rexford Posted February 3, 2001 Share Posted February 3, 2001 Jentz book on North Africa has some penetration ranges vs. Italian tanks including M13/40, and comparison of penetration at range to armor thickness identifies a horde of possible shatter gap cases. All shots and penetration data at 30 degrees to armor. 1. Hull front superstructure, 1300 yards penetration is 35, armor is 30 at 11 degree 2. Mantlet, 600 yards penetration is 49, armor is 37 round 3. Hull front, 800 yards penetration is 45, armor is 30 round 4. Turret side, 1400 yards penetration is 33, armor is 25mm at 22 degrees 5. Hull and Superstructure side, 1600 yards penetration is 30, armor is 25mm vertical Since Italian armor was very brittle, and penetrations would normally kill the entire crew due to flying armor fragments, it is not likely that Italian armor had quality factors above 1.00. This suggests that 2 pounder penetration range was actually somewhat greater than the tests. If above test results are picking up point where penetration is 25% greater than armor resistance, and hits just beyond beyond that range fail due to shatter gap failure, the following shatter gap ranges could be presented (30 degree lateral hit angle): 1. Hull Front Superstructure 2 pounder AP penetrates to 1300 yards, fails to about 1600 yards, penetrates to 1700 yards Armor quality about 0.93 2. Mantlet penetrates to 600 yards, fails to 1000 yards, penetrates to 1100 yards Armor quality is 0.94 3. Hull Side penetrates to 1600 yards, fails to 1850 yards, penetrates to 2050 yards armor quality is 0.96 --------------------------------------- 2 pounder AP against front hull of M13/40, zero degree lateral angle penetrates to 1600 yards fails to 1900 yards penetrates to 2000 yards Above analysis assumes that 2 pounder follows same shatter fail pattern as U.S. 76mm APCBC. ------------------------------------ If 2 pounder AP were firing at 30+30 front plate on PzKpfw IV with zero lateral angle, it would penetrate to 300 yards, fail to 550 yards, and penetrate out to 660 yards, based on U.S. 76mm APCBC pattern. From 300 to 550 yards would be the "shatter gap" where "should be" penetrations would result in shattered failures. If a gamer knew the shatter gap real well, they could close with PzKpfw IV to the 300-550 yard range and fight from there. It's good to know things better than the actual tankers (although German tankers might have noticed that killing hits were bouncing for some odd reason, the British certainly noticed). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest machineman Posted February 3, 2001 Share Posted February 3, 2001 Originally posted by rexford: Since Italian armor was very brittle, and penetrations would normally kill the entire crew due to flying armor fragments, it is not likely that Italian armor had quality factors above 1.00. For all the bad rap the Italians got in WWII, I'd say there was no one braver than the tankers that fought in those pieces of junk... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeT Posted February 3, 2001 Share Posted February 3, 2001 I have to agree with machinegun here. The research I did for the DFDR mod showed that most Italians were poorly equipped and poorly led but were man for man as brave under fire as any. MikeT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GriffinCheng+ Posted February 3, 2001 Share Posted February 3, 2001 Well that is why Italian M13/40 was referred as "iron coffin" by its crew. However, I saw a photo where a number of these captured M13/40 were used by Australians and pursiting the fleeing Italians in turn. Griffin. ------------------ "When you find your PBEM opportents too hard to beat, there is always the AI." "Can't get enough Tank?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claytonious2 Posted February 3, 2001 Share Posted February 3, 2001 You guys should read the novel "Easter Day: 1941" by Borden. It is an excellent novel about the crew of a captured M13/40 trying to make their way to Tobruk. You won't be able to put it down! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forever Babra Posted February 3, 2001 Share Posted February 3, 2001 For an excellent debunking of the "coward" myth, there is a very good essay in the anthalogy "Time to Kill", which analyzes the Italian army at various points in the war. Definitely worth a read. Don't know about your numbers, Rex. It's all Greek to me -- I'll just have to take your word for it ------------------ ...and Kingmaker taught me that if you go to any town in Britain, sooner or later the plague will get you. - Offwhite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts