Mattias Posted June 12, 2000 Share Posted June 12, 2000 Making an assumption with regards to the TacAI here: Has anyone else noticed that the Shermans in VoT get awfully dodgey when around the 75mm bunker? It appears to me that when Shermans are in sight of the bunker but not in front of it or behind it (where they have a chance to kill it), they not only act as if they are facing an enemy that they have zero chance of killing (which is true from the sides), but also as if it is an enemy that is armed with a potentially deadly weapon (which is not true to the sides of the bunker). They therefore take evasive action, usually smoke and retreat, despite the fact that the bunker poses no threat to them. The question is, does the TacAI understand that the covered arc of the Bunker does not extend beyond the front 120 degrees? Or does it indeed consider the bunker a potentially deadly threat from all angles? Could be argued, I guess, that the tank crews does not know exactly what the covered arc is from a bunker just spotted. On the other hand, if it indeed “works” as it seems to me, it makes operations on the sides of bypassed bunkers a lot tougher than it should be. As it is now I find that “fast” movement is the only reliable (i.e. no defensive measures are taken) mode of movement as long as the bunker remain in LOS, even if I am well outside the covered arc to the sides of it. Something that opens me up to other possible defences nearby. M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scott Clinton Posted June 13, 2000 Share Posted June 13, 2000 Yes, I (and others) noticed this and there were a handful of posts about it about a week or so after the demo came out. I don't know if BTS is/was convinced there is/was a problem...or if it has already been fixed. But, you are not alone in your observations (FWIW). ------------------ Please note: The above is solely the opinion of 'The Grumbling Grognard' and reflects no one else's views but his own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Posted June 13, 2000 Share Posted June 13, 2000 Originally posted by Mattias: Making an assumption with regards to the TacAI here: Has anyone else noticed that the Shermans in VoT get awfully dodgey when around the 75mm bunker? Can't say that I've seen this problem. After 3 plays at VoT, I've seen the Shermans take out the bunkers with little problem. This is true with the AI controlling both sides. How close to the bunkers are you putting the tanks? The Sherman gunners are very accurate at long distances as long as you give them good angles to attack. Perhaps I've been luckier than you and others but try firing at long range and see if your tank crews are more at ease. ------------------ Blessed be the Lord my strength who teaches my hands to war and my fingers to fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattias Posted June 13, 2000 Author Share Posted June 13, 2000 Read again Wayne, I’m talking about the situation where you are at the flanks of the bunkers, not in front of, not behind. Then again, I am speculating as I don’t know what the exact cause for this nervous behaviour is. M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Posted June 13, 2000 Share Posted June 13, 2000 Originally posted by Mattias: Read again Wayne, I’m talking about the situation where you are at the flanks of the bunkers, not in front of, not behind. Then again, I am speculating as I don’t know what the exact cause for this nervous behaviour is. Sorry. Didn't read the question carefully. Comes from CM overload I guess. Does this happen in the presence of enemy infantry? Perhaps the tank crews are just nervous about enemy fausts and schrecks. ------------------ Blessed be the Lord my strength who teaches my hands to war and my fingers to fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Posted June 13, 2000 Share Posted June 13, 2000 Hmm, if the tanks are too dense to realize that being on the side of the bunker is safe, I do find that odd. I could understand if they were at 130 degrees and weren't quite sure if it was safe (that would be realistic, it's not like they are measuring the firing slit with a compass and piece of paper ). But if they are clearly on the side of the bunker, have good los and are at fairly close range so they can easily tell they are well outside the firing arc, then I think the tank crew should be smart enough to not see the bunker as a huge immediate threat (the bunker would still be a high-value dangerous target, but the tank crew wouldn't feel the need to take evasive action and pop smoke for no reason). But I think this would be the case only if all the conditions mentioned above were met and the crew could *clearly* see that they were safe for the moment. If there was any doubt in your mind, would you take a chance if you were in that tank? And I would expect green crews to be much more likely to be over cautious around bunkers, even if they were to the side of the bunker. Their lack of experience with these sorts of situations would most likely make them more hesitant and unsure of what the covered arc might be. Hopefully Charles can do a little tuning to take these factors into account for the specialized situation of a AFV facing an enemy bunker from the sides. Not a big deal, but it would be nice to have it be a tad more logical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murx Posted June 13, 2000 Share Posted June 13, 2000 When talking on unsure facts I would like to see more incorrect sightings in game. Like the sIG 150mm being disabled (cause they all got their heads and asses in the ground hiding the arty & MGs fire. And the the crew pops up and fires again. Maybe even recrewing abandoned guns/bunkers/vehicles - its safer for a infantry squad to fire from the inside of a bunker even if the build in MGs are defect then to hide in the forrest around it. I would like to see bunkers with better camouflage (not just that grey beton style as they werent like that most of the time) so ambush with the 75mm makes sense. It should be very hard to tell a wooden bunker from a concrete one! Just my opinion murx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattias Posted June 13, 2000 Author Share Posted June 13, 2000 I guess it boils down to there being a lot of aspects of the game that the demo, and hence our playing experience, might be too "limited" to really clarify. What seems like problems here might look very different when seen in the "big" picture. A good look in the manual, the full game and a lot of playing will no doubt tell. And soon with any luck, I just spotted a reduction of my bank account amounting to the price of 3 copies of CM M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
:USERNAME: Posted June 13, 2000 Share Posted June 13, 2000 I am playing a couple of email games where this is happening. I have a 76mm sherman behind both the concrete pillboxes and the sherman will not target them (besides using its mg). I will not get a "use main weapon" menu. The sherman decided to use its smoke though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertpat1 Posted June 13, 2000 Share Posted June 13, 2000 I like the idea of re-maning bunkers and wepons. ------------------ A 2x4 and a kind word work better than just a 2x4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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