Henri Posted January 3, 2001 Share Posted January 3, 2001 We are so focused in playing the game as it is designed that it seems that no one (to my knowledge) has realized tht for 2-player games, victory flags are not required. Victory flags are required for the AI, but there were no victory flags in WW2, and they artificially constrain play in 2-player games. How come there are no scenarios with Squad-Leader-like victory conditions? -for instance, "have at least three squads in the houses in the town at the end of the scenario", or "destroy at least half of the enemy force while maintaining at least half of yours", or "Have at least 3 non-demoralized units at the end of the game"-well, you get the idea. I am playing a pbem game right now on a huge map where we agreed that victory flags can be ignored -damaging the enemy is the object of the game. Well, after half a dozen moves, I still haven't spotted any enemy, but it is a huge map... Anyway, scenario designers are already designing games especially for 2-player games, but they are still oriented towards controlling victory locations.Even Squad Leader transpositions are flag-oriented. So c'mon you designers (I am not one of you), let's see some creativity with victory conditions designed especially for 2-player games.Among other things, this would allow much more flexibility in the game design -for example, a scenario could be wildly unbalanced, but the weaker player would win if he maintained a given part of his force, or a specific unit, or-you name it. Such scenarios would probably require better scenario briefings than most scenarios have now.In some cases, at least one player should be told the exact composition of the enemy's force and even their exact locations. One idea off the top of my head is the following: one player is told that he must ambush an enemy force garrisoned in a nearby town. The enemy is unaware of his presence, so none of his units are allowed to move until five moves after the attack begins. The ambushing player is told that he must expect enemy reinforcements after a certain amount of time, so he must do as much damage as possible to the enemy in the town, the skedaddle off the map before the enemy reinforcements can intervene.I am not sure how to enforce the no-move rule with fog of war, but perhaps the game could be played without FOW, since it plays a negligible role in this scenario. Henri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pak40 Posted January 4, 2001 Share Posted January 4, 2001 I agree with you completely. Play my Arnhem Campaign. Ignore the results at the end of the campaign. The victory conditions are givin in the briefing. BTW, I don't think the AI requires an objective flag. I've been playing a particular battle against the AI and it doesn't require victory flags or an "exit edge". But, I guess that on a really big map, the AI might be confused or lack a good attacking direction without V flags. It's probably best to keep these maps small to medium size. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wwb_99 Posted January 4, 2001 Share Posted January 4, 2001 I was thinking of putting together a scenario without flags, just exit zones. Should be interesting. WWB ------------------ Before battle, my digital soldiers turn to me and say, Ave, Caesar! Morituri te salutamus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I/O Error Posted January 5, 2001 Share Posted January 5, 2001 Actually, scenarios at least SORT of like what are describing already exist, they are "destroy" operations. No flags, no exit zones, nothing but sheer bloody violence. Good examples include the Arnhem and Wittmann operations. [This message has been edited by I/O Error (edited 01-04-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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