aka_tom_w

what was the flag worth? minor or Major? Did either player have to exit vehicles? Did your opponent start out with less units than you? Was the flag contested at the end your did it show your colours? The posession of the flag can be somewhat irrelevant if it was only worth 100 pts and you took 300 points worth of your OWN losses to to only 200 points worth of your opponents losses that you inflicted (flag = 100 - 300 losses = 200 losses which is = (Draw) to the 200 losses you inflicted.) oh and since we are on the subject of points you must inflict MORE than 1.25 to 1 losses for it NOT to be a Draw Its all about points right? Points for flags held and point for his units destroyed and your units destroyed. The rule book says less than or equal to 1.25 to 1 is a Draw less than or equal to 1.75 to 1 for a minor victory so the minor victory you want is for points that are *1.26 to 1 up to *1.75 to 1 Just a theory? -tom w [ 05-11-2001: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ] [ 05-11-2001: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ] [ 05-11-2001: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Simon Fox: Geez Franko, you're a lawyer and someone just called you a "sorry sadistic person", a "basterd" and an "assh*le" (like the asterisk there). So, what's new? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> OK now THATS funny ! -tom w

I have said this before and I still beleive it. It is EASIER to win with the Germans. And it is harder to win with the Allies. Understanding how to use the Allied units effectively is more difficult than buying VG SMG infantry and BIG German tanks. Sure there are advantages and disadvantages to either side, but I suspect most inexperienced players find it easier to defeat the Allied AI with the Germans than to defeat the German AI while playing the Allies. just my two cents worth -tom w

Bump These additional optional rules have been proposed and discussed in the CAL e-mail list: Here is what we have for Mechanized and Infantry games. Any other thoughts or additions? 1) Infantry (No vehicles) Select Infantry force in CMBO. "Towed guns will be limited to no more then 3 per side up to 1000 points spent. 1 gun per 1000 points spent thereafter. (Example 2,000-point game up to 4 guns allowed per side, 5,000-point game up to 7 guns per side). This includes all guns from the support category of CMBO. (Artillery caliber limitations may be imposed by player agreement prior to game setup). 2) Mechanized (No Tanks) Select Mechanized force in CMBO. Towed guns will be limited to no more then 3 per side up to 1000 points spent. 1 gun per 1000 points spent thereafter. (Example 2,000-point game up to 4 guns allowed per side, 5,000-point game up to 7 guns per side). This includes all guns from the "support" category of CMBO. The Attacking player and both players in Meeting Engagements will purchase halftracks or trucks capable of towing each gun purchased. (This makes the increased costs of guns something to consider and sometimes will add the missing Halftracks back into the force mix). Jeeps and Kulbewagon type vehicles will not count towards this total. (Artillery caliber limitations may be imposed by player agreement prior to game setup). Guns Rule Applies to ALL battle Types Below "Towed guns will be limited to no more then 3 per side up to 1000 points spent. 1 gun per 1000 points spent thereafter. (Example 2,000-point game up to 4 guns allowed per side, 5,000-point game up to 7 guns per side). This includes all guns from the “support” category of CMBO. The Attacking player and both players in Meeting Engagements will purchase halftracks or trucks capable of towing each gun purchased. (This makes the increased costs of guns something to consider and sometimes will add the missing Halftracks back into the force mix). Jeeps and Kulbewagon type vehicles will not count towards this total." 2) Mechanized (No Tanks) "SAME rules as Recon Rules ONLY no Tanks just pick Mechanized force in CMBO and then there is no option to buy any tanks, ALL the same rules as recon forces apply." 3)Recon. Rule. "The 'Recon Rule' game allows vehicles, including light tanks, to be included but limited to those with maximum 50mm guns. The Germans can field Pumas.Halftracks, mortar carriers and flame-thrower vehicles are all allowed, but not flame-thrower tanks. 60mm, 75mm and 81mm mortars and FO’s are all allowed, 81mm being the maximum. There is no limit to the size of towed guns permitted." 4)Short-75. (as per posted rules at http://tournamenthouse.com/CM/CAL/THCAL.shtml) 5)Panther-76 (as per posted rules at http://tournamenthouse.com/CM/CAL/THCAL.shtml) 6)Heavy Armor. (as per posted rules at http://tournamenthouse.com/CM/CAL/THCAL.shtml) I completely agree with Abbott when he wants to keep it simple. If you select an Infantry battle in the "type" selection in CMBO you can have arty, guns and infantry and thats all. So I would suggest the rules for an infantry battle state that: Towed guns will be limited to no more then 3 per side up to 1000 points spent. 1 gun per 1000 points spent thereafter. (Example 2,000-point game up to 4 guns allowed per side, 5,000-point game up to 7 guns per side). This includes all guns from the “support” category of CMBO. No vehicles are permitted for either side in an infantry battle as defined by CMBO. With Notes and Additions from Abbott AGAIN these are proposals to balance out the playing field. These rule suggestions do not exactly address the issue of airbourne units that have no vehilces, and there are some suggested "loopholes" like the fact that the Germans can have 75 mm HT and Armoured cars in the Mechanized rules and the Allies only have the 37 mm Grey hound and the 40 mm Dailmer AC but can only use on such vehicle because they are different nationalities. (Oh well) Still we are all working at Trying to make the CAL a great ladder to compete in so both players have a sense of fairness and cheery picking unit selection is not a SURE bet to win ladder games while using "the system". Hope this helps -tom w (Just a side note, I have only played one CAL ladder game so far, in it Abbott destroyed my defending German force in Recon Rules, BUT I'LL BE BACK!) [ 05-09-2001: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

just a friendly bump

Maybe I'm crazy and or a Lousy General, (or both) but I figure that I will need one platoon on each flank and one Platoon up the middle. (if I only get a company) I always like to keep the sqauds in communication with their leader but I rarely have the platoons cover each other instead I use an HMG or a vehicle or a tank. I see infantry in this game as screens to be send up front so my vechiles and tanks don't get whacked by pesky anti tank teams. Maybe I play the game wrong, but I largely use platoons of infantry to clear the way for the advance of the vehicles which support the forward advance of the infantry. But I always keep the squads very close together in front of their leader. -tom w

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by yobobo@TH: Wow! Ok, what are we talking about here lol. Something that will pick the game params, or all the units for us? The idea originally was to have params like weather, map type, points, side to be played, terrain, date, rules if any(shot 75 etc.), meeting, attack..., and so on to be picked and logged for the player A and B randomly. Then they would have to play it out. Are we now talking about actually making a TH puter pick thingy with rarity factors in place? Oh mama!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Oh? Perhaps like some other folks here I thought this random battle generator was desireable because if two players agreed to "short 75" then they could play random forces and your th-random pick genrator would pick the units, BUT that has a problem because it relies on BOTH players to honestly select in CMBO the forces they were asigned by the CAL random unit picker. I thouhgt what we were cheering about was the possiblilty to have a random selection of units that would be fair for both sides because it could be dedicated by Fionn's Rule set for the CAL? BUT that does sound like a GREAT deal of codeing work. oh well -tom

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mike the bike: Whatever CM is, it is most certainly NOT a STRATEGY game! nothing at Bn or lower level even remotely qualifies as strategy!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> OK crazy as this might sound I thought it was a TACTIC strategy game same as Tactics II was a tactical strategy game. Is Chess not a Game of Strategy? How about that Silly game Stratego? I thought that was a strategy game. What about Star Craft is that not a strategy game? just curious? -tom w

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by yobobo@TH: You will be able to buy your own units with this. But it will set the guidelines for the battle. A few optional dropdown fields for players that do not like playing in snow, or at night. Point size(small, med. large). Also rule set if any. It would print out randomly side you will play, year, weather, map type, forces, anything we want. Can also join it to the logger we have now.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> OK! Cool Are you working on it? It sounds PERFECT for the CAL? is that correct? good luck it sounds like hard codeing work but it WILL be cool if you do it right thanks! -tom w

this sounds like a GREAT idea but is sounds like alot of work and I'm not really sure how it is all that much different than using a computer pick in CMBO. BUT it does sound like a very welcome idea. -tom w

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Skipper: To dismount a gun, it takes a minute or even two (!) in CM. Modern russian army has the following exercise: tow starts 50 m away from the firing position; tow gets to the firing position, makes an U-turn and stops; the gun's crew disembarks from tow, dismounts the gun, loads, aims and fires. To pass the exercise, the crew had to hit the target within 45 seconds.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> one factor might be that crack or veteran crews do this better and faster AND like everything else in CM those soldiers are in considered to be in a COMBAT situation and not a training drill and could be being fired at. JUST about EVERYTHING in CM is slower and sort of less "tight" or accurate or timely to simulate the fog of war and vagaries of combat and doing anything in a combat zone. I think Steve and Charles have done a GREAT job in this respect with CMBO! -tom w

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by panzerwerfer42: I know this has probably been discussed but does BTS plan on making German guns more accurate at long range for CM2? Ive seen in several books that veteran panther crews claimed a 90%hit rate out to 1000m. I also know Nashorns had kills at 4.5 km.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> oh man oh man DON'T get me started!! :eek: ! has it been discussed? Like you would not believe and the answer to your question is a VERY disgruntled NO, "allegedly" superior german gunner optics are NOT modeled. But the game has been tweaked to allow for pretty GOOD long range accuracy for guns for both sides. the gunnery accuracy in CMBO now is VERY very good, it feels "REAL" and no one is really complaining about accuracy anymore, like they/ we used to. -tom w

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Bazooka Joe: Im new to this game and i was wondering if there was a mod or TC that would allow you to play this in real time instead of turn based?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> no not really, actually no not at all because due to the VERY accurate combat resolution that takes place during the "crunch" the game will not run in real time, this is not and RTS and never will be BUT the timer on the TCP/IP will give you a rush if you want to play under time constraint -tom w

you're welcome -tom w

I really don't like to be negative but I like to play fast, 3-5 minutes per turn on the timer, and I like to play other folks with cable or DSL modems (I have a cable modem) and I have never played more than one game per evening sitting and most games I play in TCP/IP end up being finished and somtimes started in e-mail anyway so where would you draw the line? I'm sorry I can be supportive of multiple ladders for tcp/ip and ladder play. -tom w

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mike the bike: A question about the rules on the web page - vehicles are listed with a couple of values beside them - one is clearly the main armament calibre - what's the other? eg M5A1 Stuart 37/884 (what's the 884?) M4A3(75)w+ 75/619 (what's the 619?) M4 75/619 (ditto) M4A1(76)w 76/793 (what's the 793?)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I believe that is 884 meters per sec as the velocity of the round fired. (i.e. for the M5A1 Stuart 37/884 that 37mm velocity 884 m/sec) I think... -tom w

I know this idea/suggestion has not been posted up in this thread for very long, but I'm wondering if anyone else here had any comments on Wreck's idea of changing the three gun limit to as many guns as you want as long as you have something that CAN tow them, to tow them with, when you buy them? Does anyone else have any other comments and or suggestions regarding the loss of FOW when it can be known that there is a maximum of only 3 guns (or more depending on the size of the battle)? my opinion on this one is that the original rule that says a TRUCK or a Half Track must be purchased for every gun is a good rule and with that caveat you can buy as many guns as you want. I am supportive of ALL that Abbott has done to get this CAL ladder off the ground and look forward to the opportunity to actually WIn a game or two on the ladder without getting destroyed by Abbott's great tactics -tom w [ 05-03-2001: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

Good work Abbot thanks -tom w

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by rexford: "Rexford" is Lorrin Bird, and the rest of "we" is Robert Livingston. Numbered Collector Edition autographed copies will be reserved for those with the most responses to my posts, and a special suprise bonus for those who repeatedly posted similar messages. We expect to charge about $25 postpaid for the book, in U.S. funds. Thanks for nice comments.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> count me In I know the book does not real with "superior German gunnery optics" but I'm keen to have a copy anyway. I suspect it will come in handy about the same time the CM2 is shipping ! -tom w

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Wreck: Now I had 5 M8s to his two PzIVs. He knew where one gun of mine was. So he very cautiously worked forward to try to take on some of my infantry. But I knew he had no guns left. I ran my two M8s from the hill on the right all the way around to his rear, where his guns had been. His tanks were encircled. They died. He gave up. I would not have tried to pull that sort of maneuver, except that I knew there were no guns in his rear. That's gamey. (As it turned out, I could have killed his tanks from the front, since I won the first duel there before my encircling maneuver was complete; but that was by no means guaranteed.) I would suggest that given the "must buy gun transports" rule, we do not need the gun-limits rule. And in fact that rule is at least sometimes gameable.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I have been coresponding with Abbott about the optional rules for the CAL. So I would like to post here in supporting his efforts to get the CAL up and running so we can have a ladder to play in that is larely free of gmaey unit selection and powergamers. BUT, we should probably try to propose some ammendment to the 3 gun rule, because as Wreck points out after the third gun is KO'd that player KNOWS there are no more guns. I think that is an issue and it should be addressed. THe Rules are new and Abbott really wants to keep the "core" rules simple, so 3 was chosen as a "hard" limit, unfortunately that effects the fog of war because you can very effectively predict the maximum number of guns your opponent has. I hope a satisfactory resolutuion can be agreed upon. Wreck does make a good point. for the record if you are checking the Cal results Abbott destroyed me last night in a TCP/IP match, he had the Americans attacking in a Probe and won a Major victory and killed so many of my units he forced and early end to the game by making my side autosurrender because my morale was so low. In case you have never played Abbott let me tell you he plays VERY well, but he did get VERY lucky last night with more than his fair share of first shot KO's on my vehicles. I'm sure we can all find some GOOD core rules for the CAL that will have the intented effect to limit gamey unit selection and power gamers using the system. -tom w

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Cubbies Phan: Hmmm, he starts a thread and then bugs out. Do I smell a coward, or is it just past his bedtime? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Why Mr Cubbies Phan I'm flattered! no one HAS ever quoted me in their signature line before! -tom w

but but.... with only ONE eurowarrior in the ring what is there to actually see? Where is the pomp the ceromony the spectacle? I want my money back!!! -tom w

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Abbott: In effect, two sets of rules are needed. One set defines explicitly the parameters for a CAL game, and the other set contains some optional rules that are used subject to agreement by both players. A newcomer would then be advised to stick to the standard rules until (s)he accumulates enough experience to judge the effect of using optional rules- Robert -------------------- Exactly! The Suggestions/Optional Rules section is undergoing a refit over the next couple of weeks. All players are welcome to share their ideas abbott@tournamenthouse.com Currently there are discussions underway via e-mail. I will add players to the discussions as they notify me.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> That sounds good Firstly a definition of what exactly defines a CAL ladder game and then some other optional rules sounds great. I think those options should include the Mechanized force vs another Mech force and infantry vs infantry battles as well. I think there is a growing consensus here of how this thing should ideally work. The CAL ladder is underway and there are games being won and lost and registered every day now, so find an opponent and start PLAYING !! -tom w [ 05-02-2001: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

Tanks in WWII would not stand a chance against these stats look a the specs for the Javelin: Total weight 22.3 kg Missile Weight 11.8 kg Length 1.08 m Diameter 126 mm Range 2,000 m Seeker imaging infra-red, CMT, 64 x 64 staring focal plane array, 8 - 12 micron Guidance lock-on before launch, automatic self-guidance Warhead tandem shaped charge Propulsion 2-stage solid propellant Command Launch Unit Weight 6.4 kg Day sight magnification x 4 Night sight magnification x 4, x 9

I have been having alot of fun lately with Mechanized battles against the AI. Will the CAL recgonize a Mech battle? Its like the Recon rules only there are NO tanks of any kind and with the Germans fielding the Puma and the Allies with the Greyhound and the Daimler is it a pretty even match up. I would like to challenge another CAL player to a Mech battle Meeting engagement, 2000 points on a large map, tree cover: light, modest hills in Sept 44. unit selection can only be from the Mechanized selections which means no tanks and up to 800 points worth of vehciles, troop quality will be high, which means you can select Vet Crack or elite units. I would like to take the Allies. The germans can field anything in their vehicle list but no tanks, same for the Allies. Is that a CAL Ladder match? Anyone? (I prefer TCP/IP btw) -tom w