The Rusty Gear Posted June 1, 2010 Share Posted June 1, 2010 I've tried a few times as Axis not accepting the Vichy offer, but it has always ended up poorly. The French Medi fleet always stops any sort of amphib assault I can mount on Algeria, and the Italians aren't much help. Bulgaria, Romania and Hungaary don't want to join with France still in, and now Italy DOW's on Greece! I have no land bridge there! Anyone ever emply a sucessful "No Vichy" strategy"? I'm thinking the only way would be to put off capturing Paris, take Marseilles and somehow take Algeria before taking Paris . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gronq Posted June 1, 2010 Share Posted June 1, 2010 I've done it a number of times now with good results. Basically, don't enter Paris until you've got Algiers encircled. I tend to use two German armies together with Rommel and an Italian corps. As soon as Italy enters transport across Rommel and the two armies from Milan and then move on Tunis. Simples... :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rusty Gear Posted June 1, 2010 Author Share Posted June 1, 2010 Sounds like a decent plan. What happens to the Fench Colonies? Do they go Independant, or join the axis? I remember reading somewhere that you will get a DE for Spain to Join once France (with no Vichy) falls ? ? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill101 Posted June 1, 2010 Share Posted June 1, 2010 That's right, taking Algiers can lead directly to Franco joining the war, which is the great prize for having fought a tough campaign to conquer all of France and Algeria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gronq Posted June 1, 2010 Share Posted June 1, 2010 Franco does join in at a cost of 800 MPP which is good as you then get an early jump on Gibraltar and receive an extra tank unit. You get to keep Algiers, Tunisia, Syria and Madagascar plus territory in the Western hemisphere, if I remember rightly. On the down side the French puts a corps in Hanoi when you decline the Vichy offer, which is not really a major problem for the Japanese anyway. The trick is to get the balance right between taking all of France, Sealion and Barbarossa. Not so simples... :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gronq Posted June 1, 2010 Share Posted June 1, 2010 In my latest game Franco didn't join. Not sure whether this was because I had taken Algiers before Paris or because Spain was only at 26% in terms of diplomacy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wushuki Posted June 2, 2010 Share Posted June 2, 2010 That is actually very interesting Grong and it would be useful to understand why that happened. I captured Algiers and Paris at the same time today and Franco did offer to join me. So I'd say its either the diplomacy you mentioned or that you did not have a unit stationed in Algiers, which I think could also be a requirement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gronq Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 There was a German army in Algiers so it wasn't that. Maybe a bug? If you are not certain to get DE 503 offered then I don't think it's worth the hassle of taking all of France. You'll then have spare units to defend the Eastern front and also to take the Baltic states before the Russkis do... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubert Cater Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 Just taking a quick look at the conditions for DE 503, if France has surrendered, Axis units are in Algiers and Spain has a mobilization % >= 30 towards the Axis then the DE should be presented. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill101 Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 Spain has to be at 30% for Franco to consider joining the Axis, so this is the reason why Spain hasn't joined in this case. However, as Spain starts the 1939 World At War scenario at 40% Axis, I'm intrigued to see that Spain has gone down to 26% in your game. Providing it is this scenario you're playing and not a mod, then it would appear that either you've done something to annoy Franco, or the Allies have invested in diplomacy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gronq Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 Thanks Hubert & Bill101, that's a very useful snippet of information. Must be because the Allies have invested in diplomacy. I wouldn't dare to annoy Franco. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rusty Gear Posted June 3, 2010 Author Share Posted June 3, 2010 Just taking a quick look at the conditions for DE 503, if France has surrendered, Axis units are in Algiers and Spain has a mobilization % >= 30 towards the Axis then the DE should be presented. " France has surrendered, Axis units are in Algiers " Does this mean that DE 503 will fire even if there is a Vichy France? ie if *Vichy* Algiers is taken? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill101 Posted June 3, 2010 Share Posted June 3, 2010 No, only if Germany hasn't formed Vichy will you be able to entice Franco into joining the Axis through DE 503. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blah637 Posted November 22, 2016 Share Posted November 22, 2016 Just started replaying the game and I was looking back at some old posts and found this one on Franco joining if Vichy isn't formed. I don't do any looking at scripts, modifying or anything of the sort. I just play when I have a few extra hours to burn. Is this scenario still in play or has it been written out with updates? If it is still in there I'm gonna have to give it a try next game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill101 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 Hi It's still in the game, so the options still exist to say no to Vichy if you should wish to! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argothair Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 It does feel a bit gamey, but, yes, the best solution seems to be to use the Italians to attack and conquer Tunis and Algiers while using the Germans to knock out all of the French armies except the one in Paris, gaining experience and avoiding excess attrition from French counter-attacks. Hold off on actually taking Paris until the Italians are in place. Once the Italians reach Algiers, you can enter Paris the same turn, and refuse Vichy (they will still graciously offer to 'safeguard' their North African colonies). You get the gold, and you get Spain, and you maintain control of Italian Northwest Africa. This causes a delay of a few months in when France surrenders and it means that you will not be able to put pressure on Egypt, but it seems worthwhile to me -- who needs Egypt when you can take Algiers, Paris, Madrid, and London? Let the British cross the desert wastes one garrison at a time instead of shipping German tanks out to the middle of nowhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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