Oddity

[womble]

Mssrs Stoex and Womble,

Thank you, gentlemen, for taking the time to put me straight on what is actually going on in the game with my troops when they are hiding. I am obliged, particularly as I am in the middle of setting up for my first defensive PBEM - I could have gone very wrong without your corrections.

You're entirely welcome!

I think it bears remembering that "Hide" is for special and specific situations and that the current incarnation of the TacAI is meant to have troopers seek concealment by default, so you don't have to tell them to hide if you want them to remain unseen, except in specific circumstances, so setting up an Ambush often doesn't require the 'Hide' order, though it can make extra sure nobody gives the game away before time if you've got the opportunity to manually unhide them at spring-time.

[StellarRat]

I always tell my FOs to hide once they find a good OP. They don't get killed nearly as often.

[womble]

I always tell my FOs to hide once they find a good OP. They don't get killed nearly as often.

How often do their strikes land on target though? If they're hiding they won't be very effective at spotting the fall of shot... You can hide them from (after?) the turn the call the mission to the turn they start spotting, but if you leave their spotting 'rating' gimped by having their faces mostly in the dirt, it's been said (by Steve himself, I believe) that the mission spotting phase won't be very successful.

[Michael Emrys]

100m is a long way. It'd have to be quite quiet to hear a normal person (without voice training) shouting that far away. Hearing footfalls or equipment clinks is out of the question for most people in most conditions at that range or even half of it.

Here I must demur. When I lived in the country, I could easily hear shouted comments half a mile away. Even now, living in a semi-urban environment I can easily hear them 100 m away. Footfalls and equipment rattle are a bit trickier. Depending on how careful the men were about avoiding noise, they could indeed be very quiet, but we are talking about elite troops here, Commandos or the SAS, and not your run of the mill Wehrmacht. Average troops of WW II are going to be making at least a modest amount of noise as they move about. Walking through tall grass your shoes and trousers are going to make a swishing noise no matter how hard you are trying to avoid it. Walking on gravel makes a crunching noise. Dry leaves and twigs put up a racket. So do hobnail boots on hard surfaces. And the more men that are doing the moving, the greater the volume. All of those sounds can be heard 20-50 m away. Under ideal conditions, even farther.

That said, everything depends on the level of general background noise. If it is still and quiet, then any noise stands out and will carry a goodly distance. On the other hand, if a pitched battle is going on anywhere within, say, 10 km, it is going to be harder to pick out the kinds of sounds we are talking about.

I kind of doubt that the game makes those kinds of fine distinctions at its present state. I expect something along those lines could be coded in, if it was thought worth the trouble. With that thought I will leave the matter for now.

Michael

[Childress]

For what it's worth, the LOS from hiding soldiers behind low walls is 30m. Just checked.

[womble]

Here I must demur. When I lived in the country, I could easily hear shouted comments half a mile away.

In the country where it's, well, quiet.

Even now, living in a semi-urban environment I can easily hear them 100 m away.

Again, so can I when it's quiet. These little brick canyons echo quite well. Go to one end of a shopping street on a busy saturday afternoon and try and be heard at the other... As you say, it depends on ambient sound levels.

Footfalls and equipment rattle are a bit trickier. Depending on how careful the men were about avoiding noise, they could indeed be very quiet, but we are talking about elite troops here, Commandos or the SAS, and not your run of the mill Wehrmacht. Average troops of WW II are going to be making at least a modest amount of noise as they move about. Walking through tall grass your shoes and trousers are going to make a swishing noise no matter how hard you are trying to avoid it. Walking on gravel makes a crunching noise. Dry leaves and twigs put up a racket. So do hobnail boots on hard surfaces. And the more men that are doing the moving, the greater the volume. All of those sounds can be heard 20-50 m away. Under ideal conditions, even farther.

All this is true, in a quiet field. If there's a firefight going on anywhere within a mile, it'll drown out ambient unless the listener is trained too... Your breathing sounds are magnified to your own ears when you're wearing a helmet, for example. I'd put the upper limit of noticing an approaching soldier at about 20m by sound alone if there's any other noise about.

That said, everything depends on the level of general background noise. If it is still and quiet, then any noise stands out and will carry a goodly distance. On the other hand, if a pitched battle is going on anywhere within, say, 10 km, it is going to be harder to pick out the kinds of sounds we are talking about.

Exactamundo.

Any of the veterans that sometimes knock about have any insight to offer on how far away you'd hear someone in a battlefield situation, say no gunfire within 50m or so?

I kind of doubt that the game makes those kinds of fine distinctions at its present state. I expect something along those lines could be coded in, if it was thought worth the trouble. With that thought I will leave the matter for now.

Probably not, no. Sound contacts would be more obvious before the action kicked off, were it so coded, and audible cues might even outrange visual ones in night scenarios. Maybe it is, at least the visual ranges are truncated in low light conditions.