risc Posted October 30, 1999 Share Posted October 30, 1999 I would like to know which IIIG model is used in CM. I believe that the armor values for this assault gun are bit incorrect. All my sources say that the front Hull armor should be at least 80mm and the turret front should be as well at least 80mm thick. This is what I have for Assault III 40G (which is the IIIG) these values (mm): Hull Front : 85mm Side : 30mm Rear : 51mm Top : 20mm Turret Front : 82mm Side : 31mm Rear : 51mm The gun was either 75mm L/43 or L48. Could it be that the CM verions is an earlier version of Stug IIIG , which I'm not aweare off... Anyone else can verify this ? Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted October 30, 1999 Share Posted October 30, 1999 There are two StuG III Gs in tha game. 1 early and 1 late.. That's probably the confounding factor for this. ------------------ ___________ Fionn Kelly Manager of Historical Research, The Gamers Net - Gaming for Gamers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Michael emrys Posted October 30, 1999 Share Posted October 30, 1999 One further point: assault guns didn't have turrets. They probably meant upper hull in the figure they gave for "turret". Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted October 30, 1999 Share Posted October 30, 1999 The figers Peter gave are from a book and not from CM IIRC. Assault guns in CM have the right nomenclature attached to their various sections.. (I always used to get annoyed to see an armour rating for a Hetzer's turret GRRR ! ) ------------------ ___________ Fionn Kelly Manager of Historical Research, The Gamers Net - Gaming for Gamers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Time Software Posted October 30, 1999 Share Posted October 30, 1999 risc, Looks like our sources disagree with yours. What is your source? Ours are "The Encyclopedia of German Tanks" by Doyle, Chamerlain, and Jentz, and "Panzer III and its variants" by Spielberger. Also we do not list a "turret" for the StuG III. We list upper and lower hull. Charles [This message has been edited by Big Time Software (edited 10-30-99).] [This message has been edited by Big Time Software (edited 10-30-99).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
risc Posted October 30, 1999 Author Share Posted October 30, 1999 Hi Charles, I guess you are right, I wasn't aweare of earlier version of Stug IIIG. My sources were www.panzerlehr.com (no longer on-line) HPS wargames and encyclopedia, a couple of my games like Panzer Elite etc...but the issue was that I was looking at the data of the later version. When you say T. Jentz that's pretty much enough for me I have 2 of his books called Panzer Truppen...they are the best WW2 technical & panzer tactics books I have ever seen... Charles, can you maybe post more information about the earlier version of IIIG ? Thanks... risc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Time Software Posted October 30, 1999 Share Posted October 30, 1999 risc, I have both vols. of Panzer Truppen as well and they're excellent. Very interesting reading and data. We don't have the very earliest models of StuG IIIG in CM because they predate the June '44 timeframe. But we have a mid-production and late production model. The main differences between the two are that the late-production model gets: 1. A remote-controlled top-mounted MG42 instead of an MG that a crewmember must open a hatch to use. 2. A full 80mm of frontal armor rather than 50mm plus an additional 30mm bolted on. Armor produced in two separate parts and bolted together is weaker than armor forged in one piece, even though both are 80mm thick in the end. (We rate the bolted type as equal to 73mm of single-piece armor, so the later StuG is an improvement). 3. We give the late-model StuG schuertzen (armor skirts). Skirts were applied to many vehicles, not just the late models ones, but for game purposes we gave skirts to one and not the other for clarity. 4. Late-model StuG gets a (bear with my poor spelling on this one) nahverteigungswaffe - a close-range defense weapon roughly similar to a small mortar. Charles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingtiger Posted October 31, 1999 Share Posted October 31, 1999 Hello, Someone tell me more about the "nahverteigungswaffe " mentioned by Charles above. Please. Thanks in Advance, Richard Kalajian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon Posted October 31, 1999 Share Posted October 31, 1999 Nahverteigungswaffe - translation: close pasterize weapon Used in 1944 and 1945 to turn enemy troops into pastry. After the war has been modified so the shooter can select different flavors Nahverteidigungswaffe - "something like a mortar hanging on the outside of the tank" (Oh boy, I am in trouble now with all the experts out there ...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scott Clinton Posted October 31, 1999 Share Posted October 31, 1999 Nahverteigungswaffe: From the photos I have seen the thing is actually fired/loaded from inside the AFV. It looked like a flare pistol stuck to the side of the turret to me. The 'shell' could not have been too big, and I don't imagine it could have been reloaded that quickly either. All of the info on its real effectiveness is inconclusive. I wrote a set of 1/72 scale miniatures rules a year or so ago and ended up setting the things blast at about the same as a hand grenade. ------------------ The Grumbling Grognard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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