Broadsword56 Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 A question for all you OOB greeks and grogs out there: One of my op-level campaign games for Operation Epsom has a German OOB that includes units that either were deployed in that area on June 26, 1944 (or could have been deployed there because they were nearby). Available as a German support unit is the famous SS Heavy Panzer Battalion 101 (aka Schwere SS-Panzer-Abteilung 101). But the OOB in the game has them equipped with Mark V Panthers. I thought (and everything I've read) that this unit was equipped entirely with Tiger I tanks. They started with 45 of them, and then by the time of July 5 (after Villiers-Bocage) they had only 15 left. OTOH, I've read that when Epsom began on June 26, the main body of s.SS-Pz. Abt. 101 wasn't available immediately because the British attack on Rauray the previous day had led German commanders to believe the main attack would strike over there. Was it possible that some companies of s.SS-Pz. Abt. 101 had replaced some of their lost Tigers with Panthers, and that's what this OOB is representing? Or is that totally preposterous? It's no trivial matter, because a counter in this boardgame represents about 5 vehicles. The effect on the game of 15 Tigers would be considerable compared to 15 Panthers. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 Sounds like someone made a typo. AFAIK, the sPzAbts never had Panthers. Of course, one should never say never, especially when it comes to the Germans. I wouldn't be terribly surprised to find some occasion when a sPzAbt got issued Panther in lieu of Tiger, especially in 1945. But the Germans viewed Panther as a medium tank, to be issued to Pz Divs (and those dopey Pz Bdes), while Tiger was a heavy tank, issued to indendent abts (aside the few oddball allocations like Grossdeutschland and Pz Lehr). But in Normandy? Nah. Everything I've seen about the sPzAbts there was that they were 'pure' in terms of equipment. Out of interest, what is the game that has 101st equipped with Panther? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broadsword56 Posted June 11, 2012 Author Share Posted June 11, 2012 If I'd had to guess who'd answer my question first (and in record time, too)! Thanks Jon. The offending game is: "War in the Hedgerows:Operation Epsom, 1944" (Avalanche Press Ltd.) Contained in "The King's Officers" (A Campaigns & Commanders series supplement book) (Which I'm using to add an operational element and leader characters to the platoon-level boardgame Panzer Grenadier: Beyond Normandy). I'll post an alert about that to the relevant rules and errata forums for that game. Must have been a typo, because their OOBs are usually pretty detailed and researched. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonS Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 Ah, right. AP make nice games - I love their collections of mods and files for 3rd Reich. ISTR that there were/are a few glitches with the British in PG ... one of the least significant is the use of the Queen's Crown on all the British unit markers (instead of the King's Crown). I also noticed this in the dev notes on British tanks: ... specialized tanks included the Crocodile, a Churchill tank that traded its 75mm gun for a flamethrower and towed a trailer loaded with 400 gallons of fuel behind it. The Croc did tow a trailer, but the 75mm main gun was retained. The flamethrower was instead mounted in the hull, replacing the hull MG. Looking at the unit marker, though, it seems they actually got that right, even if they described it wrong. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkelried Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 I thought (and everything I've read) that this unit was equipped entirely with Tiger I tanks. They started with 45 of them, and then by the time of July 5 (after Villiers-Bocage) they had only 15 left. I have slightly different figures: by July 5 101st SS had lost 15 Tigers, by August they still had 25 left (21 operational). There was an idea to equip one company with Jagdpanthers in September/October 44, but this was abandoned and the company was (slowly) filled up with Tiger Ausf B (Kingtiger). Maybe this explains the mix up? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.X Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 The schw. SS-Pz.Abt.101 (later 501) was never equipped with Panthers, at no time. During June 1944, the Abteilung belonged to the I.SS-Pz.Korps (1.SS-Pz.-Div."Leibstandarte + 12.SS-Pz.Div."Hitlerjugend") and during the fightings, in some cases, the Panthers of SS-Pz.Reg.12 ("Hitlerjugend") fought side by side with the Tigers of the 101. Regards Frank 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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