Grog history help needed! :)

[AstroCat]

For fun when I play a CM game I usually check and see what the real history was behind the battle.

Question:

I am playing in a tournament over at Band of Brothers. It's based on the Poles vs. the Fallschirm in July of 44.

Did the Poles ever run in to the Fallschirm in July of 44?

Maybe around Caen? I know the Poles were with the Canadians but were the Fallschirm with the SS units around Caen?

I couldn't find any info that they did meet but perhaps at the Battle of the Falaise Pocket in August?

Any info? Just curious.

Thanks!

Jordan "AstroCat"

[Kingfish]

AFAIK, the first battle for the Polish 1st Armored Div was around St. Aignan de Cramnesmil during Operation Totalize, August 8-9th. There they went up against the 12th SS Pz, and possibly some remnants from the 89th infantry div as well.

I don't think they encountered any Fallschirmjager troops in a stand up fight. They may have run into some disorganized FJ units trying to fight their way out of the Falaise pocket.

[Dandelion]

No solid info to offer, but thechnically its possible that the Poles might have faced a few paras in August, on the Mace.

The paratroops deployed to Normandy were divisions 2, 3 and 5. All deployed to Bretagne.

Part of 2nd fought at Carentan (against US), the rest at Brest (against US).

3 and 5 were part of II.Airborne Corps and fought at St Lo and in the Vire valley (against US), and were subsequently caught in the Falaise pocket in mid August. Remnants broke out through the Chambois-Argentan gap. Someplace, somehow. By then more than 70% of both divisions had been lost, so we are speaking scattered remnants.

Who knows, some of them might have been present in the Hill 262 battles of August 19-22. Never saw any report on it, but Falaise was such a chaotic mess, anything is possible, and I've read no real good accounts on these events myself.

There were no paratroopers taking part in the battles for Caen though.

Regards

Dandelion

[AstroCat]

Thanks guys, really appreciate the info. Turns out the tournament organizer set it up on a fictional basis. So, for my mind I'll figure Aug. around the Falaise Pocket against scattered Fallschirm trying to escape with some armor they met up with.

Jordan "AstroCat"

[Alsatian]

I found this today and it might be interesting to you.

Check out these HQ 12th Army Group Situation maps (from that page go about half way down and click link for "Additional Military Battles and Campaigns." From the next page, click #3-Euprope.Germany.[1944-1945]. Sorry the first link didn't work.

The maps show every day from June 6, 1944 through July 26, 1945.

Pretty neat stuff and the zoom feature for the maps is excellent providing sharp and detailed images.

The map for August 16 shows the 6th FJ at Chambois facing south while the Polish 2nd Armor is about 20 miles to the northwest pressing south towards Falaise. The 3rd FJ is at the westernmost tip of the closing pocket.

6th FJ is then noted as "unlocated" until August 20th when it is placed at Verneuil well outside and to the east of the pocket.

The map for August 19 shows the pocket closed and the 3rd FJ is listed as one of the units "in trap."

However that's academic because the maps also show that after closing the gap, the Polish 2nd Armor advanced east away from the pocket, so they would not have engaged any units trapped in the pocket.

[ August 14, 2003, 03:18 PM: Message edited by: Alsatian ]

[AstroCat]

Hey thanks for the additional info!

Unfortunately the link you gave gives this error:

Temporary file open error. Display failed.

But, I was able to find the site and get to the maps!

Jordan "AstroCat"

[Alsatian]

I went back and edited the link and added some directions to navigate the Library of Congress's site. It should work now with only minor inconveniences.