109 Gustav Posted October 17, 2000 Share Posted October 17, 2000 In a recent game I set up, two Regular 57mm antitank guns took out a total of three Panthers, 2 mk IVs, 2 halftracks, and some inf. It seems impossible that such a little gun could be so effective in real life. Comments? ------------------ Well my skiff's a twenty dollar boat, And I hope to God she stays afloat. But if somehow my skiff goes down, I'll freeze to death before I drown. And pray my body will be found, Alaska salmon fishing, boys, Alaska salmon fishing. -Commercial fishing in Kodiak, Alaska Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntelWeenie Posted October 17, 2000 Share Posted October 17, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 109 Gustav: In a recent game I set up, two Regular 57mm antitank guns took out a total of three Panthers, 2 mk IVs, 2 halftracks, and some inf. It seems impossible that such a little gun could be so effective in real life. Comments? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Did they have tungsten? With tungsten and their high rate of fire, they are deadly. Without it, they can still open a can of whupass on all but the heavier german armor head-on. From the side, Panthers are pretty vunerable, you know. ------------------ Cats aren't clean, they're covered with cat spit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnDeere Posted October 17, 2000 Share Posted October 17, 2000 The US version of the 57mm was a rifled design with a high muzzle velocity. In ideal conditions and certain degrees of armor angle and facings it could penetrate most armor plate of the time. ( also not mentioning its various types of shells available) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
109 Gustav Posted October 17, 2000 Author Share Posted October 17, 2000 No tungsten. I had then set up with one facing the probable killzone and the other one at an angle to it, so the shots to the panthers were to the sides. But even so... I'm definitley getting them when I do DYO scenarios. ------------------ Well my skiff's a twenty dollar boat, And I hope to God she stays afloat. But if somehow my skiff goes down, I'll freeze to death before I drown. And pray my body will be found, Alaska salmon fishing, boys, Alaska salmon fishing. -Commercial fishing in Kodiak, Alaska Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longshot Posted October 17, 2000 Share Posted October 17, 2000 In a book I recently read, it said that the US 3rd Army hated their 57mm AT guns. The book, which was a series of recollections by veterans, stated that the 57 was useless for anything, except the role of ambusher at very close range from the flank. In a sidebar it states that most of them were officially "lost" in France shortly after the breakout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PzKpfw 1 Posted October 17, 2000 Share Posted October 17, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 109 Gustav: No tungsten. I had then set up with one facing the probable killzone and the other one at an angle to it, so the shots to the panthers were to the sides. But even so... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Their you go Panther's only had 40mm on the hull sides, & 45mm on the turret sides. The Panther side turret armor was vulnerable to 57mm APC & 6pdr APCBC to 2400yrds, the side hull was vulnerable out to 2500yrds etc. APCR-T would be overkill vs the side armor ..... Regards, John Waters ------------------ "We've got the finest tanks in the world. We just love to see the German Royal Tiger come up on the field". Lt.Gen. George S. Patton, Jr. Febuary 1945. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PzKpfw 1 Posted October 17, 2000 Share Posted October 17, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Longshot: In a book I recently read, it said that the US 3rd Army hated their 57mm AT guns. The book, which was a series of recollections by veterans, stated that the 57 was useless for anything, except the role of ambusher at very close range from the flank. In a sidebar it states that most of them were officially "lost" in France shortly after the breakout.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Ayup, but in most cases the 57mm AT crews as in Bulge examples I have read tried useing frontal attacks vs Panthers and were knocked out, in an ambush on the side armor it was a deadly gun. 4, 57mms tonight in a QB where I let the AI buy everything tore up my 3 Panthers at 740ms down to 546m's they knocked out all 3 of my Panthers frontaly, 1 Panther took 14 hits in 1 turn on the glacis & turret front and lost its gun, and then was penetrated on the lower front hull, the Panthers took out 3 of the 57mms. I can only imagine what they would have done to my PzKpfw IVs . Regards, John Waters ------------------ "We've got the finest tanks in the world. We just love to see the German Royal Tiger come up on the field". Lt.Gen. George S. Patton, Jr. Febuary 1945. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishu Posted October 17, 2000 Share Posted October 17, 2000 I had yesterday 3 stuarts shooting my two JagdTigers and two King Tigers from range of.. hmm.. was it 1100 yards, and they got guns from both jagdtigers and blew up the turret from another king tigers (with one casualty) and another lost tracks and one casualty. All were frontal attacks (and I lost one PZ-II on two shots, one miss, one hit) Quite accurate 37mm and deadly Only casualties from allied side was two stuarts, both killed by 88mm AT-gun which their crew abandoned when they got suppressed and then were left those 3 stuarts that took my panzer army down to their knees. (I would have wanted them to go back after they were up for moving, but they didn't get on the gun, which was intact ) Funny thing is that none of my panzers hit them, but they hit even harder and more.. Forgot to tell, my panzers were elites while stuarts were regular/veteran.. [This message has been edited by Fishu (edited 10-17-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olle Petersson Posted October 17, 2000 Share Posted October 17, 2000 Assuming this is the American 57mm and not the British 6pdr (pretty much the same weapon)... As others have noted it was fair agaist flank armour of most tanks. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Longshot: ... the US 3rd Army hated their 57mm AT guns. ... most of them were officially "lost" in France shortly after the breakout.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> This is true for the armour divisions, that had a bunch of Bazookas for close AT support and Shermans for medium to long range support. They lacked riflemen though, so the gun crews hastily became riflemen in the armoured infantry. The regular infantry didn't have this extravaganza though, so they kept the 57mm guns. Cheers Olle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oddball_E8 Posted October 17, 2000 Share Posted October 17, 2000 I think that (just as the case is with stuarts) the problem is that in the war the crews of the 57mm just wouldnt try to shoot the panthers and stuff like that... they would just lay low and hope the tannks didnt see them and open up at almost point blank range... and if the tanks spotted them they would just run for the woods... they dont do this in the game tho... just my 2c (or about 75öre in sweden) ------------------ Wof, wof, wof, wof... Thats my other dog imitation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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