The New GUI Brainstorm Thread

[Vinnart]

First, I am so excited about this great game! I really want to see this game shine as the star it deserves to be as a quintessential RTS classic for grogs. This is the first true full RTS game that doesn't feel like such a clickfest kids game. Full of much depth, and realism without sacrificing fun. Right now it has me with a creative buzz. TOW has very good command and control in most aspects including the camera. The only major work I think needs to be done priority is improving waypoints in regards to loading/unloading of infantry, and hitch/unhitching, and moving of guns. Beyond that I have thought of a new (and I feel improved) GUI inspired mainly from both the Sudden Strike, and Combat Mission series. I would like to share this with the community, and with the Development team. I think you will find this GUI streamlined, practical, and more functional than the game currently uses.

First, I would change the order grid of commands from 4 rows of 4 commands to 3 rows of 5 commands/hotkeys. Why? This layout fits the natural keyboard layout better, and will offer 3 more command hotkeys that I will explain.

Some of the described commands have speedy, and convenient access via primary hotkey command + CTRL, or ALT Key. This also offers more variations of commands while still containing them to keys easily accessed on the left side of the keyboard which seems to be the most traditional, as it is most logical.

Starting with the first command/key in the grid top row, the Q key.

COMMANDS:

Q key – STOP command. This is just as the game has it now except there is now a NEW! sub command PAUSE accessed via right click on command button graphic (same as buttons game has now with little red triangle bottom right corner.) The NEW! PAUSE command acts just like in CMSF where the player puts the unit, or units in PAUSE behavior first, then issues an order, or string of waypoint orders. The unit, or units will not carry out, or continue their orders until the PAUSE behavior is unselected. This makes it easier to coordinate orders between numerous units, or pause orders without having to reissue a whole new set of orders if not desired. Not accessed as often as some other orders, but useful, also helps cut down on the stigma of click fest associated with many RTS games. The player can relax more, and plot out orders without the unit moving out until you want it to.

W key – ATTACK command – No change, same as game has it now.

E key – ATTACK GROUND command - This stays as game has it now except there is now a sub command SMOKE accessed via right click on command button graphic. I have taken SMOKE’s exclusive key, and combined it with attack ground. To me this is logical in freeing up keys for other uses. SMOKE is useful, but not used as often. Also you use SMOKE as ground fire. You can still access SMOKE quickly by holding down the E key + ALT key. This speedily changes the cursor to the SMOKE curser while the both keys are pressed.

R key – STORM/ASSUALT command – This command stays the same, but also gets a NEW! Sub command ASSUALT TO COVER accessed via right click on command button graphic. ASSUALT TO COVER = Infantry move in the default assault behavior, BUT stop as soon as good cover is found. This could be some rocks, trees, a defilade spot depression, or on a reveres slope. Tanks stop when they find a HULL DOWN position like in CMx1. Unlike the SNEAK/SCOUT command where units hide after contact. Units given this order actively try to engage the enemy from the covered positions. This command can also be accessed via R key+ ALT key.

T key – NEW! SPECIAL commands – This key will also have sub menus, and have options available only to special units. Perhaps this could be used as BINOCULAR command to give player more specific control beyond the current default use of units with binoculars. Say to look through binos in specified location. Engineer infantry could perhaps access lay land mine/remove land mind orders. Just some ideas for any special commands that may be introduced. Quick access to the sub commands could be with hotkey + ALT, and or CTRL keys.

2nd ROW:

A key – ROTATE command – I have changed the DEFEND/ROTATE to Just ROTATE as I am finding I only use this key to rotate, since Defend is the default behavior if nothing else is set by player. ROTATE also now has a speedy shortcut for just rotating the turret of tanks via A key + ALT key. Quicker than selecting barrel, then selecting rotate, then right click area in map. Just hold down ALT key while issuing command, and right click direction on map to rotate turret to.

S key – AMBUSH command - This command stays the same.

D key – SNEAK/SCOUT command - This command stays the same.

F key – LOAD/UNLOAD command – This tells a vehicle to load infantry, or unload at a map LOCATION, or DIRECTLY in to a building, or a GUN, or Unload at PRESENT location (The current way the Bail Out order works. This alternate command unload at immiadiatly at present location is accessed via the UNLOAD COMMAND + Alt key).

A player can select a transport with infantry in it, then select unload order, then right click on either a map location, a house, or gun. The vehicle will drive to any of the above, and the infantry will unload onto the map location, or occupy the specified building, or gun. Since FOLLOW/DEFEND is the default command in TOW when friendly unit is selected, and curser is over another friendly, this command, and behavior could be set for easy access by holding the CTRL key down while hovering icon over another friendly to change the curser to the load command when applicable like a truck or tank. This is much more functional than the current BAIL OUT command. To BAIL crew one will now right click on the unit icon in passenger cargo graphic. NO game ever had this as right as Sudden Strike. Currently to get troops to unload at a spot you to select a truck, give it the move order, then select again once it gets there, then select bail order. This way select transport with infantry, select unload, right click map location, and your done. No having to find the transport again to unload where you want.

G key – HITCH/UNHITCH – Again Sudden Strike series is the game to copy for its superb system regarding this. Works similar with the guns as LOAD/UNLOAD does with infantry. You can unhitch at a designated location, or unhitch immediately at present location (via G key+ Alt key). You can select a gun, or guns, and a transport, or transports, Hit hitch command, and the nearest transport to the nearest gun will go and hitch it. Much easier system for hitching/unhitching and moving guns especially when combined with waypoints via the SHIFT key.

3rd ROW:

Z key – ACTION/BEHAVIOR modes – Same as game has now, standing, crouching, and crawling. Quick access CROUCH is Z key + CTRL key. Quick Access crawling is Z key + ALT key.

X key –FIRE modes - Same as game has now.

C key – FORMATION - Same as game has now.

V key – NEW! ATTACH/DETACH command. This is an administrative command similar to CMSF that allows the player flexibility to split and re- attach squads, or create adhoc squads by attaching infantry to a leader NCO, or Officer. Allows detaching from one official squad to another squad, or officer. Also attaches infantry to guns so they remain with it. Actually I would prefer the infantry stayed with guns automatically when hitching guns. This is a more binding command than FOLLOW. For example a heavy machine gunner may be attached to an officer, but the officer can still be order to follow the machine gunner.

B key – AUTO PICK UP WEAPONS – Same as game has now. Also now with perhaps a sub menu behavior called AUTO OCCUPY HEAVY WEAPON. This behavior would allow infantry to occupy heavy guns without being told to do so.

*As stated above FOWLLOW/DEFEND will remain the overall default that the cursor changes to when one friendly is selected, and curser is positioned over another friendly, however now via the ALT key it changes to the LOAD command to load infantry on to transports including tanks. With transports and guns the curser changes via the ALT key to either HITCH, or UNHITCH depending on the guns state.

Foolow/defend

[Vinnart]

I was playing, and saw I completely forgot the MOVE, and RETTREAT commands.

From what I have above I would have to say to say lose the SPECIAL command I mentioned, and assign MOVE to the T key.

T key – MOVE command – acts the same as game has it now except RETREAT could be combined with it as a sub command. RETREAT is not used as often, but could still be accessed quickly via the T key + ALT key.

[Vinnart]

Still refining ideas, consider all the above a 1st draft. Hey, that’s why they call it a development PROCESS. Another draft with graphic to come..

[Vinnart]

In thinking more over this I have made a few revisions that I feel improve my initial design. Please review the graphic. I think this is a smart, efficient, and fully functional layout. I hope you feel this way to. Improves what is already there, taking great ideas from SS, and CM series making for an ULTIMATE GUI.

In order to include a SPECIAL commands key. I have removed AUTO PICK UP from the most used orders keys, and have assigned that to the U key, for UP. Out of all the commands I use this one the least if never. I am figuring many others do the same since that is something less to micro manage. The B key could be where the SPECIAL commands key could go.

The PAUSE order under the STOP command is something that would be used more in multiplayer since in single player a person can just pause the game, issue lots of order, then un-pause the game to see everything order carried out.

Other keys:

SPACE key - I have changed this to the "Jump camera to last incident". This no longer pauses the game, but jumps the camera to the last incident much like how it is in multiplayer. This is How Sudden Strike did it and it worked well. One does not pause during MP play, so the space bar could better be used like this.

P key - PAUSE THE GAME - I think the speed of having to pause the game is something not needed, and used less useful than a "Jump camera to last incident". One gets enough automatic pauses anyways with smart pause turned on. Smart pause doesn’t bother me for single player, giving a taste of more “we go play”. The option to turn off, and on fills anyone’s preference.

M key - Stays as is to access tactical map.

FOLLOW/DEFEND command - As stated above it seems this is used more for rotating than issuing a defend command since DEFEND is the default behavior, and the order can be issued by hovering the cursor over another friendly unit. In addition to this I suggest the incorporation of either the Ctrl key, or the ALT key to quickly change the cursor to the next logical command when cursor is over another friendly. By this I mean If I select infantry and hover the cursor over a tank I most want to either have the infantry FOLLOW/ DEFEND the tank, or have the infantry LOAD on to the tank. I If I select a tank and hover cursor infantry more than likely the alternate thing the player wants to do is have the tank load that infantry. Having the cursor change to this alternate default cursor accessed via CTRL or, Alt key streamlines common logical commands. If I select a truck a truck, then hover cursor over gun more than likely I want to hitch the gun, so the cursor would change to this alternate command. This is a shortcut idea. Anyway possible I think the ability to load infantry to tanks as in CMx1, and Sudden Strike would be nice realistic options.

[Vinnart]

More on the V key – ATTACH/DETATCH command. The game will have to have a command that deals with administration much how CMSF does. The V- key should have a submenu command SPLIT SQAUD available if the full squad is selected allowing for this option. Assuming TOW still deals with individual soldiers on some level that make up squads I cannot think of a more flexible system that allows for squads, and individuals at the same time while still keeping military organizational structure. A player selects 3 soldiers from one squad, selects the ATTACH/DETACH command, and right clicks anywhere on the map. The soldiers are then detached from that squad, and move out to the area on map right clicked. Since the 3 are now detached they would no longer be selected when the rest of their old squad is selected. They are now individuals unless they are attached again. In the same way one could select these 3 soldiers for example, select attach/detach command, and then right click on another leader transferring the 3 to the other squad leader. The 3 soldiers would then move out to be next to their new leader, and become part of that leaders squad when that leader’s squad is selected.

A shortcut for transferring soldiers from one leader to another is with the “Smart alternate hovering curser” accessed via hovering over another friendly while holding down the CTRL, or Alt key changing the cursor from the default FOLLOW/DEFEND command to the next most logical command one would want to give. If a player selects a soldier, then hovers the cursor over a leader he more than likely wants that soldier to FOLLOW (Less permanent) that leader, or ATTACH (more binding) that soldier to the new leader. Easy, select soldier, hover cursor over leader while holding down the Ctrl key changing cursor to ATTACH, right click on leader. Soldier moves out next to the leader to join his squad.

Something like this flexible system allows the player to control as a squad, or more like individuals, which is more like the game now. The way I see it the game will have to still have a certain amount of individual selection to maintain the FPS camera view, which is another great aspect of the game. You can play FPS, or RTS, or even more like a turned base in single player if you like via pausing the game. The addition of Binocular view should be interesting. Lots of cool posibilities for FPS camera view.

[Vinnart]

Here is something like what a final design would look like in the game.

Beyond what I have explained previously, there are a few other enchantment ideas I thought of.

TACTICAL MAP - Big improvements in this from TOW2 to TOW2 Kursk. Now it is VERY functional. I have moved the access tab from the top closer to the mini map. In my opinion this is a more logical, and efficient place for the tab. It keeps all map controls closer together, with less moving of mouse to top to access. Keeps eyes on bottom of screen with rest of controls. One feature missing from TOW2 Africa to TOW Kursk was the ability to hide/show specific unit in Tact map. I have included this as you can see. These buttons can only be accessed in Tact map mode. They allow the player to see certain units in a less cluttered atmosphere. This was good in TOW2 Africa. To streamline all units can be lumped into these catogories if desired. Of course you can still toggle Tact map via M key.

ALL – Shows all units.

ARMOR – Included tanks, and SPG’s.

INFANTRY – infantry.

VEHICLES – Includes, APC’s,Cars,Trucks.

ARTILLERY – Included any Gun that has crew. HMG’s and up, AA guns, howitzers, ect..

AIR- includes all air units.

TASK FORCE SITUATION REPORT.

This is a NEW tab that would update real-time, and give the player the most important info about the entire force at a glance, rather than having to cycle through and check each unit. True changing icon, and the journal give useful info. This is another tool to know as much info of the situation at a glance. This would be especially useful in when playing the game in TACT MAP mode. This report is constantly updated. A good shortcut here is that in TACT MAP mode Double clicking on a units name say while holding CTRL key closes the TACT map automaticly, moving the camera into battlemap , and center on selected unit. CMSF has something similar for moving camera through chain of command.

When the tab is accessed as you can see sub tabs appear to show all, or specific unit types. When a sub tab is clicked an origination order of battle text tree appears. It shows the current units place in the orginiaztion such as 1st squad, 2nd platoon, E Company. Next is the units experience status designated by either a G,R,V,or E for Green, Regular, Vet, Elite. Next is the current units name, and rank such as Capt Dick Winters. As soldiers die the next eligible soldier takes his place automatically, and the name changes to the new leader. Next are the current units status reports designated by icons. I chose a heart, Bullet, lightning bolt, and tanks get turret, tracks ect…

Using the classic designation colors Green, Yellow, and Red:

HEART ICON: Green heart –Units morale is fine. Yellow heart – Morale is getting shaky, maybe a guy, or two in squad panicking. Red heart unit is in Panic. In the case of infantry squads although a unit commander’s name is shown the stat reports are an average for the entire squad not that commander himself unless he is an individual like a Company commander.

BULLET ICON: Unit or squads current ammo sit rep. Green – full ammo, Yellow – Ammo half gone. Red – Ammo low

LIGHTNING BOLT ICON: Shows units’ current combat status. In the case of organized squads, if one member from the squad is engaged then the entire squad will get that status. GREEN= Unit is not engaged. Not firing at enemy, nor receiving incoming fire. YELLOW = Unit is in engaged with enemy, taking, or firing rounds. RED = Unit is in panic. When HEART is red, this turns red too.

ARMOR ICONS = Always red silluettes to show damaged parts.

So, In TACT MAP mode the player can see at a glance that the M10 “Rough Rider” has bit of stress going on with the YELLOW HEART, but is not in a panic. I see he has about half of the primary ammo left, Is not currently engaged, and has a broken track. The player can scroll through to see all morale, ammo, engagement, and damage of entire army at a glance, and jump the camera to those units conveniently.

[Vinnart]

[Vinnart]

ARTILLERY OBSERVERS USING THIS COMMAND MODEL:

NEW! command added to the E key – ATTACK GROUND command - A sub command could be added under this command called "FIRE MISSION", or something along those lines. The command in essence places a target reference point ring (TRP) on the map where the spotter can see. The player must target artillery within this ring to achieve accurate fire. This command would only be available to artillery forward observers, and leaders.

Check out Artillery Observers in TOW3 to get more in depth info, and to see screen shot concepts:

http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=93855

[Vinnart]

Based on this design model of an ATTACH/DETACH command I can imagine the selecting of units in this flexible system working kind of like this. Some of which is in game already.

Single left click individual unit: Select INDIVIDUAL.

Box drag selects: Selects ALL in box

Double left click leader: Selects leader, and all attached to him; his SQUAD

Double Ctrl key + Alt key + double click leader: Selects FORMATION. I.E. Double clicking on a platoon leader this way will select the HQ platoon section/squad + the entire PLATOON. Double left clicking this way on company commander selects entire COMPANY.

Ctrl key + unit type + double L click: Select all of unit class in screen.

One could also make groups via the number keys as always, and select units that way.

This system would allow both individual, and formation selection with many variations. It merges the best of both TOW, and CMSF selection systems.

[Vinnart]

Other than the command controls, some camera controls need to be easily accessible via the left hand. The most sensible place would be the F1 – F3 keys changing from the present enter, insert, and delete keys.

It is my inclination that more people game using the mouse + keyboard vs keyboard for both camera, and hotkey control. If this is the case, then this entire design is more ergonomic to the natural way people control games, and perhaps more sensible for default controls. The few minority that control the camera via the number pad can always have that as secondary hotkey controls.

[theoneandonly]

I'm not flaming, or spamming. But I don't think I stand alone when I say; the GUI improvements are great, but we still won't buy/enjoy it until the lag issue is fixed. I know I for one WOULD buy the Korea version regardless of changes, if the Lag issue was fixed

If you guys can fix the lag for Korea (and preferably the others too) this game would be one of the best WW2 (and Korea soon) strategy games of all time!