Official New Campaign thread

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

Ok, ill set this thread up to give the opportunity for campaign makers to share their ideas, thoughts, or for other people to request certain camapigns, or ask questions about them. Lets see some more player campaigns!

[Otto]

Great idea CVM, sort of a campaign development thread. And if anyone does make any campaign, or have some already, I think I can find a place for them to be hosted.

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

Bump, does anyone have any player campaigns they want to talk about?

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

Ok, i cant beleive no one has mad a single custom campaign.!

[Timjohnb5]

I made a single player campaign called 'Real War'.

It is basically built around the first campaign of the game, except Greece, Norway & Iraq have already joined the allies. The German Navy has the Bismark and a few more Subs. The Royal Navy has more experiance. Not much of a change, but adds more realism. If anyone wants it just post here.

I have made another one called 'World War One'. Basically scraping the Carriers, and adding way more troops to both armys.

[ October 10, 2002, 04:34 PM: Message edited by: Timjohnb5 ]

[SixthArmy]

I would like to see a modern conflict. I think it would work fine w/ the weapons being so abstract. I'm unsure how to model nuclear strikes or if that is even possible.

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

Timjohn, email otto your campaign along with a text description at otto@ww2n.com he'll put it up for you so we all can d/l it.

Also, a modern conflict would be very hard to model in my opinion, nuclear strikes and airstrikes just wouldne work right. And who would the Allies fight?

[Timjohnb5]

I'll post as soon as i've made some changes. I want to sought out a few issues.

[SixthArmy]

nuclear strikes and airstrikes just wouldne work right.

Right, one would have to assume the war does not go nuclear. Unless a modmaker can figure out a way to create big booms. I'm not sure which parts of this game are modable or if anyone is even looking into it.

And who would the Allies fight?

Warsaw Pact vs NATO for starters. Wouldn't even need a new map for that one. If someone could mod a new map we could simulate a large war in the middle east. China vs US Pacific rim could be good. Using this game engine and a handfull of user created maps could yeild endless theoretical global conflicts, imo.

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

Ok, hell hath frozen over. I kinda did this as a joke but heres my new one.

1962: Red October

The Crisis in Cuba has reached the point where military action is inevitable. The Reds launch an Offensive on Berlin and Western Europe. Meanwhile, the Arab armies launch an attack against israel. (Beirut= Jeruselem)

This one is a bit odd so i am probably not gonna put it at SCHQ, any one that wants to help me design it say so. I just finished the beta version. I am using the Germans as the russians.

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

No comments?

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

Bump, this is a good thread

[JerseyJohn]

X Left Click for a Map of Europe in 1900

This is based on a turning point in history: that the Kaiser accepted the English and French peace offers in 1918 after Russia's collapse.

Strictly speaking it isn't a WW II scenario in the usual sense, it starts in Sept of '39 with an allied initiative. Details below as they were originally entered on another forum (human vs human) where I was encouraging the use of the scenario editor for players who find the AI too predictable in scenarios they're already familiar with.

-- -- --

This scenario assumes WW I ended in a stand-off with the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk being accepted by both sides. Germany pulls out of Belgium and Northern France and, in exchange, England and France accept the treaty in the East. Germany gets Poland (formerly partitioned with Czarist Russia and Hapsburg Austria). The independent Baltic states are German allies (protectorates) along with a German backed independent Ukraine (Ukrainia)which includes parts of Belorussia.

<a href="http://http://http://www.bbc.co.uk/education/modern/russia/russiim3.gif[/img" target="_blank">]http://www.bbc.co.uk/education/modern/russia/russiim3.gif Left Click to see areas affected by the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk 1918</a>

The Austrian and Ottoman Empires are gone, broken up from both without and within.

All of that is very historically reliable. Up to the stalling of the Hindenberg-Ludendorff Offensive --

http://www.worldwar1.com/photos/kaishl.jpg]left click here for photo of Kaiser Wilhelm II

-- England and France were desperate for peace and were willing to acknowledge everything Germany had occupied in the east on condition that Germany pull out of Northern France and Belgium; they were even willing to restore the large African colonies Germany had lost earlier in the war.

But, Kaiser Wilhem II (a.k.a. "Foolish Willie" wanted everything -- and wound up with nothing.

The revised borders are based on a map I found in a 1938 book, Brest-Litovsk by John W. Wheeler-Bennett -- how often do you find a hyphenated title written by a hyphenated author!

The situation is Sept '39 and truncated Russia is allied with France and Britain against Germany. Stalin wants his territories back and France wants revenge! The Allies have the first move.

I envision it as a War where the early campaigns are infantry oriented, so there are only a few armored units and airfleets. I also see it as something that would have lasted the full six years, with Germany being on the defensive for the first year or even two years.

Germany would have to choose which way to concentrate her offensive stregnth. If one front can be successfully resolved she should be able to turn the other way and win without much difficulty. The trick is finding the proper play balance. If the allies are strong enough to wage successful offensives on both fronts simultaneously they should win easily. So, ideally the result should go in either direction.

I'm still working on the details but when I finally play it the AI should be unpredictable.

I chose this subject in part because I didn't have to worry about accurately recreating an historical situation. The scenario is full of speculation. For example, I speculate that even in victory the Kaiser's government would have been couped, so it makes sense that the Nazis are in power. I see Germany going the same route as Italy, a figurehead monarch with a Dictator calling the shots [slightly ammended from the original posting in agreement with Wachtmeister's posting further down].

For my own peace of mind I imagine the nazis of this scenario being mellower and less racist. Without the "stab-in-the-back" excuse fanning their racial hatred they might have been less venumous. Scapegoats are unnecessary in victory.

Any suggestions or advice would be appreciated.

left click for map of GERMANY IN 1914

[ January 18, 2003, 12:28 AM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

Very Nice

[Wachtmeister]

Jersey John:

A very interesting "alternate history" scenerio.

Some questions/suggestions as follows come to mind:

1. The High Seas Fleet presumably survives intact, so Germany would have a Navy nearly the size of the UK. Maybe even local German Naval superiority, if events in the Pacific are Historical i.e Japanese expansionism.

2. Since the Varseilles Treaty was never imposed, Germany retains its Air Force and ocean going Submarine Fleet. Advances would not have been supressed for 15 years or so. This translates into perhaps more avanced aircraft, subs, and carriers by 1939. Maybe advanced rockets too?

3.With no war reparations and French occupation and administration of Germany's industrial heart - the Ruhr, Germany would start out far richer, even if the world wide depression is assumed to have occured.

4. Since the social upheaval associated with the historical years of rampant inflation and high unemployment does not occur, suggest that neither the communists, nor the Nazis ever come close to power. I believe that an undefeated, fully armed, German Army would have responded quickly to put down any revoluton. Also the people would not have been in a "revolutionary mood". If, as you think, the Kaiser goes, then maybe a nominal constitutional monarchy or a coalition of "big business" and the military? I think "Kaiser Bill" would have remained, but ended up more as a figurhead, than actual ruler.

5. On the other hand, Germany's "victory" [or at least tie] would perhaps lead to less innovation in areas such as armor and combined arms doctrine. Old Generals tend to fight the last war, especially if they won. Advocacy for tanks did not get all that far with the old-line high ranking Reichswehr Generals, until Hitler became entranced with their potential. This seems to fit well with your emphasis on infantry, at least in the early stages.

6. Suggest that an undefeated Germany would likey have developed 4-engine strategic bombers. A number of designs were actually proposed and these were not rejected until relatively late. A richer Germany could afford to seriously consider both tactical and strategic bombers.

7. Question - what is the status of Czechs? Without the League of Nations meddling, it is unlikely that the Czechs would have formed a nation with the Slovaks. A separate Czech Republic, like we have now? -- aligned with the Allies?

8.A non-Nazi government, not saddled with Nazi off the wall hate based racial beliefs, would probably have treated the citizens in any Russian territory they managed sieze much more rationally. Suggest that his might translate into reduced or eliminated "scorched earth" and partisans for the USSR. Also assume that the persecution of Jews does not occur, and all those theoretical physicists do not emigrate.

I imagine that your may have already considered some or all of these points. In any case I think you have come up with a facinating idea. Let me know if you need play testers, or could use any other sort of assistance.

[JerseyJohn]

Carl -- Wachtmeister, Thanks for the Good Word.

Wachtmeister -- Excellent Points! You've put your finger on all the major issues. -- Thanks for the offer of assistance and I gratefully accept. As soon as I've got a working model I'll either post it or send you a copy and will be very interested in your views. Meanwhile any further suggestions, ideas or observations would be most welcome.

-- Not having the Versailles Treaty dramatically alters almost all the major effects of post WW I. Agreed fully about the German Naval and Military development without it, there would be no restraints.

-- My remarks about Germany's government in 1939 were largely based on the fact that I can't remove Hitler and the Nazis from the game, although they don't impose themselves much on the interface, but are the partisans and scorched earth, as you say, and that's one of the things I've been trying to reason out in my own mind.

-- * -- In brief, this is my projection of what would have happened and what the balance of power, etc., would have been.

1) First, something I was a bit vague on: in the West the borders are the same. Germany would have extended a little farther into France but unless I give it the Maginot Line, which is a possibility I'll come back to later, there isn't much I can do it. -- Germany would have retained Alsace and Loraine. I'm not certain if that's the area holding the French mine, I doubt it, or if it includes the Maginot Line area, which it might.

Altered World War One Aftermath

Scenario's [hypothetical] historical background as seen through Germany:

Though victorious, and despite the addition of it's new territory, post war Germany is wracked by social upheaval and economic chaos. Returning veterans, numbering in the millions, refuse to go back to the old subservience to the Aristocrats. The Kaiser and his administration deal with these problems in a heavy handed manner and the Empire enters the '20s with Bolshevik uprisings and social reform pushing it's way up from the masses.

By 1924 the Kaiser has been reduced to figure head status. The Junker Generals, Bankers and Business leaders, led by the Crown Prince, form a new government and incorporate numerous right wing para-military parties who they deem useful in battling the Bolsheviks.

Chief among these, and the most blatantly anti-communist, is the National Socialists. Made up primarily of disgruntled war veterans and malevolent racists, the Nazis -- as they are known -- do the government's dirty work and the aristocrats turn a blind eye to their methods.

In 1933 the Nazis succeed in attaining the appointment of their leader -- a half-mad war hero of common origin, Adolf Hitler -- to the vague post of Chancellor. With undefined duties, Hitler and his deputies manipulate the aged Prime Minister, Field Marshall von Hindenburg and the impotent Kaiser.

By the late '30s the Crown Prince and most other members of Hollernzollen Royalty, seeking to further their own ends, formerly join the National Socialists and by 1938 Hitler is named Chancellor for Life and virtual, though not absolute, dictator of Germany (similar in regard to the royalty to Mussolini in Italy).

It's upheavals behind it, the German state begins prospering in the late '20s. By 1934, utilizing her special status in Eastern Europe, she is one of the world's most prosperous nations.

A decorated infantryman who for four years witnessed firsthand the futile horror of trench warfare, Chancellor Hitler, determined that Germany will not be similarly tied down in future wars, allocates considerable state funds to military research. Areas of special interest are aircraft and tanks -- and a totally new field, large scale rocketry.

Greatly influenced by the work of American Robert Goddard, Werner von Braun heads Germany's rocket research program masked for foreign eyes as the ridiculous pipe-dream of Space Travel research.

A bemused American congressman shakes his head and tells reporters, "Everyone thinks they're such down to earth people, but that Hitler fellow is dead set on making a German the first man on the moon! -- Well, I suppose in a century or so we'll all be very impressed with their space program. Meanwhile, there are better things to waste money on. It's good to dream, The United States has it's share of dreamers just like anyone else, but the hard working American knows only too well that dreams don't put food on the table or money in the bank! Which is why I've voted and will always vote against government funding for such frivolous projects in this country." The speech is always applauded enthusiastically. A sure vote getter, it is adopted by politicians all across America.

In 1936 a military expansion program is begun in response to Communist Russia's ever more beligerant claims that Finland, The 3 Baltic nations, Ukrania and Poland are all rightfully part of the U. S. S. R..

Overseas, Germany invests heavily in her restored African colonies and finds herself once again competing with Great Britain for trade routes and foreign markets. A naval treaty signed after the war by Britain, Germany, France, the United States and Japan, limiting the size and number of warships, is torn up by Hitler in 1937. The Japanese, who have held onto Germany's former Pacific colonies, follow suit almost immediately.

By 1938 all five nations are producing wartime navies tailored to their own whims and abilities. Though still Master of the Seas, Britain's naval status is rivaled by the United States, Japan and Germany.

Fourth largest in the world, Germany's Baltic fleet is reorganized in the mid-thirties to include the two aircraft carriers (Graf Zeppelin and Peter Strasser) and four battleships (Bismark, Tirpitz, Hindenburg and Luddendorf)augmented by two heavy cruiser squadrons (Scharnhorst and Gneisenau) and three U-Boat flotillas.

http://history.acusd.edu/cdr2/WW2Pics/04245.GIF ]left click for photo of Large Scale Naval Maneurver

The Far Seas Squadrons, assigned to the East and West African colonies, consist of the last coal burners built for the WW I High Seas Fleet. Converted to oil burning, the Battleships are slow and underarmed by contempory standards and organized into two small fleets stationed in the South Atlantic and Indian Oceans; hopelessly seperated from each other by Commonwealth South Africa. As war looms in 1938 the far flung admiraals are ordered to remain at their home bases to help defend their colonies.

Ranging the Atlantic freely, however, are two U-Boat flotillas and a squadron of armored cruisers, also reffered to as pocket battleships. Originally intended to maintain links between the home country and it's overseas possessions while serveing as commerce raiders, the three sister ships -- Deutschland, Admiral Scheer and Graf Spee -- are reassigned to form the Atlantic Squadron, whose revised function is to protect the U-Boats, who are to do all the harassing of Commonwealth shipping.

Though only 10,000 tons displacement, the armored cruisers carry six 11" guns and combine to form a potent weapon under Rearadmiral Gunther Lutzgens.

In 1937 England begins her own naval expansion program, announcing the keel laying of a new Aircraft Carrier, The H. M. S. Victory, two new Battleships, Lion and Conqueror, and the formation of a further pair of heavy cruisers, Beatty and Jellicoe.

Stretched to the limit rearming it's armies, Germany chooses to pass on this latest leap in the naval race.

In his Kiel headquarters Grossadmiral Raeder, remembering the North Sea blocade of the previous war and realizing Britain has once more succeeded in gaining supremecy, finds himself sitting gloomily at his desk. Despite the size and modernization of his navy he is secretly pessimistic at War's start. He confides to a colleague, Generaladmiral Carl Doenitz, "It will amount to the same thing as last time, only with better ships. It will all be decided by another Jutland, perhaps two such North Sea battles. Afterwards we will either rule the waves, or be under them."

To which Doenitz, commander supreme of Germany's U-Boats, says, "My boys will most assuredly be under them, herr Grossadmiral!"

Also alarmed by Germany's naval expansion, the Soviet Union increases it's Baltic Squadron to include an obsolete Battleship purchased from Germany and coverted to an oil burning engines, and two submarine flotillas.

In the Balkans the dissolution of the Hapsburg and Ottoman Empires leads to the creation of four new nations: Yugoslavia, Hungary, Chechoslovakia and Austria .

By the late '20s Hungary, Romania and Bulgaria find themselves inextricably linked both economically and politically with Germany and are it's defacto, though unoffical, allies.

By the mid-30s Germany and Italy, a similar figurehead monarchy with it's own Dictator, Benito Mussolini, begins forming close bonds with Hitler's Germany. When Italy is censured by the League of Nations in 1936 for it's invasion of Ethiopia the two nations draw even closer and become known as the Rome-Berlin Axis.

http://www.gvn.net/~lowe/mussolini/poster.jpg ]left click here for Italian Mussolini Display Poster

1939 sees Axis supported General Francisco Franco emerge victious in the Spanish Civil War. Mussolini immidiately begins talking of a Rome-Berlin-Madrid Axis, but Franco is unresponsive except to announce that Spain under his rule is the enemy of Bolshevism, a fact already established in years of hard fighting and political slaughter.

In 1938, with considerable influence and internal instigation from the nazis, Austria votes overwhelmingly to become part of Germany.

Later that year Germany pressures the Chechs into surrendering the Sudatenland, an agreement decided upon at the Munich Conference. Though it's future is being decided upon, Chechoslovakia is not itself allowed to participate!

http:// ://history.acusd.edu/cdr2/WW2Pics/01552.jpg left click here for Munich Conference Photo

Encouraged by Hitler's success in the Balkans, Soviet agents initiate a long standing project, Red Star Baltic by infiltrating agents thruought Sweden, sabotoging industry, organizing labor unrest and flooding the nation with counterfeit currency.

By July riots are provoked and, when police bullets cause demonstrator casualties Soviet agents begin distributing arms and ammunition and organizing open rebellion in the south. As Civil War erupts the Bolshevik faction is openly supplied and led by the Soviet Union. In the north German advisers arive along with arms and munitions and Sweden quietly enters the Axis.

With the end of winter 1939 Hitler stuns the world by occupying the remainder of Chechoslovakia, entering Prague in ominous silence after some farcical political maneuvering.

As Spring begins German propagandists deliver radio broadcasts accusing Yugoslavia of . . . financing covert actions within the Greater German Borders and fomenting dissention and Bolshevik revolutionaries among her Baltic neighbors.

Britain and France react with formal guarantees of Yugoslav sovereignty. Western Diplomats fly to Moscow and in April a treaty is signed stating that . . . "in the event one of the signees enters into a state of war against the German Empire, the other two signing nations pledge to immediately declare war against the German Empire and [ii] do further agree to not, under any circumstances, sign a peace treaty exclusive of the other two."

At Stalin's insistance, no mention is made as to the cause of such a war.

Winston Churchill vehemently renounces the treaty in a speech before Parliament.

". . . further, we and our French Allies have handed Bolshevik Russia a blank checque and committed the might, manpower and wealth of His Majesty's Empire to what has, until this time, been an outlaw state! What's more, this government has empowered it's murderous and ruthless ruler -- a man who even now is attempting the overthrow through internal dissention and force of arms, the rightful government of freedom loving Sweden -- Joseph Stalin -- a tyrant reminiscent of his far predecessor Ivan the Terrible -- empowering this horrid and indeed evil despot to determine the fate not only of Europe, but of Civilization itself!"

He is soundly booed even while speaking.

In August Soviet Russia begins making formal demands for the surrender of certain "disputed" lands held by Ukrania and Hitler announces the mobilazation of Germany's military. England and France immediately follow suit. Joining last is Italy, it's leader Mussolini attempting in vain to organize a second Munich conference.

The Second World War begins on September 1st when Soviet troops cross the Ukrainian frontier near Kharkov and Rostov in two massive offensives.

Yugoslavia, assumed to be in alliance with Britain and France, declares itself neutral. In Belgrade and Zagreb demonstrations erupt in favor of joining the war against an openly hostile Germany, but the shaky regime of Prince Paul maintains it position.

-- Game notes, (1) Italy and U. S. entry levels set at zero. (2) Next details to be worked out are research levels, alloted science chits, and (3) military stregnth of each participant. (4) Partisan activity and scorched earth --? Probably yes as in the Ukraine where they'd represent hardcore Bolshevik groups supplied by Stalin and pushing for a Soviet takeover. In Yugoslavia they'd form as they did historically.

All suggestions, ideas, criticism, etc. is welcome.

[ January 18, 2003, 12:41 AM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

[Scharfrichter]

Hi everyone and greetings from Germany, this is my first post on the forum .

I was playing around with the editor today to create a NATO/Warsaw Pact scenario (a bit like Red Storm Rising), unfortunately I encountered some probs:

Obivously, the Soviets are considered Allies in the editor so they couldn´t be the Warsaw Pact. Since the Germans are the baddies, I thought I could take them as the Warsaw Pact nation so I put the USSR and all former Warsaw Pact territories on "surrendered to Axis", NATO members "joined the Allies", edited some single terrain hexes (Czechoslovakia, Eastern Prussia) and placed units.

Unfortunately, the NATO/Warsaw Pact border is too close to Berlin (which is the "capital" of the "German Warsaw Pact"), and as soon as it is taken the "German Warsaw Pact" surrenders. I couldn´t find a way to set Moscow as the capital of the "German Warsaw Pact", so basically the whole scenario is doomed with Berlin being right at the frontline.

Is there any way to change capitals or to include a "government flees to xy" option?

Also, I am worried about the economics, the Soviet Union is regarded as "occupied by German Warsaw Pact" so all cities, mines etc are at 5 and with the current NATO settings (all join teh Allies) all countries become British, giving teh UK a huge income boost while the USA remains at the starting 180. There does not seem to be a possibility to "give" starting nations to the USA.

Furthermore, with Turkey being in the NATO they are within striking distance of the Soviet/"German Warsaw Pact" Caucasian oilfields, this could unbalance the whole thing.

Naval battles will virtually be pointless in this scenario, as the Soviet/"German Warsaw Pact" fleet would have to move through the Denmark/Norway/Scapa Flow gap, the Atlantic being under firm NATO control, and with Turkey being in the NATO the Soviet/"German Warsaw Pact" Black Sea fleet is trapped.

Any suggestions? :confused:

[JerseyJohn]

Scharfrictor --

First , good luck with the project, it sounds like a good one.

Second when you get a chance please express your naval views in my forum Hubert -- The North Atlantic the purpose of which is to improve that area of the game in future patches and revisions. With a little luck, SC II may incorporate some or most of the ideas.

[ November 28, 2002, 11:22 AM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

Originally posted by Scharfrichter:

Hi everyone and greetings from Germany, this is my first post on the forum .

I was playing around with the editor today to create a NATO/Warsaw Pact scenario (a bit like Red Storm Rising), unfortunately I encountered some probs:

Obivously, the Soviets are considered Allies in the editor so they couldn´t be the Warsaw Pact. Since the Germans are the baddies, I thought I could take them as the Warsaw Pact nation so I put the USSR and all former Warsaw Pact territories on "surrendered to Axis", NATO members "joined the Allies", edited some single terrain hexes (Czechoslovakia, Eastern Prussia) and placed units.

Unfortunately, the NATO/Warsaw Pact border is too close to Berlin (which is the "capital" of the "German Warsaw Pact"), and as soon as it is taken the "German Warsaw Pact" surrenders. I couldn´t find a way to set Moscow as the capital of the "German Warsaw Pact", so basically the whole scenario is doomed with Berlin being right at the frontline.

Is there any way to change capitals or to include a "government flees to xy" option?

Also, I am worried about the economics, the Soviet Union is regarded as "occupied by German Warsaw Pact" so all cities, mines etc are at 5 and with the current NATO settings (all join teh Allies) all countries become British, giving teh UK a huge income boost while the USA remains at the starting 180. There does not seem to be a possibility to "give" starting nations to the USA.

Furthermore, with Turkey being in the NATO they are within striking distance of the Soviet/"German Warsaw Pact" Caucasian oilfields, this could unbalance the whole thing.

Naval battles will virtually be pointless in this scenario, as the Soviet/"German Warsaw Pact" fleet would have to move through the Denmark/Norway/Scapa Flow gap, the Atlantic being under firm NATO control, and with Turkey being in the NATO the Soviet/"German Warsaw Pact" Black Sea fleet is trapped.

Any suggestions? :confused:

if your looking for a warsawpact vs Nato scenario, try 1962: Red October. As for the Russian black sea fleet, i believe a only made a token navy for them there. But as for the Northern Russian fleet, i have a strong navy in the baltic that if used quickly and effiecently can break out into the atlantic.

CvM

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

Also, great campaign John! Id love to playtest it for you! winnieisback@yahoo.com

CvM

[JerseyJohn]

Thanks Carl

I'd be honored. Will get to work on the project and hopefully I'll have finished by Sunday. Much of it is already done but I want to fine-tune a few things.

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

I dont mind the wait but in any case could you send a copy of the present file? I'd really like to see what you have so far.

CvM

[Scharfrichter]

Originally posted by JerseyJohn:

Scharfrictor --

First , good luck with the project, it sounds like a good one.

Second when you get a chance please express your naval views in my forum Hubert -- The North Atlantic the purpose of which is to improve that area of the game in future patches and revisions. With a little luck, SC II may incorporate some or most of the ideas.

Thx

I´ll have a look at the north atlantic thread

[Scharfrichter]

Originally posted by Carl Von Mannerheim:

if your looking for a warsawpact vs Nato scenario, try 1962: Red October. As for the Russian black sea fleet, i believe a only made a token navy for them there. But as for the Northern Russian fleet, i have a strong navy in the baltic that if used quickly and effiecently can break out into the atlantic.

CvM

Weird, my scenario keeps crashing to the desktop :confused:

But nice campaign, some good ideas there. I completely forgot to give everyone maximum tech .

How long did the balancing/playtesting take?

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

How long did the balancing/playtesting take?

Less than it took you to type that.

Btw, im serious.

CvM