Lou2000 Posted September 3, 2003 Share Posted September 3, 2003 OK I know this subject has been discussed many times before, but another thread has given me an idea that I've not seen posted before (I did a search) and could help to reduce its effects within the current game engine ....... You'll notice I said reduce NOT totally remove it. The suggestion would be to only display a unit marker (the iron cross/flag etc) for enemy forces that have been spotted by your units that are out of command range (ie no red line). Your forces would still engage, but you wouldnt see exactly what they were shooting at. The AI is already capable of engaging units at its own discretion .... you just dont see what it is shotting at ! If the spotting unit was within command range then the current ID rules would apply, and if the spotting unit subsequently comes into command range the 'target' icon is updated to display known info. This would mean that when you send that tank hunter team or sharpshooter right out front and they spot somebody they would engage it, but you'd only see a marker on the map .... no actual unit or unit details. Your unit could be engaging a single sharpshooter or the massed rifles of a Soviet infantry division, you would have to judge your response based on sound contacts and incoming fire etc......what would you do, ignore this new, unidentified threat, or break off your current attack to engage what turns out to be a tank hunter team. Tanks without radios would suffer the same problem, the tank would engage and act based on the AI's assessment of the threat. Not a perfect solution, but IMO it would help to reduce the 'Gods eye' view of the battlefield and (from a total non programmers point of view)shouldnt be too hard to implement into the current engine (or future ones) Any thoughts ! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirReal Posted September 3, 2003 Share Posted September 3, 2003 I think the reason you're not getting any response it that a) it's been talked to death and you're not addressing the borg spotting issue at all. Borg spotting isn't about getting too much information to you as the commander; it's about how your units instantly share information with each other. /SirReal 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntelWeenie Posted September 4, 2003 Share Posted September 4, 2003 Units won't engage a marker since it only represents the last known location of the enemy unit. So the original spotting unit wouldn't fire, either. Find a way around that and this idea might have some merit. 2 different types of unit markers? "Spotted-isolated" (only targetable by the spotting unit) and the regular "last known location" markers? Might be too confusing. Maybe display the enemy unit like normal, but put this extra info in the unit iformation area at the bottom of the screen? It's not a 100% solution, but it's a start and would definitely help take care of the gamiest situations where enemy units spotted by an isolated unit are instantly visible by all. True, an isolated platoon (with the Plt HQ) would be "in command" and get past this, but like I said, it's a start. I don't mind talking this or any (well, almost any) topic to death. Borg Spotting is one to the biggest realism hurdles for CM and I think all suggestions should be at least thought through before being dismissed because "it's been talked to death". 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Chapuis Posted September 4, 2003 Share Posted September 4, 2003 Any enhancement that would limit the amount of info "lone-wolf" units pass on to every other unit through the "all-knowing commander" is a plus in my book. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lou2000 Posted September 5, 2003 Author Share Posted September 5, 2003 Units won't engage a marker since it only represents the last known location of the enemy unit. So the original spotting unit wouldn't fire, either. Find a way around that and this idea might have some merit. 2 different types of unit markers? "Spotted-isolated" (only targetable by the spotting unit) and the regular "last known location" markers? Might be too confusing. Yeah I agree that there would need to be different icons (or other marker) to represent the 'spotted' unit and that the AI would need to be tweaked so that it would engage this type of marker.(I hadnt thought about that !) Also, as you say, there are ways around it ... (a unit in command for example). But it would help. With this method if your lone tank hunter team came under fire from the 'spotted' enemy by an MG for example, you'd still not be getting too much info .... was it an infantry LMG, HMG or a vehicle mounted MG .... what type of vehicle ...MG carrier, Halftrack or something a bit bigger. You may get a few sound clues but visually you'd see the same marker, until you get into command range or a unit in command range spots that enemy. Whilst we all know that there is a new CM engine being produced, I'm trying to keep my suggestion broadly within the known capabilities of the current game engine, (Thats why I didnt post this in the current CMx2 thread ... though a similar idea may help). I'd be the first to admit that this suggestion (even if workable) probably comes too late, I do think that with a little tweaking the 'borg spotting' effect could be reduced. I also think this method would have been good if incorporated into the FOW settings, that way you wouldnt be forced to use it if you didnt want to. We already have EFOW .... so why not EFOW-RS (Reduced spotting) as an option. Lou2000 [ September 05, 2003, 01:49 AM: Message edited by: Lou2000 ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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