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I'm working on a v1.01 update for my Advanced Third Reich mod for SC2-PDE:

DATA CHANGES

- increased Combat Losses variability to +/-2 for attacker and defender

SCRIPT CHANGES

- adjusted war-entry scripts for coup events in Norway

- added global variable #7 for Russian Winter effects to allow 10% chance for variant for improved German planning and preparation for winter operations; adjusted applicable supply and strength event scripts for reduced Russian Winter effects

- added variant for Allied strategic bombing, based on global variable #3 for USA air strategy; supply event concentrates on Germany's critical industry

I just played some as Allies against Axis AI up to invasion of USSR and spotted a few more things to adjust, like making fortification build times a little longer (2-sides should take 2 turns). The increased combat variability seems OK, not too different but provides a few more surprises. I'm curious if others would want that included in an update or just leave it at +/-1.

If anyone has some comments, good or bad, or other suggestions for improvements, speak up. I'll probably just make one more update over the next month or so.

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greetings, i always play with +2/-2, it is my standard, but we need to take in mind what value the casualties have overall, mainly with +2/-2 makes much more important and relevant the use of "not frontline"-support units, as tactical bombers and artillery, but value of casualties too comes from configuration settings, these being, production delays and soft build limits and overall mmp production and industrial modifiers, in example, for give one, is not the same to loss one carrier with production delay that if you decrease build time or play without build delay, the game shines as the given range of configuration options available, and is easy with the industrial increases and overall nation modifier to set nations as we wish from the editor, as my own point of view, the most important is the capability to make replacements, the right choice is balanced, at middle way between being able to replace all losses and the other side that is being facing a front colapse by mounting casualties, more player freedom gives allways more playability, so i always on designs increase the overall mmp, for realism in middle way is give a 3-2 mmp advantage to allies, so, i think that +2/-2 is better option but decreasing the production delay to some degree or set-off it,

just my point of view, i think each of we have one different concept of perfection on these settings, just was wanting to stand that one casualtie value changes much from the scenario configuration, for all people obviously.

Bill, i am playing your third reich scenario but with heavy changes, you have done a great job with the scripts, and the engine at this point manages better the AI opponent turns, taking much lesser time than before, even with the (my) increased number of units, just want to know if you mind or like that i make public my mod on combat missions database, having finding you "alone" in this thread have maked the better way to ask if you see an issue with a variation of your work maked public, my next project, now that multiplayer's european theater are available is a speed-up war, all forces available in 1939, russia and usa active from the begining but as payload, france and french navy being axis, added in to the complete japanese order of battle, still have not finished playtest and one issue that i have seen is that hvy panzers are much powerfull, i have removed nearly all technology upgrades, just for one purpose, for the AI, each time the AI purchases a new unit i am sure that this unit is full upgraded, as in previous games against the AI, in other scenarios, meanwhile the AI purchases at full upgrade level, does not so well with at-start troops and is my concern that this give some advantage to the human player,

hope that my point-lines help overall to all forumers that have on mind to build scenarios,

with best regards,

alarick.

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Alaric, no problem at all if you want to modify what I've done and post it. I've kept my mod pretty plain with most emphasis on the event and AI scripting. I'm sure you and others will find lots of things to adjust.

I coming around to liking the +/-2. I don't quite follow the point you were trying to make linking this to other economic factors. The average losses remain the same, just a little more variability. In a couple of cases where I took an attack for granted things didn't quite work out as expected. It forces me to reconsider things more, and that's good.

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Originally posted by Alaric:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by pzgndr:

Alaric, no problem at all if you want to modify what I've done and post it. I've kept my mod pretty plain with most emphasis on the event and AI scripting. I'm sure you and others will find lots of things to adjust.

I coming around to liking the +/-2. I don't quite follow the point you were trying to make linking this to other economic factors. The average losses remain the same, just a little more variability. In a couple of cases where I took an attack for granted things didn't quite work out as expected. It forces me to reconsider things more, and that's good.

greetings, thanks for the kind allowing to post my own version, really was wanting to share it, your scenario is the better available, it have scripts, that is missing in the european theater PDE that i posted, so i see your scenario as the better "base" for my own version onwards, i are glad that you have give support and hard work, making a final release, not beta what to mean, and then improving and enhancing from a, completely playable version, perfection changes in each mind but i hope that people find too interesting my own version.

about casualties, i was wanting to say that is not the same lose one unit and being able to replace it on 1 turn, that losing an unit that takes 6 turns to replace, i like the +2/-2, as said, in fact do not play without it every of my plays, artillery and tacticals bombers are more important to "ko" enemy units as you know playing that even with an enemy at 1 strength that can throw a 1 casualty balance, you can lose 3 points on direct combat, in my oppinion it is good, in example gives much more to an offensive russian player that can not worry about casualties and allow his troops to do more damage on powerfull german units, you say it just right exactly that at end, the player must think more about frontal attacks, an all-out attack, if the enemy have reserves will even go for a colapse on one or the other faction, and more on, added in, with bad weather and the +2/-2 give more chance to cause damage on enemy units, so making more player freedom to attack overall on bad weather,

will post my version of your already excellent scenario when i do some more playtest, want to see how goes the german vs russian front and aproach barbarossa before making decision if my version need some adjustment before ready for, intended, players pleasure on playing it,

some variant on casualties is about realism, one well prepared plan can be to ruin once make contact with the enemy, the +2/-2 modifier allows for uncertainty, as the real war allways have been,

see you later,

with best regards,

alarick. smile.gif </font>

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  • 1 month later...

Defiler!!!... 'Blashy!!!'

"YOU!!!"... a revered Beta-Tester for SC2!...not purchasing 'Patton Drives East' when it was 1st-released...is "UNTHINKABLE???".

Aside from my cajoling!,...im glad you bought the game!,...it's more 'WICKED' to play than SC2 & SC2_WaW!...or so i think so!.

We need more games!,...i can't seem to get enough of them!. Id like to delve into more specialized conflict's dealing with...for example!...'The Battle For Italy!'...and so on!. I'd like to use up all or most of the available 'Map-Space' for such creation's...to better help explore that conflict!.

I'd also like to see some adventurous creators make more modern simulations...like for example dealing with the 'Arab-Israeli-Wars' to the present time...with Iran...who's representative leader is 'Mahmoud Amadinejad'...who may just be a modern-day-Hitler for the Muslim cause!. He want's to create a New-Muslim-Empire including Egypt, Syria, Turkey, Palestine, Iraq, and what-ever-else. He want's Israel effaced from the surface of the Earth!,...and he want's the American's out of the Middle-East!.

Anyway!,...this was my chance/opportunity to say my mind!.

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A) Initially I was a better tester for PDE but real life prevented me from giving it enough time so I told Hubert he would be better off with someone else.

B) I did not buy it right away simply because I have barely played ANY SC in the past year, easily less than 4 total hours. So I had no incentive to get PDE.

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A) Initially I was a better tester for PDE but real life prevented me from giving it enough time so I told Hubert he would be better off with someone else.

B) I did not buy it right away simply because I have barely played ANY SC in the past year, easily less than 4 total hours. So I had no incentive to get PDE.

Glad to hear that Tony.

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I've made what should be final tweaks. If my ongoing AI-AI game plays out without any surprises, I'll post my PDE v1.01 mod updates tomorrow. One thing I noticed is the AI improvements Hubert made with v1.01 have resulted in slightly faster runs AND the optimizations have also improved the AI's air target selection routines. For example, where the German AI was sluggish against France because it wasn't using air effectively, it is noticeably better now.

Armuss, there are still the default 3D icons. I like the original Third Reich counters that I customized, but you don't have to use them. All this stuff can be further customized using MS Paint or similar bitmap editors. I don't plan to do much more myself, but you and others are free to use other 2D or 3D icons and terrain sprites. ;)

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OK, my PDE v1.01 updates are now posted at http://www.cmmods.com/

Here are the version notes:

Advanced Third Reich for SC2-PDE v1.01

DATA CHANGES

- increased Combat Losses variability to +/-2 for attacker and defender

- increased fortification build delay to 21 days; 2-sided fortification now takes 2 turns

- for plain graphics interface, the decision_dialog.bmp files from updated Cyprus directory in SC2-PDE v1.01 should be used

- bumped Resource Bombardment 'Unit Defender Hit %' from 10% to 50%

SCRIPT CHANGES

- added global variable #7 for Russian Winter effects to allow 10% chance for variant for improved German planning and preparation for winter operations; adjusted applicable supply and strength event scripts for reduced Russian Winter effects

- adjusted supply and strength event scripts for Russian Winter effects to occur as early as January 1941 if Axis attacks in 1940

- added variant for Allied strategic bombing, based on global variable #3 for USA air strategy; supply event concentrates on Germany's critical industry

- adjusted unit events to increase experience for German AI units arriving in 1939/40

- adjusted war_entry scripts for coup events in Norway

- added war_entry scripts for historical Finland entry on June 25, 1941, and for variable Finnish entry after USSR is at war, and deleted activation_2 scripts for variable Finland entry

- fixed offensive scripts for possible German attack on Spain

- fixed transport_minor scripts for withdrawal of extra German units from Norway

Mostly a lot of little bug fixes and tweaks not fully described in the version notes. While I did make some additions and revisions, most things were working pretty good so I'm not messing with them. :)

I may make another update at some point, but this may be it for a while.

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Excellent, going to download and play now.

FYI, I would say the biggest problem with all mods is the Norway/UK space, all of them are IMO always not wide enough for subs to have a chance to get through.

I love your mod, the simplicity of it all and yet the vast terrain is just great. Overall it has a more WW2 feel than other mods. Competitive players should play this imo.

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I want to share some comments I already provided to Blashy.

I played vs. the AI at Expert / 1.0 with no pressure whatsoever.

The generic AI is not "brilliant" and needs a handicap to offset mistakes most seasoned players would not make. IMHO, it needs the combat experience bonus moreso than the economic help. So while I recommend Intermediate +1 settings, I also find the AI needs more than +1.0 to be challenging. For me. +1.5 is pretty good. Newbies just getting used to the game/mod may be challenged on +1 or less, but experienced players should crank it up. I have not tried Expert +2 but suspect that may be practically impossible to beat. I'm interested in any game reports to prove otherwise. ;)

Those familiar with the original Third Reich board game should recall that yes, Axis should completely max out its force pools by 1942. There are no more units to build (ie, realistic manpower and other resource limitations). Axis would then hit a high water mark (ie, Stalingrad, El Alamein) where it is strained to hold what it has taken, and the time delay to move replacements to the front usually puts Axis on the strategic defensive as Allies gear up and start pushing back.

If this is not happening, then Allied AI needs another boost to be a challenging computer opponent. And vice versa for Axis AI if playing as Allies. If you make the AI challenging enough, your unit losses should prevent you from accumulating too many excess MPPs and taking advantage of inherent AI limitations and weaknesses. And then AI performance in the later years should prove to be much better. I mean, if you want to take advantage of the AI and cripple it in the early war then obviously it's not going to play well for a full game.

I've already provided both Axis and Allied AIs with additional free units here and there as handicaps. I suppose I could consider more to make the Intermediate +1 setting more "balanced" but I'd rather reserve the higher settings up to Expert +2 as the natural limits. If Expert +2 still isn't tough enough for some of you, then I could certainly make a few more changes.

I did note one minor "bug" in my alternate Russian Winter Strikes Again strength and supply scripts. These should happen o/a Dec 1942 and not Dec 1941. If anyone spots anything else odd or not working very well, please let me know and I'll consider a v1.03a hotfix.

This is about it for me for a while. I've already announced to Hubert and others that tomorrow I'm returning to the US Army staff to manage its nuclear reactor program. Between the additional work and commute, my gaming time is going to take a hit. I have enjoyed the gaming these past several years and will remain active in some limited capacity. I'll still be around. :)

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pzgndr!,...im glad that your not leaving for good!,...you have accomplished much here!,...pat yourself on the back!.

See if you can find out what's going on in the real-world! [We!,...outsider's are handicapped when it comes to finding out what is really happening out there!],...im interested in having current world situation's put into gameplay!. I like WW2 situation's and as well as other situation's that go further back!. However!!!,...i am now eager for more up-to-date current World-Situation's!. Im not a modder yet!,...maybey when i retire in a few year's!,...but...right-now,...i just don't have time for it!.

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FYI, I tried the hardest setting, expert 2.0 and I left auto for whoever my HQs selected and did not encircle the enemy to permanently kill them. As well I only took France, I did not even take Yugoslavia and I left Africa to the Allies.

I even go the surprise that Italy surrendered once the two southern cities were taken... I eventually liberated Italy.

France was temporarily liberated by air power mainly, this is where the AI fails miserably at doing a massive landing, it was token units without even securing a port first and no HQs

Even with all of this I still managed an easy victory, simply because as Axis they just have too many MPPs. Although if the Allied AI did do a proper French landing at the same time it was putting pressure in Italy things might have been different.

I enjoyed how the Russians fight to the end, I had to crawl all the way to the Caucausus to finally have them surrender, even with all 3 capitals taken.

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