Firepower ratings.

[cpurkiser]

I am enjoying CMBB more than the original many great improvements.

I do have questions about firepower that I haven't seen discussed in the forum. Now I realize that game is too complex to have simple math models but I'd like to get feeling for the math behind the fire power ratings.

Let say a squad X has firepower (FP) of 70 at range 100M. Does that mean that if X fires for an entire minute at Squad Y that gets hit with 70 unit of firepower? Of does the firepower apply to each time X uses an ammo point?

If it is per Ammo point I thought squads used more ammo in close range situations?

Is there any rules of thumb that say you need 100,200,300 FP to achieve a casuality assuming open terrain?

Does a Squad with 20% exposure suffer 1/3 the casualties of a squad with 60% exposure?

What effect does experience have? An alerted Veteran German squad appears to be far more effective at killing than a alerted green Russian squad, eventhough the fire power rating maybe similar.

What are approximate firepower ratings of German, and Russian Coax MGs, how about the Hull MGs?

Thanks in advance.

[offtaskagain]

Originally posted by cpurkiser:

I am enjoying CMBB more than the original many great improvements.

I do have questions about firepower that I haven't seen discussed in the forum. Now I realize that game is too complex to have simple math models but I'd like to get feeling for the math behind the fire power ratings.

Let say a squad X has firepower (FP) of 70 at range 100M. Does that mean that if X fires for an entire minute at Squad Y that gets hit with 70 unit of firepower? Of does the firepower apply to each time X uses an ammo point?

Each time X uses an ammo point.

If it is per Ammo point I thought squads used more ammo in close range situations?

[kump]

I must say, unlike other wargames I played, I'm not all that hung up on the "numbers game" with CMBB (and CMBO). I've played the game with tactics that should work, and they most times do (minus some surprises that keep things exciting).

I used to be so hung up on tables and numbers and analysing things to death. The CM games have been a wonderful change for me. I no longer get hungup on the mathematics anymore. I don't calculate by looking at fire power numbers, I make sure I have the mostest at the right place where single power factor numbers just mean squat. One strong fire rating squad will get suppressed just as easy as a weak squad, and the greater number weaker squads will make short work of it.

Now I know that is not what you asked. And yes, knowing what is under the hood is interesting to know, so I certainly don't fault being curious. But its so refreshing that I don't feel the need to know and that sound tactics work regardless. I'm playing CM and enjoying it, because I'm not analysing attack values and defense factors, but living in it and using the resources I have, regardless of the ratings. The results just feel so right at times that I've completely forgotten about things such as strength values. I only know that an MG42 will suppress and kill in the open and that is enough for me

Man, I certainly don't miss those days of looking at chits for values and tables to get results from a die roll. Praise be to CM and the education it has given on how a computer can make a wargame come alive and how it can be done right.

---

Sgt. Steiner runs to Lt. Williams who is looking at the field manual 2.001 Field Unit Fire Factors.

"Sir, the squad is ready to take the tree line."

Lt. Williams shakes his head in consternation, "I don't like this Sergeant. It says here that the German SS rifle squad at the tree line is a 5-3-3 unit."

"Yes Sir, that is the standard rating of an SS rifle squad, but if we suppress, I think we can handle it."

Lt. Williams looked worried and replied, "Yet the German rifle squad at the bocage to our left is a 3-2-2! Our chance of taking the unit in the bocage seems to be the better deal!"

"Except Sir, you will note that if we attack to our left, that will take us into the firing field of a 12-5-6 machinegun nest!"

The young Lt. did not look convinced. Grabbing a ruler and map from his field pack, he proclaims "I'm not sure about that Sergeant. That tree line looks like it would block the field of fire by running along side this hex line here!"

Sgt. Steiner looks at his commander's ruler on the map and shakes his head. "I'm sorry Sir, I don't think that is considered blocking."

The Lt. put his ruler, map, and manual away and looked determinably at the Sergeant. "I think you are wrong Sergeant and I'm willing to bet the squad's life on it. Get the squad ready."

As Lt. Williams starts to leave he stops and stares at the sky as a large shadow appears across the horizon.

"My God", he screams, "What the hell is that!"

The Sergeant looks up and answers, "That Sir, appears to be the Cat's paw. We are doomed."

EDIT: Yea, I know. Stick to the web site and leave the attempts at humor to others. What can I say, lapses in posting judgement like these aflict me once in awhile. Mmmm... Well, got those bucket full of Russian tank mods at Tom's CMHQ , best get busy cataloging them.

[ October 23, 2002, 12:23 AM: Message edited by: kump ]

[cpurkiser]

Panzerwefer thanks for the info.

It is very helpful to know that the LOS tool will show different FP ratings for different experience levels. That will help me judge the effectiveness of experience units.

Kump, I agree with you the nice thing about CM is that you don't have to worry about the numbers, and just try real life tactics... Still, I wanted to understand is a Russian tank with 45 MM gun and coax machine gun, equivalent to a Russian squad for killing infantry.

I am still trying to get the hang of attacking in this game it seems very difficult, especially as the early Russian troops. They have a bad habit of hitting the ground as soon as the first shot is fired. I was playing Directive 3 and after capturing the first objective, I found attack completely stopped.

[kump]

Agreed. Playing early war Russians can be very tricky and challenging. Just what I would expect.

I commend you for taking the early war Russians. By the time your playing late war Russians, you will think they are supermen. Sometimes with the early Russian infantry, taking just one objective is a victory unto itself.

[demoss]

I agree on the relative lack of usefulness of the firepower numbers. I basically only use them to try to get a feel for which squads I want to be doing the close-in work and which ones are firing at range - and in CM:BB, particularly, the number of LMGs is almost all I really need to know even for that.