Guest Thomas William Davie Posted February 2, 2000 Share Posted February 2, 2000 Fionn; I was curious as to how I should evaluate the AI (or what I perceived to be the AI in the game). At first, I could't quite get the pbem turns to act as normal turns, and then with a debugger and hex editor I was able to play a pbemxpbem game comp .vs. comp. But, I'll grant you this; I'm as curious as hell to see what's next up on the plate. Tom ------------------ email address: thodavie@videon.wave.ca Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted February 3, 2000 Share Posted February 3, 2000 That's what I figured Tom. Actually what you did was create a game in which there was NO COMPUTER OPPONENT.. When you play vs a computer you are playing against three layers of AI.... 1. Tactical AI, 2. Strategic AI 3. Operational AI HOWEVER when you started those two games the ONLY layer of AI which was functional is that layer which is always functional (even in human vs human games) and that layer is the TACTICAL LAYER. What you construed as the Operational and Strategic AI inactivity was actually nothing more than the fact that once the tactical AI got the various units out of LOS and lines of fire it decided to do nothing more with them since the TacAI is ONLY concerned with making the individual squads act intelligently but completely individually. In other words, while you THOUGHT you had created a way to test the Strategic Ai what you actually did was start a game in which BOTH SIDES had : 1. Strategic AI and 2. Operational AI TURNED OFF . IOW you weren't testing what you thought you were . It was an elegant solution though and a damned smart workaround which might have worked if only things were done differently. To prove it to you just let me say that in a human vs human game no Strategic or Operational AI is needed since these roles are performed by the human player THUS in PBEM games the Strat and Op AIs are turned off and thus when you created these PBEM games the Strat and Op AIs were also turned off THUS the ONLY AI decisions you saw being made were Strat AI decisions. I'm willing to bet that once the Germans got into cover you never saw them advancing and that they never called down artillery fire using their FOs correct? Tank movement doesn't matter since they might decide to charge MG placements etc under Tac AI control. Good try though Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoolColJ Posted February 3, 2000 Share Posted February 3, 2000 I wonder if its possible to save a single player game...then hack the save file to change the player control to the other side, then load it up process, save and then repeat - sort of like a AI vs AI I admit I'm scared to play a Human! ------------------ CCJ aka BLITZ_Force My Hompage ----> http://www.geocities.com/coolcolj Double your immersion with my Tweaked Textures and Saving Private Ryan sound set mods for CM!! Check out my music while your there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Captain Foobar Posted February 3, 2000 Share Posted February 3, 2000 two questions... 1) What are the roles of Strategic AI, as opposed to Operational AI? I have never heard them clearly defined. 2) I have heard the "sneak" command described as "slowest movement, highest interest in combat." Would that Flanking move have worked if the squads were ordered to "move" through the woods? (obviously I am asking for conjecture, thoughts?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Thomas William Davie Posted February 3, 2000 Share Posted February 3, 2000 ----quote---- In other words, while you THOUGHT you had created a way to test the Strategic Ai what you actually did was start a game in which BOTH SIDES had : 1. Strategic AI and 2. Operational AI TURNED OFF . IOW you weren't testing what you thought you were . It was an elegant solution though and a damned smart workaround which might have worked if only things were done differently. ----end quote---- Yeah, I thought I had things all worked out, and I did manage to get the turns processing, but the AI did nothing other than fiddle faddle about. The German infantry hovered on the edges of the woods line, no artillery was ever called down, and the tank did move about (they did lob a few shells at US positions though). ----quote---- I'm willing to bet that once the Germans got into cover you never saw them advancing and that they never called down artillery fire using their FOs correct? Tank movement doesn't matter since they might decide to charge MG placements etc under Tac AI control. ----end quote---- As per my above statement, yes that sounds like it. But I had to try. What CoolColJ states below sounds like its worth a go. Of course, it would be a lot easier, and I wouldn't spend hours staring vacantly at a screen trying to do the impossible if an AI .vs. AI option was put in the game (difficult? impossible?). CoolColJ: what you say might work, but you need to hack with a hex editor and/or debugger. At least thats what I was trying with the pbem files. Tom ps Metrowerks rules ------------------ email address: thodavie@videon.wave.ca Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbg2112 Posted February 4, 2000 Share Posted February 4, 2000 BTS wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>(we would of course love 6 months to do nothing but AI ).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Let's put it to a vote, as we did for TCP/IP. (Lest anyone think I'm serious, let me be the first to vote against this.....) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Thomas William Davie Posted February 4, 2000 Share Posted February 4, 2000 If there's a vote, I'll gladly pay double and wait 6 months for a vastly improved AI above and beyond what they've got (whatever it is). Tom ------------------ email address: thodavie@videon.wave.ca Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoolColJ Posted February 4, 2000 Share Posted February 4, 2000 Or we can get the game now, and wait for an AI patch Or expansion pack ------------------ CCJ aka BLITZ_Force My Hompage ----> http://www.geocities.com/coolcolj Double your immersion with my Tweaked Textures and Saving Private Ryan sound set mods for CM!! Check out my music while your there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Thomas William Davie Posted February 4, 2000 Share Posted February 4, 2000 CCJ: True, but I can wait, I'm in no hurry. Tom ------------------ email address: thodavie@videon.wave.ca Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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