maxm2 Posted May 15, 2000 Share Posted May 15, 2000 I already asked this of my gaming pal Mark Ezra (who plays both games) but wondered about any other opinions: In re-learning Steel Panthers: World at War (SP from here on) I was struck with the much lower accuracy and kill rate of SP armor compared to CM. Shots by stationary tanks at other stationary tanks five or six hexes away come up with odds of hitting in the range of 5 or 6% sometimes,and never seem to go above 25 or 30% unless the firing tank is sitting stock still and has been for at least a turn or two, and the target tank is similarly unmoving. I have even moved a tank up to an enemy tank on an adjacent hex and gotten a 3 or 4% chance of hitting a tank I've approached from behind! Even if I've got the mechanics of SP wrong, the flow of the battle is MUCH different from CM...in CM all my shaky-sighted SP tanks would be dead within a few shots of sighting each other! And I assume we have all had the experience of a StuG and a Sherman spotting each other in the CE scenario on the beta demo and knowing that one or the other might be dead depending on who gets their shot off first! ------------------ Max Molinaro [This message has been edited by maxm2 (edited 05-15-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ol' Blood & Guts Posted May 15, 2000 Share Posted May 15, 2000 Well, Max. Remember the range in SP is 50m per hex, I think right? So a tank 6 hexes away is 300m away. I believe this is the main difference. But I hear what you're saying. I tried playing SP:W@W and it was giving me heartaches just trying to kill a Russian T-26. It was like "Com'on! How many shots from a PzIII does it take to KO a light tank?" ------------------ "Why don't we say that we took this one chance, and fought!" "Stupid humans. Hahahahahahaha!" --from the film Battlefield Earth [This message has been edited by Ol' Blood & Guts (edited 05-15-2000).] [This message has been edited by Ol' Blood & Guts (edited 05-15-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxm2 Posted May 15, 2000 Author Share Posted May 15, 2000 Thanks for reminding me about the hex difference. As for "how many shots does it take...", lots, apparently. In CN, no matter what the range, it sure does seem like once a tank and another tank or gun have spotted each other, one or the other will be dead within a few shots. In SPW2, there are lots and lots of missed shots, and when they hit, maybe definitive damage and maybe not. It has certainly meant developing a whole new style of armor deployment for me. And hey, cool tag line, OBG! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Beman Posted May 15, 2000 Share Posted May 15, 2000 My personal favorite is CC3. I played a scenario as the Soviets; one of the first in which I had access to a T34. During the battle I moved the T34 up on a hillside, facing due W, to plonk infantry that were SW of the tank. A Pz35(t) came trundling out of some woods to the NW of the T34, about 300m distant. The T34 turned its turret and proceeded to fire 7 shots. 5 missed, 1 hit for no apparent damage, and 1 hit and killed some crewmen (during this time, the Pz35 sat idle; I guess it had been damaged before it could fire its first shot) Finally, the Pz35 managed to swing its turret toward the T34 and, with its first 37mm shot, knocked out the T34 on either the front-right hull or front¢er mantlet. DjB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Time Software Posted May 15, 2000 Share Posted May 15, 2000 I can't comment on SPWAW, but we based our to-hit equations on gunnery tests, weapons school tables, field experiments (esp. for moving firers and vs. moving targets), all backed up by reading first-hand accounts of action. I stand by our results. My guess is that, given the IGOUGO nature of SPWAW, the designers may have had to reduce gun accuracy below real-world levels or else, because a tank often gets 5 or 6 shots per turn, it would be too easy for the side which goes first just to wipe out the entire opposing force before it would even have a chance to return fire. So their accuracy numbers are (probably) unrealistically low, but in the "big picture" , due to the IGOUGO, they probably help balance the game and make it more realistic than using "realistic" to-hit numbers would. I know, it seems like a contradiction but it isn't. Charles [This message has been edited by Big Time Software (edited 05-15-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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