MG miscount on the M3?

[Robart]

In the game the M3 is listed with 2 MGs but in the books I have the M3 is listed with 4 X 7.62 MGs. Is there something I am missing here?

[flamingknives]

Actually, that's a good point.

The model in game clearly has a turret MG, but is listed as having a bow and Co-ax only

[Siege]

yep, you need to clarify which M3 you are referring to.... there were a bunch.

The M3 Light Tank (Stuart) originally had 5 .30cal MG's, 2 in side positions, 1 on the turret, 1 on the roof and 1 coaxial... and later the 2 side guns were removed.

The M3 Medium tank (Lee) also had 4 .30 cal guns. 1 coaxial gun, 1 cupola mounted gun, and 2 barely visible guns in the lower front hull that were fixed to fire foreward only. I don't know how useful those 2 fixed guns were, and if they were ever really used... but you're right, they are NOT modeled.

I think it may just be calling the gun up in the commanders cupola the "Bow" gun, though it should be treated more like the remote gun on top of a late Stug, since the commander can operate it fully while buttoned.

Here is another question, I forgot to look at the crew size in the M3 Medium. Is it 7 like it should be?

Still, despite the shortcomings, it's nice to have that butt-ugly monster on the field. And it doesn't seem to operate too badly, even though it does need a couple fixes. I'll wait until the full version arrives before I pass judgement.

-Hans

[ November 22, 2003, 01:44 PM: Message edited by: Siege ]

[YankeeDog]

BFC has clearly chosen not to model fixed forward firing MGs on AFVs. This is actually not the first time this issue has come up. Early production IS-2s had a fixed forward firing MG that CMBB did not bother to model.

As far as CMAK goes, as has been noted the M3A1 Stuart, many of the iterations of the M3 Grant/Lee, and even some early production models of the M4A1 Sherman had fixed hull forward forward firing MGs.

As far as how useful these fixed MGs were, I think it's pretty telling that they disappear from new production tanks by early 1943 - obviously it was decided fairly early on that they weren't worth tha additional weight and production cost.

The fixed MG mounts on the M3 Medium, at least, were adjustable from inside the tank for elevation to a degree, but I think it was a 'set it and leave it' type of thing. That is, you adjust the mounting of the MG a bit to change the range at which the bullets would hit the ground, but you couldn't change elevation while firing, and of course you had no lateral flexibility.

My own WAG is that the things must have been pretty damn near totally worthless. Slewing the hull around would be a very difficult way to aim the MGs, and even minor changes in terrain pitch would throw the aim off.

In CM terms, I think fixed hull MG(s) might add to firepower a bit in area fire situations where the tank has a chance to line up and unload on a specific target area for a prolonged period of time, but other than that I don't miss them at all.

Cheers,

YD