Shelling units in buildings

[David Chapuis]

How effective is art/mortar fire against units in buildings compared to shelling them in woods/pines? I know if the building comes down then anyone inside is hurt bad, but that is hard to do with medium/small caliber art. It seems to me like buildings offer the best cover possible to art shells (as long as the building stands).

[Beta1]

You can drop buildings with artillery but its not very effective as you need a direct hit with smaller tubes. With the really big stuff close miss is enough though. Mortar fire isnt very effective. Best way to deal with troops in buildings is direct fire HE. Get something with a 75mm+ gun in position to area fire on the building. A light building should come down in 1-2 turns of 75mm. Heavy building need a couple of firers to drop quickly or ideally a larger gun. 150mm IGs are good building killers are the 90-105mm armed tanks.

[Slappy]

Sustained fire from onboard 81mm (even 50mm) will take down light buildings in a turn or two. Generally, when the building gets to ** the opposition will bug out. Offboard of less than 150mm tends to scatter too much to be useful. Direct HE is by far the most effective with 75mm+, as mentioned, what you need.

Remember to target the rear of the building with a MG to get them as they run out!

[YankeeDog]

To get to another part of your question -

Units inside buildings can be hurt and/or suppressed by Arty fire without the building actually being knocked over. The rule seems to be that if the unit is close enough to a wall of the building to see out of the building, then they are exposed enough to potentially take casualties from a nearby arty explosion.

It also appears to me that upper floor occupants are more exposed to damage from arty, but this may just be an impression - I've never actually tested this. Logically, given the way a typical artillery shell throws out shrapnel, this should be the case though. I also wonder whether upper floor occupants (or occupants in small buildings in general) are a bit more exposed because hit on the actual roof of the building might damage them, but I've never actually been able to confirm whether this is the case.

At any rate, from my experience units in the middle of the bottom floor of large heavy buildings are nearly invulnerable to Arty fire (Until the building actually gets knocked down, of course). Units on a corner of the second floor of a light building are actually fairly exposed and can be easily suppressed by even light mortar fire.

Cheers,

YD

[David Chapuis]

YD, that is what I was looking for. But even more specific would be better. Do you think they are more or less covered than in trees/pines/scattered trees. Obviously if the house comes down they are kaput.

[Slappy]

Far more covered than in trees. Treebursts, for one thing, don't apply.

[YankeeDog]

As Slappy notes, trees are generally a bad place to be during arty barrages. I've never done a test of *exactly* how much worse it is to be in trees as opposed to some form of cover that does not cause treebursts (like rough), but my own subjective experience is that infantry is actually better off taking cover in open ground than they are in trees. The problem is, unless they are in foxholes, infantry generally won't stay put under an arty barrage in open ground - they'll run for whatever the nearest 'cover' is, be it trees, building, brush, or whatever.

Large, heavy buildings are clearly the best place to be (other than far away from where the barrage is coming down!) and I would use these as shelter from all but the largest artillery. If you get very unlucky, a direct hit or two from really big stuff can knock a large heavy building down in a hurry, but this is rather unlikely.

Small, heavy buildings and large, light buildings give reasonable cover against lighter arty (especially if you get in the middle or opposite side of the building relative to the aim point of the barrage), but against big stuff (larger than about 105mm), building collapse can happen fairly quickly. Also keep in mind that once the building reaches "**" units will generally try to evacuate the building of their own accord, which can result in them running out into street in the middle of an arty barrage. Needless to say, this is very bad. For these reasons, I try to use these type of buildings as shelter against only lighter Arty.

Small, light buildings and peasant shacks are not good places to be during arty barrages - they collapse quickly under even 81/82mm mortar fire.

One final note: Rubble offers pretty darn good cover from nearly all forms of incoming fire, so once a building of any type has collapsed, the remains of said building are an excellent place to hide from arty - rubble after all, doesn't collapse if it gets hit a few times. . .

Cheers,

YD