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stealthsilent1

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Posts posted by stealthsilent1

    So which is the best spotter?

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    us-night-vision-1.jpg

     

    U.S. Forces will have an significant advantage at night, US infantry night vision combine both thermal and night vision and small arms can also be equipped with thermal sights, US thermal optics and night vision optics on vehicles are also superior to there Russian counterparts. Russian infantry only have access to night vision sights on there weapons or if they are recon night vision goggles, there vehicle optics are also inferior to that of the US.

    ok let's say it's a us vs us scenario. If one side has an obvious advantage, it's not much of a fight.
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    So which is the best spotter?

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    You've nearly got it: a sniper on the high intensity battle field is just another "normal unit". A small, possibly innoccuous-looking one that might get passed over in the target priorities for a team that's more likely to have MANPAT or other heavy weapons. And still infantry can move without necessarily just getting blown apart by 100mm airbursts. They just have to do it in full defilade, and be right careful about exposing their tender bonces over the crest so they can see where the enemy are.This is not StarCraft. There are no Ghosts. You say you've played this game before, but I don't think you've really understood it.When you do, there are half a dozen or more high tech defense contractors who would simply love to hear from you.Unfortunately, you've a thing or two to learn before you're going to be in a position to think of ways to sidestep IR sights, starting with "Yes, you can use it in the day". See also my point on thermodynamics.Wicky answered you. There are also UAVs. Or you could use an MBT.No you can't. And that's a good thing.

    Yea but is there a dedicated stealth scout unit? I know that this game is about sacrifice, but I don't like that, there has to be a way around sending my two man scout team to die everytime I want to know who's around the corner.

    :) yea you got some cool jokes, they are kinda cute kinda funny

    Yea but I thought in the day, your surroundings are as hot as you are. Maybe not under the canopy, but definitely in urban areas.

    Yea, but uav's don't work if they have anti air units which they keep on the back lines. How else are you doing to scout? You're going to be walking into an ambush everytime you want to move a unit.

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    So which is the best spotter?

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    In a vehicle rich environment you might be able to get away with a vehicle doing spotting. After all a Humvee, a panel truck and a family SUV are all the same distant hot spot on the IR monitor. In an warm body rich environment the distant hot spot on a hill could be a FO, or an infantryman, or merely locals watching the goings-on. Of course CMBS isn't exactly studded with civilian cars or civilian on-lookers.

    thats what I'm saying, night attacks are going to be hard to sneak up on the enemy and it's going to be about who has the best positions. The guy who was first in the building is going to have a big advantage over the guy coming around the corner.
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    Slow command, spotting, and fatigue

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    You are really confusing me now, what exactly do you have a problem with that involves the hiding and crawling command, I am going to break it down simply how they both work.

     

    "Hide"- Units will hug the dirt or whatever cover they are behind, this is an abstraction, while they are laying down it could mean they are pressed against a wall, occasionally someone will take a peak, while this command is active spotting is signifcantly reduced and they will not fire on enemies unless immediately threatened.

     

    "Slow"- Units will creep (Move slowly, staying low, whatever you want it to mean, they are taking there time) across terrain, this command makes them tire very quickly as it is taxing to move prone like that, situational awareness is reduced due to there proximity to the ground, however they are harder to spot.

     

    Womble is absolutely right, you are taking everything way to literally, there is no game on the planet that can model the things you want it to.

    i just have a problem with the reduced situational awareness on the hide command. It doesn't make sense in all situations.
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    Prepared positions?

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    I'm sure defensive positions like that have their uses in the modern battlefield, but their effectiveness would be degraded in a full-on war, especially with UAV reconnaisance, wouldn't it? Top-attack munitions, high altitude (orbital?) recon and precision strikes almost force you to use mobility rather than a few feet of earth to protect yourself. Israelis can probably get away with it vs their traditional enemies, if Egypt or Syria ever came over the border again (unlikely any time soon), and the Coalition can certainly use it in their current entanglements, but those foes don't have the tools the RF armed forces do.

    yea but in the game, you would move them in and out of that spot, so they don't get hit. And just get anti air for the uav's
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    So which is the best spotter?

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    With difficulty, and something that will be massively different and a challenge compared to WW2 titles.

     

    It will be when your scouts get shot at with 'splodey fings then you'll have the indication that they've stumbled upon the enemy. If you lucky your scout's sensors/ night vision will be superior to theirs and they'll live to tell the tale.

    yea but you can't count on that. The best way would be to have a lot of scouts, with each scout looking at a slice of the ground, with his flanks covered.
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    Why are there no guille suited scout snipers?

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    There's camouflage and camouflage. The last thing someone on the front line wants to do is stand out from the crowd. The same goes for officers. Aren't there rules against saluting a superior on the front line? Special clothing and special weapons make a person a target for another sniper. You get out of a Humvee dressed as bigfoot and you make yourself the preferred target for whoever may be viewing the scene from a distance. There's also the small problem of an infantryman spotting you moving around ahead of him and not recognizing you as a 'friendly'. So guile suits would be applicable in places where friendly infantry aren't shooting at shadows.  :)

    yea but that's my point, put them where there are no other troops. But yea, I mean, they wouldn't be useful walking. I'm not sure, but I'd just crawl them through the forest

      

    In practice from my experience at least, in the US Army CAB style Battalions, the Snipers usually simply became additional dismounted scouts for the Scout Platoon. While they still retain the ability to snipe, the actual utility of a sniper rifle in a high intensity sabots flying, tanks dying kind of fight is usually not worth the effort invested in employing it.  Also the high mobility aspect of mechanized warfare usually precludes the covert employment of snipers.

    youre probably right.
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    Changes to scout team and the assault command

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    There has been a lot of discussion about this.You mean suppressed. And there is your answer. You don't assault buildings without suppressing the bejazus out of them first. Not in a war zone. HRT/SWAT going into a building is not warzone tactics; nobody is looking out the windows (because of snipers) and the mooks inside are usually pretty much cannon fodder and outnumbered 5 or 6 to one. They also don't have neighbouring buildings providing supporting fires so can be attacked from multiple axes.Assault is just a sequence of Quick moves with the teams of an unsplit squad alternating. The Target command is the reason this is working, not the Assault command. My SOP for the assaulting team is for them to pause for 10s at the AS outside the door, with a Target order into the building. Because I split my Assault team off first, they have all the grenades, so use them freely. If you don't split squads that way (or at all), the individual teams have fewer grenades and so are less likely to use them.Yes. You need 2 to leapfrog 2 fire teams which is what the Assault order does (or 3 in the case of 12-man, 3-team squads). But you don't need to keep them combined in their squads, you can use Quick moves and Pauses to have split teams leapfrog each other.Depends on the TO and how you split your squad.

    youre probably right about the swat tactic, but I like the assault command because I could keep firing while my support guys and still shooting from behind, and I don't get suppressed. If I split the teams up, one team suppresses the other team, and the assault command doesn't do that

    That's my main thing, is that if I could use the assault team, and use the assault command with the assault team, they would suppress each other, and I can get close cover with automatics (maybe it doesn't matter in cmbs, but it did for cmbn) and grenades without suppressing my troops.

    But I like your technique of waiting 10 seconds ouside before going inside.

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    Slow command, spotting, and fatigue

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    Please. Please, please, please stop overthinking the game. It is a team level game with the elements of that team explicitly modelled. It is not an individual level game with all the activities of every individual explicitly modelled. Sometimes the tech allows the modelling to trickle down to the individual actions. It's the height of folly to expect every single aspect of the game to be depicted on the micro level. Note that the movement mode is called "Slow" not "Crawl"; it might behoove you to wonder whether that's because they're not crawling with their face to the floor and failing to keep an eye out. I've done my share of sneaking about in the woodlands and stealthy movement has a huge element of "knowing where the enemy are so you can stay out of their sight" situational awareness required. Slow troops maintain their situational awareness somehow and the exact mechanics are a) unimportant, and therefore B) below the abstraction layer.Remember the abstraction layer? I've mentioned it to you before. Please stop and think "Is this too detailed and dealt with below the abstraction layer," it'll save you asking a lot of questions where that's the primary answer.

    but you're just writing off things that don't make sense to the abstraction layer. Maybe you've got a point, but I can't see it. But that's exactly what you said right now. "It helps to know where the enemy is when you're crawling" or whatever. That's Exactly what I said in my hiding post. That when they hide, doesn't it help to know where the guys are around you, instead of hiding without looking. Maybe the mechanics aren't important, but the results are, especially if they don't make sense in the bigger picture. I don't see the bigger picture, I'm just tripping along in the dark, but I want to see it.
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    What is the point of an unmounted hmg on the modern battlefield?

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    They are different tools for different jobs. If you have to maneuver on foot, you'd choose the MMG most of the time. That's true in WW2 as well; I don't recall seeing any unit with organic .50Cal HMGs at any level up to Battalion; Maxim-type .30cal pieces, yes, but they're significantly lighter and even then don't do a lot of actual maneuvering in the face of the enemy. If you're setting up the defenses of somewhere like Camp Bastion, and you have the choice of Ma Deuce or GPMG on your sentry towers, you take Mr Browning's monster and accept the extra lifting required to put the ammo up the towers; that way you outrange anything the Talis have.You're missing the point, also, that getting through building walls and light armour is a huge advantage and an engagement that has neither hard cover nor vehicle support is going to be a rare one. The Afghan Mujahideen took russian 12.7mm pieces up himalayan goat tracks to the peaks of ridges between valleys so they could shoot downwards at Hind gunships, which were proof against that calibre from below. That's hauling heavy gear up steep inclines at altitude. It's that useful sometimes.

    i think you're right, they are useful because there are a lot of light vehicles and buildings. And it is a tool, just like everything.
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    So which is the best spotter?

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    Because that's impossible. You need to know about thermodynamics; it makes the world a lot less mysterious. Heat has to go somewhere. Usually, it radiates out or is convected away from a person. IR scopes will see that. If you insulate the person, the heat stays within the insulation. You can wear thick enough insulation to kill yourself on a June day and keep your IR signature low enough that you won't be any more visible than the rock you're crouched behind, but then you'd be dead of heat prostration. So you have to make the heat go somewhere else to cool yourself down. You could have a cooling loop in the suit that connected to a radiator by a long, insulated hose, so you could put the radiator in defilade somewhere. An old tabletop RPG Traveller posited a system where an aerosol can was used to cool the emissions from an insulated suit (expanding gas cools; mix that in the right ratio with the hot exhaust from the "personal air conditioning" and you're only kicking out air at ambient. While the general physics is sound, and they were probably exploring such tech back in the 80s when Mr Miller was making his game, I don't think anything has come of it, at least in the field of personal equipment.  Ghillie suits aren't, AFAIK, very effective against IR spotting. Something hotter than the background is brighter than the background. Active combatants are generally a fair bit warmer than ambient. End of. It's a fair point. So it would appear that the days of the human sniper on the full-on battlefield are numbered.Nope. Snipers are also there to eliminate key enemy personnel; they wouldn't train in marksmanship quite so assiduously if using that gun wasn't part of their job description. I know a guy who was what you're describing. He was, while serving, a forward observer for the RAF. He carried a pistol for self defense and relied on his stealth to remain alive in a combat zone. Not a sniper.Or you stay far enough away that shooting your BMG-calibre AMR/Winchester .308 magnum-load slinger won't expose you immediately, or you use a low-signature weapon from closer in and you displace after every shot.But as you noted, the sniper's role in a real modern battlefield would be compromised to the point of them being just another rifle, and the focus of CM really isn't the Snake Eaters anyway.

    yea but a normal unit would just get spotted, isn't there some kind of long range hidden observers? Or just something where it's not as obvious. Because I'm trying to think a way around the infrared vision. Sure you can't use it in the day, but in the night, how do you scout anything when everyone can see you from a mile away?
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    Why are there no guille suited scout snipers?

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    A high intensity conflict of manuever in Ukraine involving two of the most advanced militaries armored formations from Russia, Ukraine and the U.S. isn't really a place for a "guillied up" sniper to sit for a week and take shots at targets.

    no taking shots, just a guy who looks like a bush, and is hard to detect with infra red. Use those guys, crawl them up to the Forrest, and just stay there for the whole game, unless someone flanks me. Also, how do normal snipers eat and drink? Where do they get the food and water?
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    So which is the best spotter?

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    I hate to sound immature here but, so what?

    1, what's the point of a sniper if he is not hidden. That's all a sniper is. To shut up, act like a bush, and tell me where everyone is. I couldn't care less about his gun. I need guys, who are invisible. That's the whole point of. A scout sniper. I don't care about the sniper, I want some sentry that stays relatively invisible. I mean, you trade in being able to shoot, to being able to stay hidden
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    Prepared positions?

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    Yes, it's true. I meant to add that in my first post, but forgot.

     

    Same goes for sandbags and barbed wire.

     

    You've also got mines (can sometimes be spotted, but usually you find them the hard way) and Target Reference Points. Target reference points allow for arty missions without spotting rounds (SRs let your opponent know arty is on the way soon). So...your opponent doesn't know they're coming! Of course, he can't see where the TRPs are (they can never be spotted).

    dude I will use the hell out of barbed wire. It's so useful.
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    Prepared positions?

    in Combat Mission Black Sea

    Posted

    Quick note to folks new to the series:

     

    Foxholes and trenches for infantry must be spotted by your units to be seen. They do not change the terrain, but are denoted by graphics that appear on the map when they are spotted. The same goes for bunkers in the WWII titles.

     

    So, they are subject to full Fog of War, unlike the vehicle entrenchment "hack" we have been discussing for the last few posts.

    no way, you're joking. That's a lot more useful then.
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