Guest tom w Posted April 17, 2000 Share Posted April 17, 2000 Ok... We all know the Allies won the war and after reading that Doctoral Thesis on why SPR was not really all that historically accurate, we can assume that the allies have air superiority and plenty of help from LARGE naval artillary. Fine. That said, will CM give us a FUN game where you can enjoy picking the Germans and have a chance to win any of the scenarios offered in the Gold release? I really do enjoy the historical accuracy and detail put into the game. But, BUT I hope the there is "some" form of play balance that ensures that the choice to play the Germans, is not a choice to select a losing position or force. This may not be really historically accurate because, well obviously, in the big battles that really mattered after D-Day the Allies had, (as mentioned) air superiority and Naval Artillary, but do the Germans have a chance to win or do the odds always favour the Allies in the new scenario's in the Gold Master. My vote is for FUN and play balance OVER historical accuracy. I suspect the Gold Master is by now almost complete. My question is simply... (as perhaps policitical uncorrect as it could be here....) Will it be "FUN" or at the very least, fair to pick the Germans, in any given scenario, given the fact that they (as we all know) lost the war and generally did not win very many battles after D-Day? (Tiger killing 25 tanks aside, now that sounds like fun..) (BTW, where's the scenario that catches the Allied column on the road and the Tiger Picks off the first vehicle and the last vechicle and the rest are bunched so close the Tiger just goes one by one and takes OUT whole column, I understand that is historically accurate. I suspect some one here can tell me when and where that happened) And with regard to the Gold Demo may I suggest that Close Encounter be selected as the scenario of choice and perhaps the German Side be given some additional element (Armour, infantry, artillary or something ) to give it a little more play balance against those 5 damn Shermans. Thanks -Tom W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARCHANGEL Posted April 17, 2000 Share Posted April 17, 2000 Tom W, I take it you haven't WON CE as the German's yet??? It can be done. (Total Axis Victory) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest KwazyDog Posted April 17, 2000 Share Posted April 17, 2000 Hi Tom. The quick answer to your question is definately At the scale represented in CM the allies defiantely did have what could be describe as losses, when they were both attacking and defending (at this scale it did happen) against the Germans. Generally in scenarios you will probably find that the Germans are often outnumbered in a man for man basis, but often have somewhat more technology at their desposal. Also, being on the defense a good portion of the time they have this advantage as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Time Software Posted April 17, 2000 Share Posted April 17, 2000 Yeah, it is all a question of scale. At the tactical level the Germans generally have an ADVANTAGE. Well, at least if you design your own or pick battles where the Allies didn't do some sort of overkill during the battle. Strategically the Germans didn't have much of a chance, but tactically they certainly did. CM has that in a major way. And don't forget... what is on the Gold CD is only about 1/2,000,000,000th of the total possible scenarios (and I might be underestimating that ), so if you don't like what is on there do up your own or download someone else's. The random battle generator should keep everybody happy! Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MantaRay Posted April 17, 2000 Share Posted April 17, 2000 Steve I think 2 billion battles would just about sum it up. Any more and we may be heading into overkill. Ray ------------------ MantaRays 5 Pages Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tom w Posted April 17, 2000 Share Posted April 17, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ARCHANGEL: Tom W, I take it you haven't WON CE as the German's yet??? It can be done. (Total Axis Victory)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I can win CE with the Axis, against the computer, the AI is reasonably predictable. But I challenge any one to pick the Germans in CE against any human opponent with an understanding of what those 5 Shermans can really do. All the Allies have to do is trade their tanks one for one or even 4 for 3 and its over for the Germans in that scenario. I have found a couple of way to trounce the Allies when playing the Germans vs. the AI but in three games against a human opponent the 3 Stugs and the Germans just can't find a way to win. -Tom W P.S. Thanks Steve, I agree, on a tactical level there was historically, a German edge. So that will be GREAT. Thanks for the quick reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxhole Posted April 17, 2000 Share Posted April 17, 2000 what hapens when we finish our 2 billionth game. the CD will have no value. hopefully CM2 is out by then:cool greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SS_PanzerLeader Posted April 17, 2000 Share Posted April 17, 2000 TOM W said . But I challenge any one to pick the Germans in CE against any human opponent with an understanding of what those 5 Shermans can really do. All the Allies have to do is trade their tanks one for one or even 4 for 3 and its over for the Germans in that scenario. I have found a couple of way to trounce the Allies when playing the Germans vs. the AI but in three games against a human opponent the 3 Stugs and the Germans just can't find a way to win. OK man I'll take that challenge _ i'll happily play GERMANS - mail me the setup I have no trouble doing well as GErms - I don't win em all but a good portion ------------------ SS_PanzerLeader.......out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Peltz Posted April 17, 2000 Share Posted April 17, 2000 Germans at a disadvantage...hmm...yes, I can see that. Some of those disadvantages would be Tiger tanks, the MG42, the Panzerfaust, the Panzerschreck, crack SS and Fallschirmjaeger units. Those poor fellers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PanzerLeader Posted April 17, 2000 Share Posted April 17, 2000 Tom, the "battle" you are referring to is probably Villers-Bocage, when Michael Wittmann and his Tiger Company destroyed a huge amount of British tanks that were just lined up on the road, the crews having fun with the locals, enjoying a french breakfast... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted April 18, 2000 Share Posted April 18, 2000 Tom W, I've won CE playing as the Germans in PBEM games 3 times. I achieved 1 narrow victory and 2 rather easy victories. Ps. My opponents weren't newbies either. All three who chose to play as the Americans were experienced wargamers with at least ten years of experience each. You can win you just have to play smart and use what you have as effectively as possible. Personally I play almost exclusively as the Germans and don't find them in any way penalised in-game. You've got to remember that an army which loses strategically and operationally could still be one which dominates the tactical battlefield when going 1 on 1 with the enemy. P.p.s. Naval artillery only lasts while you're within 10 to 20 miles of the coast. Once you're farther inland than that it can't reach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest KwazyDog Posted April 18, 2000 Share Posted April 18, 2000 And aint that a bloody good thing Fionn I had a game where I managed to take the town which was the objective, repel an assult through a nearby forest and thought all was well until I heard the artey coming. 10 rounds near destroyed an entire reinforced company including armour. I hate that stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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