Subvet Posted December 17, 2000 Share Posted December 17, 2000 Ok, even Jeeps are bogging to the point of immobilization on dry grass now. I drove 40 Jeeps fast 300 meters on dry grass. Two of them bogged to the point of immobilization. It's not just a problem with Jeeps, as my other vehicles/AFVs bogging in dry grass is what lead me to do the test with these Jeeps. Is this supposed to be this way now? It's a bit too easy to happen for dry ground in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turret Ring Posted December 17, 2000 Share Posted December 17, 2000 Yeah. Same thing happened to me last night with some Priests and Tigers. More realistic, or a bug????? ------------------ "Then we shall fight in the shade." (Greek general's comment upon being told that the Persian archers could blot-out the sun with their arrows.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanaka Posted December 17, 2000 Share Posted December 17, 2000 "dry grass" It's here that your thought goes wrong... Even a rally-raid driver, knows when he goes out of the road on purpose, nasty things can happen. The green thing you see, it's not exactly grass... Try to think in the bogging action like an abstract way the game has to deal with any other accident that could happen outside of a road, like a flat for instance... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
27ray Posted December 17, 2000 Share Posted December 17, 2000 I had 2 marauder III ' s bog on dry flat grass in my last game one becoming immobilized, this turned a tough game into a slaughter. This is curious. -ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subvet Posted December 17, 2000 Author Share Posted December 17, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Tanaka: "dry grass" It's here that your thought goes wrong... Even a rally-raid driver, knows when he goes out of the road on purpose, nasty things can happen. The green thing you see, it's not exactly grass... Try to think in the bogging action like an abstract way the game has to deal with any other accident that could happen outside of a road, like a flat for instance...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> The terrain was "grass" and the conditions were "dry" that's all I was saying. I realize that "grass" contains some dips, small bushes, etc.. That doesn't explain this very high incidence of bogging/immobilization that we are seeing now. Don't you think a 5% chance of immobilization for 300 meters of movement is a bit high. Seriously, if you drove 10km a majority of your force would bog/immobilize. This doesn't seem realistic for equipment that was made to travel like this. I've done quite a bit of "off-roading" myself in real life. I was never bogged to the point of immobilization in dry conditions. Never! There should be a chance of these things, but right now it seems to be set way to high for "dry grass" conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pillar Posted December 17, 2000 Share Posted December 17, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Tanaka: "dry grass" It's here that your thought goes wrong... Even a rally-raid driver, knows when he goes out of the road on purpose, nasty things can happen. The green thing you see, it's not exactly grass... Try to think in the bogging action like an abstract way the game has to deal with any other accident that could happen outside of a road, like a flat for instance...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> However, don't military vehicles use big THICK pure rubber tires? Aren't they DESIGNED for this type of offroad travel? I haven't had the problem yet myself, but I sympthize with those that have. Tracked vehicles especially shouldn't be paying any worries to dry field. I had the chance to drive around in an M60 offroad recently, and let me tell you, even the snow-covered, lumpy, THICK tall grass (weeds and stuff) that we went through had NO effect on the vehicle at all. Rather smooth ride actually (just rocks you back and forth). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subvet Posted December 17, 2000 Author Share Posted December 17, 2000 Test #2 For this test I used 10 M20 vehicles. I set them at the end of a 4,000 meter map and told them all to go to the opposite end using fast move. The map was grass and conditions were dry. Turn 1: 2 bogged within the first 200 meters Turn 2: 1 that was bogged became immobile, the other free. 3 more became bogged. Turn 3: 1 bogged and then freed itself. 1 that was bogged became free and the other 2 remained bogged. Turn 4: 2 that were bogged became immobile. 1 bogged and freed itself. 1 other became bogged. Turn 5: 1 already bogged became immobile. 1 more bogged. Turn 6: Bogged 1 becomes immobile. Turn 7: 1 becomes bogged Turn 8: Bogged 1 is free Turn 9: 1 bogs and becomes immobile Turn 10: 1 more becomes bogged and immobile. The last 3 make it to the end of the 4km. So out of 10 M20 vehicles seven became bogged and immobile and three made the 4km trip. This still seems way out of wack to me. I'll put money on my old '73 pickup truck to make that same trip without ever bogging down. We're talking military vehicles that were made to cross terrain like this. This needs a tweak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest KwazyDog Posted December 17, 2000 Share Posted December 17, 2000 Double Post [This message has been edited by KwazyDog (edited 12-17-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest KwazyDog Posted December 17, 2000 Share Posted December 17, 2000 Actually Subvet, Id take that bet on the pickup not making it across that terrain driving at top speed. Clear terrain does represent, as mentioned above, small gullies, rocks, logs, and holes. That being said though, Im not saying there isnt a minor problem here or more tweaks required. Out of interest Subvet, try that above test with standard move and see how it goes. [This message has been edited by KwazyDog (edited 12-17-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Madmatt Posted December 17, 2000 Share Posted December 17, 2000 I am doing some tests now on this issue and sharing the results with Charles. Too early to report anything yet though... Madmatt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subvet Posted December 17, 2000 Author Share Posted December 17, 2000 KwazyDog, I did the same test only at "move" speed (after redoing the number of turns in the game since 30 doesn't let you go 4km at that speed, heh heh). Five out of ten made it this time. I repeated and seven made it. One more try and six made it. So I'd say that lowering your speed to slow movement will definitely decrease your chances of becoming immobile in dry grass. The interesting thing here is that just as many vehicles became bogged, but at the slower speed they were able to free themselves. This seems correct to me, as hitting a rock/log at high speed would surely increase your chance of immobilizing your vehicle. It looks like MadMatt is on the case now, so lets see what he comes up with. I'm going to try the test with some tracked vehicles now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Madmatt Posted December 17, 2000 Share Posted December 17, 2000 Okay, seems Charles found something that was off. It will be fixed in next patch. Madmatt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subvet Posted December 17, 2000 Author Share Posted December 17, 2000 Well, it's now a moot point since their is a confirmed problem, but here are the results of my tracked vehicle test anyway: I used 10 M24 Chaffee light tanks and 10 M4A3(76)W+ Sherman tanks. The M24 has a ground pressure of 10.1 psi and the Sherm has 16.2 psi. I used the 4,000 meter map with dry grass for terrain and had the tanks use fast move. Only 1 M24 made the trip without bogging. 5 made it to the end in total without immobilization. 5 Sherms made the trip without a bog and 7 made it total without an immobilization. In the end the lower ground pressure vehicles seem to do the worst in dry grass. If you play before this is fixed keep this stuff in mind when purchasing your forces. Thanks MadMatt for checking into this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest KwazyDog Posted December 17, 2000 Share Posted December 17, 2000 Thanks for checking that out Subvet All fix up now according to Charles. Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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