Paper Tiger
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Posts posted by Paper Tiger
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Quote "Paper Tiger, no one is this thread is suggesting that QBs use randomly generated maps"
neither am I. My understanding of your argument is that we're not going to get them so it's a moot point. The same goes for picking your own units.
Quote "The suggestion on maps is that we get to directly select them."
And I agreed with you, 100%
Quote "So, not really sure what your post relates to, as I never raised anything about the AI."
Ah, now there you have me. I'm still new to the conventions of forum posting. Those particular remarks were adressed to pcelt and KNac who have contributed to this thread that the operational AI is broken or missing. I should have addressed these remarks to these two gentlemen. So apologies to you.
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Oops. perhaps "angry" was too strong a word. This is a very reasoned thread so forgive me if that's too strong. I should have used "too disappointed"
cheers
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I am not convinced that the QB system is broken, bugged yes, but not broken. Unlike the old CMx1 games, you can't really just click and play. You need to have specially designed maps to do so. This means that there must be a functioning Strat AT plan set by the map designer or the AI units will just sit there and do nothing.
Also, the operational AI is not broken or missing. The manual states that the operational AI 'co-ordinates and assigns' these orders to the sub units within the group. So, without a working Strat AI plan for different groups, there's nothing for the operational AI to do.
The old system is gone. We can be sad and mourn it's loss but let's not be angry until we've given the new system some time to see what it is capable of. Until some of us in the community start designing maps specifically for QB, the QB option is pretty boring. I don't know yet but it could be that the new QB system will be infinitely better than the old CBx1 once we have some dedicated maps with varied AI plans.
I agree that it would be better to allow us to choose the map that we want to play on.
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Yes, count me in for this too. Stuff drops off the first page way too fast...
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That WOULD be cool! However, what I meant was being able to see everything that the computer player was doing regardless of whether any of my units had LoS to them, the exact opposite of Fog of War. If the AI sets up out of LoS of my units, I can't see what they're doing and so, correct any small mistakes with orders.
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Yes, it is. I don't think that's going to change either for some time either. Maybe we'll get it for WW2.
However, there does appear to be quite a lot of subtlty built into the AI orders which it will take scenario designers some time to master. I don't really understand them yet but the AI will execute an order in very different ways according to the instructions given. I was watching one of my experiments unfold and the AI wasn't moving on to the next objective but just pouring fire on the enemy position. When I checked the orders, I had given them lots of time to move on the next objective and a 'caution' order so before moving, they put down a lot of suppression fire. Quite nice...
The scripting for the moment is better used for the Red side because they will have less chance to "shape the battle" and react to unexpected enemy actions.
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Just completed it this morning. Very nice situation. Nice map. I took it very slowly ... only way to go on RT Elite
**********SPOILER ALERT *************
I got a total US victory, casualties were as follows:-
Blue side 4 KIA Red side 17 KIA
13 wounded 37 wounded
2 vehicles totalled >
I set up one platoon in the woods on the left and gave them hubt orders. Didn't take long to find something. After a short but fierce firefight, I cleared the woods and set up in the buildings on the roadside and waited until the other team made it's way into the village.
They moved slowly too, leap frogging through the buildings supporting each other until they reached the big three-story in the centre. Moving to the top floor, they found a lot of targets and things got exciting for a few minutes. Fortunately, the first team came to the rescue, flanked the defenders and we all moved on the main objective before time ran out and total victory was mine... for a change.
Never got a chance to use the artillery support. I guess I forgot about them once the **** hit the fan.
****************End **************
Once again, nice one. Very enjoyable infantry only action. I'd like to see more if you have the time.
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Just completed it this morning. Very nice situation. Nice map. I took it very slowly ... only way to go on RT Elite
**********SPOILER ALERT *************
I got a total US victory, casualties were as follows:-
Blue side 4 KIA Red side 17 KIA
13 wounded 37 wounded
2 vehicles totalled >
I set up one platoon in the woods on the left and gave them hubt orders. Didn't take long to find something. After a short but fierce firefight, I cleared the woods and set up in the buildings on the roadside and waited until the other team made it's way into the village.
They moved slowly too, leap frogging through the buildings supporting each other until they reached the big three-story in the centre. Moving to the top floor, they found a lot of targets and things got exciting for a few minutes. Fortunately, the first team came to the rescue, flanked the defenders and we all moved on the main objective before time ran out and total victory was mine... for a change.
Never got a chance to use the artillery support. I guess I forgot about them once the **** hit the fan.
****************End **************
Once again, nice one. Very enjoyable infantry only action. I'd like to see more if you have the time.
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Would it be possible, sometime in the future, to include some sort of God Mode for us scenario designers to watch the AI perform it's orders, see everything, regardless of LoS etc?
This is not a priority for anybody, I know. I know that others have far more urgent needs. But is it possible for a module?
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It seems to me that you Battlefront guys are REALLY locked in to this hypothetical Syrian campaign. I really like the game but I don't "believe" in the scenario. Forgetting for a moment the urban COIN forces, there is no real challenge for the US in Syria. The US army will blow the Syrian Army away. Sure, it might get ugly but US Air Superiority and know-how will ensure that the Syrians never get any strategic advantage.
The resurrection of the Russian military that we're seeing now is quite an interesting one for us too. I'd much prefer to see the full gamut of modern Red Force equipment instead of restricting it to just Syrian equipment. And then let us do with it what we will.
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I think this is the best solution for the future of WEGO. However, it would probably require a huge amount of work to implement.
One minute is good for WW2 but in in this time period, in one minute, you can lose your entire force. It's just too long a time to be out of control of your troops. (yeah, I know you can give them REALLY detailed orders but I'm talking about the unexpected here)
I really like playing RT but I DO miss the replays so I will play WEGO occassionally just for that
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Nice experiment there. I've been doing some of my own too while I'm waiting for the patch. It's probably unfair to compare the AI in CMx2 to CMx1 because it's an entirely different creature.
I used to try my hand at designing scenarios for CMBB for myself and I often wished that I could issue some orders to the computer player to make it attack more effectively. With CMx2, now I can. However, the AI will execute my plan come hell or high water until the computer side is stuffed or the plan itself is finished. It plays like a robot: it will do exactly what you tell it to do and once it's finished, it will sit and do nothing unless trouble comes to them.
I'm not very sure I'd be too happy if the AI decided to act on its own initiative when it ran out of orders because, as you have pointed out, it's probably going to do something insanely stupid and get itself killed. And then we'd be complaining about that instead. "Why do my tanks reach their objective like I planned and then wander off in a random direction and getting killed!" etc etc etc...
There are real limits to what we can make the AI do at the moment. For now, my best idea is to keep the time of the scenario short so that plans can remain active. I'm not that good a player and it's hard for me to see how the situation will develop after 1 hour of gameplay. For a 20-30 min scenario, the limited number of orders we can issue can be used to make a more interesting plan. We'll just have to learn to work within the situation until the options are expanded.
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Hi
I've been performing some experiments with programming the AI in the scenario editor and I'm stumped. How do you use the Exit After/Exit Before commands?
Actually, I don't have a problem with the Exit Before command, it simple tells the unit how much time it's got to reach it's objective. However, I'm getting very different results with the Exit After command. It doesn't seem to be consistent in it's results.
Here's what I know...
Exit After in the Set Up order will delay the units first order by the time specified. No problem. But thereafter, I really don't know what's happening.
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Hi folks
I've been playing Battlefront games since CMBO and have been reading the forums for a long time but have never bothered to post. I was, and still am, a great fan of the old CM1 games, particularly CMBB. Loved the theatre of ops...
Anyway, I downloaded the demo first to make sure that it ran with my Vista 64 Home Edition operating system and had no problems. Once I knew that the game would play, I downloaded it and have been playing every day since.
Yup, there a bugs but I haven't seen a game released in a long time that didn't have any. No, it's not CM1 but then I wasn't expecting it to be either. I was hoping for something better and it works for me. And my years of experience with CM games tells me that most of the issues people have will be dealt with in a couple of patches or three (I'm not expecting anything major next weekend anyway)
I know that it's just my opinion but I think this game is WAY cooler than the CM1 games. And it's only going to get better as time goes by.
My favourite feature is the new editor. I love designing scenarios and the new AI scripts make some really incredible things possible for the future. However, it'll take me a while to get anything created that's playable. I will never knock the CM1 games because I still love playing CMBB but I think the new AI scripting will make intelligent AI attacks a real possibility. For the record, I have NEVER lost a CMBB QB battle when the AI was attacking because it couldn't do anything intelligent. Clever use of objective flags by the designer could help the AI make a more realistic attack but this can't happen with a QB.
I love the new CC2 in the game too. I am currently playing through the tutorial campaign for the second time in RT with Elite (first time in sissy Boot camp mode) and it is a completely new, and exiting experience. I think I'm going to prefer this style of play in the future once the new UI and the camers is second nature to me.
So, to conclude, I would like to say a big thank you to Battlefront. Looking forward to the patches and the expansion too. I'm not too sure my wife approves though as she's not seeing so much of me as before.
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Yeah. They're practically part of the US Army already
Quick Battles
in Combat Mission Shock Force 1
Posted
dalem; Once you have a stock of prepared maps, it is just as quick as the old system. I played through two of the stock maps this morning and only clicked a handful of times to get there. Of course, it wasn't a particularly challenging experience
I think we'll all feel a bit better about the QB option in a couple of months after some quality maps with programmed AI are designed by the community. Until the patch from Paradox arrives, I'm spending much of my game time experimenting with QB maps.