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No African American GIs?


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Isn't Morgan Freeman from the the deep south of the USA?

Look, a fact doesn't have to be actually true does it?

Let go of your western fact based cultural inhibitions, accept that time is not linear, ask yourself 'If there is no spoon - how the phlick am I GOING TO EAT MY CORNFLAKES! '

Then realise - it's not about spoons, it's not about cornflakes, its about roughage. Eat prunes, that'll sort yer!

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Besides arabic numerals, you mean. I believe they introduced the concept of underwear and dressing for the seasons to Europe. Before that Medaeval Europe was one big Monty Python skit.

MikeyD made a joke, and did not italicize a single word! All is right with the world!!!

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Not that most posters here need any convincing, but I would be delighted to take this force into action.... Yes, I know that it didn't arrive in NWE until the end of October '44.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/761st_Tank_Battalion_%28United_States%29

And soldiers don't get much braver than this:

http://www.761st.com/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=82&Itemid=89

On November 10, 1944, Sergeant Warren G.H. Crecy fought through enemy positions to aid his men until his tank was destroyed. He immediately took command of another vehicle, armed with only a .30-caliber machine gun, and liquidated the enemy position that had destroyed his tank. Still under heavy fire, he helped eliminate the enemy forward observers who were directing the artillery fire that had been pinning down the American infantry.

The next day, Crecy's tank became bogged down in the mud. He dismounted and fearlessly faced anti-tank, artillery and machine-gun fire as he extricated his tank. While freeing his tank, he saw that the accompanying infantry was pinned down and that the enemy had begun a counterattack. Crecy climbed up on the rear of his immobilized tank and held off the Germans with his .50-caliber machine gun while the foot soldiers withdrew. Later that day, he again exposed himself to enemy fire as he wiped out several machine-gun nests and an anti-tank position with only his machine gun. The more fire he drew, the harder he fought. After the battle, Crecy had to be pried away from his machine gun.

Unless it's the regiment's CMH winner.....

Rivers' tank hit a mine at a railroad crossing while advancing toward the town with his company. His leg was slashed to the bone in the explosion, but he refused a morphine injection and, as many would do in the 761st, he also refused to be evacuated. He would refuse numerous evacuation offers over the next few days. Taking command of another tank, Rivers advanced with his company to take Guebling the next day and directed his tank's fire at enemy positions east of town through the morning of Nov. 19, despite the company losing three of its five tanks in the town to antitank fire and one to mines. One tank crew acquired a replacement and returned to the town.

Continuing the attack east toward Bourgaltroff Nov. 19, the company was stopped by enemy fire. Capt. David J. Williams, the company commander, ordered his tanks to withdraw to cover, but Rivers radioed that he had spotted the antitank position. "I see 'em. We'll fight 'em," Rivers said, and opened up on the enemy tanks, covering Company A's withdrawal. Rivers' tank was hit, killing him and wounding the rest of the crew.

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Not that most posters here need any convincing, but I would be delighted to take this force into action.... Yes, I know that it didn't arrive in NWE until the end of October '44.

I'd rather they were just blokes in a variety of units rather than all concentrated in one unit because "all those baaws are nig........," err ... African Americans.

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Not that most posters here need any convincing, but I would be delighted to take this force into action.... Yes, I know that it didn't arrive in NWE until the end of October '44.

I'd rather they were just blokes in a variety of units rather than all concentrated in one unit because "all those baaws are nig........," err ... African Americans.

I wonder how those who admire and respect the personnel of the 332nd Fighter Group would respond to those who might express the wish that said personnel had been not all in the 332nd Fighter Group.

And then there's (for example) the Nisei 442nd Regimental Combat Team.

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In fairness to LongLeftFlank, I think in his post he was simply saying that the performance of African Americans in the context of a segregated army was exemplary in a number of instances. I did not perceive him to be arguing that segregation was proper or correct.

At the same time the following point could be argued: that the pervasiveness of racism in white American society of the time of WW2 is reflected in its conscript army and had the army been integrated by fiat at the war's beginning (as it was some years later) there is a good chance that individual performance of minority soldiers would have been negatively impacted by their having to cope with massive prejudice from the majority of their mates. As much as even I hate to admit it, the nation was likely not ready for integration in 1941. However, the performance of segregated units during the war was so commendable (due to the individual heroism and devotion to duty of their members) that it paved the way for the subsequent integration of the Army by President Truman's order in 1948.

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I wonder how those who admire and respect the personnel of the 332nd Fighter Group would respond to those who might express the wish that said personnel had been not all in the 332nd Fighter Group.

And then there's (for example) the Nisei 442nd Regimental Combat Team.

Your not really getting this are you ?

@Gunnergoz, Yeh I tend to agree mate but I would contend that all members of an Army being considered of one colour, Green, might have done more for the plight of racial segregation by showing that all serve on an equal basis. Remembering that Jimbo's laws stayed in force until 1965.

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Sounds like I might do well to change my moniker to something, oh, I don't know, Smedley, if only to not be presumptively mistaken for a closet-racist Nazi-honorer. :rolleyes: Yes, yes, I know my posts heretofore could be reckoned those of a German fanboi; but how do you know my moniker isn't meant to honor Marlene Dietrich? :D

Besides, what I meant was more or less what gunnergoz said, especially in regard to LLF's post.

Dietrich simply means "skeleton key" (cf. Nachschlüssel).

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Sounds like I might do well to change my moniker to something, oh, I don't know, Smedley, if only to not be presumptively mistaken for a closet-racist Nazi-honorer. :rolleyes: Yes, yes, I know my posts heretofore could be reckoned those of a German fanboi; but how do you know my moniker isn't meant to honor Marlene Dietrich? :D

Besides, what I meant was more or less what gunnergoz said, especially in regard to LLF's post.

Dietrich simply means "skeleton key" (cf. Nachschlüssel).

Nice to know...around here, one can never tell... :D

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The next day, Crecy's tank became bogged down in the mud

Now that’s the sort of guy, when switching from CM1 TO CM2 wouldn’t be bleating about the lack of a tool enabling identification of terrain at the other side of the field with 100% certainty.

“Driver get in your tank and get rolling, we got some bad hats to fight!” (I don't think he really said that, just dabbling in a little Hollywood))

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  • 3 years later...

Stumbled accross this old thread SEARCHing for something else.

To those still interested in the original topic, there was subsequently developed a US non-caucasian "faces" and uniform Mod for specific US Infantry units comprising the US 92nd ID, 100th Inf, and 442nd RCT available since version 2 campaigns and scenarios.  The 92nd (Colored) Infantry Division saw combat as a unit in Northern Italy.  Later in the ETO, as the war's horrific appetite for consuming infantry created a shortage of replacements, several US divisions approaching Germany augmented their infantry companies with a "5th" platoon of all-black ("negro") soldiers after the Market Garden campaign.  The "faces" folder in this Mod allows for such.

Mod Name = updated ez_&_vein_US_infantry_distinct_units_uniform (CMBN version2)
URL = http://www.battlefront.com/index.php?option=com_remository&Itemid=314&func=fileinfo&id=2627

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BruceK,

 

Welcome aboard! 

 

Terrific post which, with the succeeding one, was most enlightening.

 

All,

 

What a great thread. I'm learning a great deal about issues I'd never seen discussed before and am thoroughly enjoying the erudite discussion, the respect for differing viewpoints and some delightful humor, intentional and not. I, too, have seen the statement the route to the infernal regions is "paved with good intentions," and I believe the intentions here are good. We seem, though, not to merely have departed the road, but have plunged over a precipice, providing a direct route to the previously mentioned destination. Let's hope that we, like Bugs Bunny in the famous gremlin episode, will manage to come to an abrupt halt, while in a vertical power dive, before outright disaster ensues.

 

On a topical note, did you know that a former NBA basketball star co-wrote a seminal, highly rated book on the 761st Tank Battalion? The star was Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, and the book was called  Brothers In Arms. Here's a look at the book and how it came about. Don't know how many of you noticed, but in one of the quotes about a 761st company in combat, it says the company's strength was 5 Shermans. I read it, kept reading, and then it hit me. The strength of the attacking company was only that of a full strength platoon. There should've been 17 tanks in the company! This speaks volumes both to casualties generally and why the Americans sweeping to victory felt they were losing, one of the themes which informs "Fury" but is reflected in such books as Irwin's phenomenal  Another River, Another Town, in which a 19 y.o., with only two weeks' gunnery training, arrives in Europe, is sent straight to a repple depple in Germany, then winds up in practically the lead tank, as gunner, with no time to settle in, just as the 3rd AD begins a major attack. 

 

Overall, I'd like to ultimately see correct colors for the various races and ethnic groups, but also the right sorts of heads and bodies as regards height, size, shape, etc. There are some sterling examples of what I mean in wartime Russian photographs in which a squad looks something like a UN meeting in terms of racial and ethnic diversity. 

 

Regards,

 

John Kettler

Edited by John Kettler
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<snipped>

 

Another River, Another Town, in which a 19 y.o., with only two weeks' gunnery training, arrives in Europe, is sent straight to a repple depple in Germany, then winds up in practically the lead tank, as gunner, with no time to settle in, just as the 3rd AD begins a major attack. 

 

<snipped>

 

Regards,

 

John Kettler

 

I have heard good things from a friend about "Another River, Another Town".  It's on my go-find-and-read list.

Nice to hear a favorable reference here.  Thank you.

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