arby Posted August 27, 2002 Share Posted August 27, 2002 Originally posted by harala: tell me if iam missing something but i have a feeling (from reading this forum) that most people "prefer" (in a pbem game, playing axis, all politics random) taking denmark and norway before france in the 1939 scenario... i dont really see the point of taking denmark and norway since they dont really contribute anything to the german war effort. the DoWs just make US and USSR more angry. i know norway has some nice ports near great britain but is it really worth it? how about poland, france, hungary, romania and spain? in that order.Turn 1, invade Poland, move corps from Hamburg to Danish border. Turn 2, take Warsaw, DOW on Denmark, use fleets and 1 or 2 air units to hit Copenhagen, move 3rd air unit up near Hamburg, attack Copenhagen with corps. You won't usually destroy unit, but you'll knock it down to 5 or less, and it can't be reinforced above 5. Turn 3, use corps to mop up Poland, if necessary. Operate all army and tanks to French border. (You may be able to save some MPP's by moving the tank groups there by normal movement.) Attack Copenhagen with ships and two planes, moving 3rd plane into attack position for France. Usually enough to finish it off, allow corps to walk in. Turn 4, use plunder from Poland and Denmark to buy additional tank and air, reinforce all other units. Turn 5, attack Low Countries and France. The longer you wait to attack France, the longer it's going to take to conquer it. I've seen skilled Allied players hold out until October and even November 1940. If you attack by the January turn 1940, you can usually take it by May. Then you have plenty of time to screw around with Norway and Sweden and the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arby Posted August 27, 2002 Share Posted August 27, 2002 Originally posted by Wolfe: Ok. A few relationships I've noticed. As Axis (on default settings in the '39 campaign): * Some success in France will bring the Italians into the Axis camp. I think this is a little more random than that, although as a general rule I think it's true. I've had one game where the Italians DOW'd before Germany had even set foot in France. I've had others where the German player was fighting in France for months, and the Italians never intervened. But, as I said, as a general rule you're right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
googabooga Posted August 27, 2002 Author Share Posted August 27, 2002 arby: you are right about attacking denmark after poland. its my "standard" opening these days and it goes exactly as you described. -antti Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good Soldier Svejk Posted August 27, 2002 Share Posted August 27, 2002 Fascinating stuff, and very important since, as has been said, the manual is silent on these factors (you even have to read between the lines to find that there is a gauge for the entry of Major countires in the war). Anyway, I've had two things happen to me when playing single player that I'd like an opinion on: I was Axis on both occasions. On one occasion, after knocking off France and Poland, I stumped through Denmark and Simultaneously Yugoslavia and Sweden. I then declared on Greece. The only ally I had at the time was Italy. In the same turn, I got the "Russia Prepares for War" message and then got the "Russia Declares War" message. This was all before I knew about the "war meter," so wasn't watching for effects. However, if I read the claims right, taking Sweden, Yugoslavia, Denmark, Poland, and France won't bring a Soviet DOW, correct? So it must have been Greece that was the difference (this seems a bit odd)? Second, can countries like Yugoslavia declare war on the Axis? I swear that in the first game that I ever played, I ignored Yugoslavia, but then it declared war on me (hostile units showed up there--I guess it joined the allied side: dumb considering that Bulgaria and Rumania had recently joined the Axis camp). Is there some way to gauge when something like this will happen? If so, what are the criterion for something like that? Salute! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arby Posted August 27, 2002 Share Posted August 27, 2002 Originally posted by Good Soldier Svejk: Anyway, I've had two things happen to me when playing single player that I'd like an opinion on: I was Axis on both occasions. On one occasion, after knocking off France and Poland, I stumped through Denmark and Simultaneously Yugoslavia and Sweden. I then declared on Greece. The only ally I had at the time was Italy. In the same turn, I got the "Russia Prepares for War" message and then got the "Russia Declares War" message. This was all before I knew about the "war meter," so wasn't watching for effects. However, if I read the claims right, taking Sweden, Yugoslavia, Denmark, Poland, and France won't bring a Soviet DOW, correct? So it must have been Greece that was the difference (this seems a bit odd)?One of the things the manual doesn't tell you is that the Soviets will declare war if the Eastern Front isn't properly garrisoned. I think I read here that that means at least 2 units in 1940 and 3 units in 1941. I know the former is correct; not sure of the latter. Second, can countries like Yugoslavia declare war on the Axis? I swear that in the first game that I ever played, I ignored Yugoslavia, but then it declared war on me (hostile units showed up there--I guess it joined the allied side Yugoslavia will, unless taken earlier, ALWAYS have a pro-Allied coup in April of 1941. That's what you saw happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
googabooga Posted August 27, 2002 Author Share Posted August 27, 2002 Svejk: it IS kind of strange if russia gets angry about greece but one can also question the usefulness of greece. i have never taken greece prior to russian entry. i try to avoid unnecessary DoWs in southeastern europe before russia enters the war. after russia has joined the war i let some crazy italians do their job in the mediterranean -antti Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
googabooga Posted August 27, 2002 Author Share Posted August 27, 2002 at this moment iam playing a very interesting pbem game. its quite unusual in the way that we are both using unconventional (at least thats what i believe) strategies. i (as axis) have a monopoly on north atlantic with my 7 level4 adv. subs because allies have lost too many carriers and battleships. i think it takes too long for western allies to get those subs out of there so i think iam safe from the dirty americans it was a gamble in the beginning with the subs but at this point seems to be worth the MPPs.... on the eastern front my opponent is using the "AI strategy" of building hordes of corps. because the subs took too much MPPs from me, when russia declared war on me i had only 5 tanks 5 armies and two hqs there. my "barbarossa" started too slow and now iam totally bogged. after a year of slugging each other ive managed to capture only one city. i always thought that it was stupid for the AI to build just corps. under human control it seems to be working quite well. or iam not any good SC player. (remember that at this point i can throw almost every MPP to the eastern front since i have no threat from the west) am i correct in saying that not too many have tried the sub strategy with axis against a human opponent (and succeeded)? or not too many have played against a human using the "soviets buy only corps" strategy? i thought my sittuation is somewhat unusual so that is why i thought i let you know how it goes... -antti Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
googabooga Posted August 29, 2002 Author Share Posted August 29, 2002 its the end of -43 and now i (axis) control only 3 cities in russia. russia is starting to cave in because allies lost the ball in mediterranean. i probably could have made better gains in russia if i didnt have to divert some forces to protect norway from his little excursion. iam yet to see a single US unit since my control of the atlantic with my fleet of 9 level5 subs is unquestionable. my opponent seems to be (or so i think) researching sonar with the amaricans so i put 4 level5 italian battleships to patrol the oceans... the only drawback of "soviets buy only corps" strategy is that he cant make any effective counterattacks since the hittinpower/hex is limited due to the low attack values of corp units. this would really change if you could stack units (no iam not implying that i would want that, iam just making an observation). now my whole plan (building subs like hell) could have backfired if my opponent would have been more agressive in the eastern front. that would have meant that he should have also built some tanks and armies not just corps to allow him to make those counterattacks. in the first turns of russian campaign he had apparently no idea that i had only minimal forces there and maybe expected me to field some air fleets and tanks in couple of turns so he had committed in the beginning to build those corps. IF i had sailed those subs out in to the ocean before russias entry and engaged the royal navy he would have most certainly guessed that i dont have enough ground units in east. by keepping the subs in hiding before americas entry you keep the allied player guessing if i have some "secret" reserve in the eastern front (preparing for turkish invasion or some other crazy stuff) this pbem has been an eyeopener for me. i (or my opponent) never could appreaciate naval units and we rarely built any (playing as axis or allied) but especially if you lose the control of atlantic you are screwd, allied or axis in that matter... comments? any help? -antti Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
googabooga Posted August 29, 2002 Author Share Posted August 29, 2002 one intresting point i never noticed before (because i usually dont commit forces to africa): taking gibraltar and spain brings those axis cities in north africa, provided that you have overland route through vichy france, up to 8 (or was it 10, i have to check when i get my pbem turn file back). you cant however build units in north africa... -antti Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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