a game progresses, what elements are worked on, about how long it takes to do stuff (I have learned something interesting from every update Steve has posted), and who feel better about the developers (they care enough to keep us informed) and the wait because of the updates. I also suspect that there are many silent members who may be happy to get updates, especially new people who come to the discussion board and are not going to peruse hundreds of recent posts to try to figure out what stage things are at. 3. As for the argument that taking the five mintes it probably takes to post an update, Steve can tell us if it's too much time and if it vitally damages the progress of CM. You think he would be giving updates if it set back his release schedule significantly? (that's a rhetorical question--my answer is: I don't think so) Updates are one of those things a game producing organization can do which take almost no time and which create much good will and public relations among (I would guess, despite the vociferous opponents) for the company. Most game organizations don't do half the stuff BTS has done--things which improve the product for me before I ever even see the finished work. I think continued regular updates (two weeks sounds good to me) about whatever is happening, even if it's trivial to some, is real cheap good PR. If we had a poll, I think the majority of potential customers who see the updates appreciate them. Please continue this, Steve. ------------------ Max Molinaro

Yes, in fact if anyone LOOKED at the last MM pic....it will basically make no sense if you haven't played or don't know about the game Half Life. The non-CM figures are all from the game, and for those in the know, you can spot a retinal scanner next to the door. Lastly, as a translation service, the sign over the door reads: "Black Mesa Materials Laboratory." Honest. You can look it up at the best English-German and German-English dictionary on the net I've found: http://www.quickdic.de/e_dic.html Don't ask me why someone decided to call it "Quickdic" : ) (no, I don't know the ubb stuff and don't have time!!) --Max

I wanna see a unit "ambushing a foxhole." (quote from review) My understanding is that the AI sometimes enables the foxhole to detect the ambush and avoid it. : )

Can we submit Klingon faces, given that they have already been used in the beta? What about Ferenghi (spelling?)? How about Alfred E. Neuman? ( I want to see him as tank commander...wait a minute, that gives me an idea!)

See, there are still lots of interesting things to talk about (hahahahahaha). Seriously, only the CM discussion board could be called "talked out" when there are 300 new posts on I don't know how many threads within two weeks!!!

Excellent idea! Actually, I was thinking of putting together a whole bunch of graphic stuff for people like CoolColJ to put into some kind of textures files (which I actually don't know how to do). Something else for my spare time....

Chaplain: I drank lots of water and am now spending 'way too much time in the 50th floor mens room at the World Trade Center (see above post) and can hear the converging troops getting closer. Isn't there another way to beat CM Absence Disorder (C-MAD)?

Bullethead, you're not a well man either, but that's very funny! How about one of the World Trade Center buildings with all the Germans at the top and all the Allies at the bottom. First side to take and hold the 50th floor men's room wins. The elevators work...until someone's engineers cut the cables (wanna take a chance and stuff all your heavy MG's into an elevator right off the bat?)

That's right...and once you play the Germans in Chance Encounter, my latest picture on the TGN CM site will make more sense than ever...

Panzerschreck asks: "WTF?" which, as we all know, means: "What's The Finest?", the answer in this case being: "Max's Way Cool Variants!!!!"