RN large ship OOB for WW2

[Guest Mike]

One of the beefs I have with this game is the ease with which the RN can get swept from the seas. So to help future modders "get it right", as it were, I've done a bit of research.

Here's a list of battleships, battle-cruisers and a/c carriers actually commissioned into the RN during the war, and some of the carriers commissioned into it immediately afterwards too, with dates they should be added:

BB’s & BC’s:

Built pre-war:

5 x Queen Elizabeth class - MALAYA, QUEEN ELIZABETH, VALIANT, WARSPITE, and Barham – this last sunk by U331 in the Eastern Med – and how did a U-boat get to the Med??

5 x Royal Sovereign class - RAMILLIES, RESOLUTION, REVENGE, ROYAL SOVEREIGN, and Royal Oak sunk at Scapa Flow by U47. royal Sovereign loaned to USSR as Arkanglsk in 1944

2 Nelson class: Nelson, Rodney

2 Repulse Class – Renown,, Repulse – this last sunk by Japanese a/c off Malaya Peninsula 1941

1 x Hood – Hood – sunk by Bismark, May 1941

Building at start of war:

5 x King George V class - ANSON, DUKE OF YORK, HOWE, KING GEORGE V, Prince of Wales sunk by Japanese aircraft off coast of Malaya Penninsula Dec 1041

KGV: Commissioned in December 1940, joined home fleet Dec 1940

POW: Commissioned January 1941, completed March 1941

DOY: Commissioned august 1940 or Commissioned Nov 1941 – conflicting reports, but missed out on action vs Bismark so I’m inclined towards the later

Anson: Commissioned August 1942

Howe: commissioned August 1942

Aircraft Carriers:

Pre-war:

Eagle – sunk by U-73 nth of Algiers, August 1942 (another U-boat in the Med!)

Hermes (small carrier) – sunk by Japanese a/c off Ceylon April 1942

2 x Courageous – Courageous, Glorious,. Courageous sunk by U29, September 1939, Glorious sunk by Scharnhorst & Gneisenau, June 1940

Ark Royal – sunk in Med by U41, Nov 1941......there seems to have ben an epidemic of U-boats in the Med - how did that happen??!!

6 x Illustrious/modified illustrious class - FORMIDABLE, ILLUSTRIOUS, IMPLACABLE, INDEFATIGABLE, INDOMITABLE, VICTORIOUS, (all survived)

Illustrious – joined fleet in August 1940

Victorious – Commissioned May 1941

Formidable – Commissioned November 1940

Indomitable: Commissioned October 1941

Implacable: Commissioned August 1944

Indefatigable: Commissioned May 1944

Unicorn – 1943, built as an a/c maintenance ship

6 x Colossus class – 1944-45 - COLOSSUS, GLORY, OCEAN, PIONEER, VENERABLE, VENGEANCE, all survived, smaller than pre-war carriers but carried as many a/c as Illustious

Ocean: Commissioned August 1945

Colossus: Dec 1944

Glory: April 1945

Pioneer: Feb 45 as maintenance and replenishment carrier

Venerable: 17 Jan 45 (eventually became Veinticinco de Mayo in Argentine Navy and was a strategic consideration in Falklands war, but never sailed AFAIK)

Vengence: January 1945

In addition a number of carriers were completed shortly after the war:

Leviathan – launched June 1945, never completed

Perseus: Commissioned October 1945

Theseus: commissioned Feb 1946

Triumph: Commissioned May 1946 as a Colossus class

Warrior: Commissioned as HMCS Warrior in Jan 1946

[Honch]

Thanks, I needed something like this to fill out the force pools and starting OOBs for the Royal Navy in my custom campaign.

[Moonslayer]

For the sake of completeness here are the heavy cruisers of the Royal Navy in 1939:

Home Fleet: HMS Norfolk (18th Cruiser Sqdn)

Chatham: HMS London (rebuilding)

Portsmouth: HMS Suffolk (Refitting until 23rd Sept)

Humber: HMS Southampton, HMS Glasgow (2nd Cruiser Sqdn)

Channel: HMS Cairo (In Portland)

Mediterranean Fleet: HMS Devonshire, HMS Shropshire, HMS Sussex (1st Cruiser Sqdn); HMS Coventry (Alexandria)

South Atlantic: HMS Exeter (Falklands)

China Station: HMS Kent, HMS Cornwall, HMS Dorsetshire (5th Cruiser Sqdn)

West Indies Command: HMS Berwick, HMS York (8th Cruiser Sqdn)

Reserve Fleet: HMS Hawkins (Refitting), HMS Frobisher(Refitting suspended until 1940) (Portsmouth)

Anyone fancy doing the CLs?

[stoat]

The problem with the Royal Navy was that despite its large number of capital ships, many were very old and all required large amounts of maintenance. The RN could only field a fraction of its BBs at a time because dockyard space and labor was devoted to smaller ships needed to hunt U-boats, rather than units used to deal with German surface ships. Even the ships that did get to sea were often plagued by maintenance issues. Given the scope of SC2, I don't think that representing every British BB afloat between 1939 and 1947 would be true to accurately representing naval combat in the second world war.

[stoat]

Britich CLs

[Guest Mike]

Stoat: all those battleships were perfectly battleworthy, and all were sailing at the times indicated.

I know of no ships that had significant reliability issues at sea appart from the Prince of Wales - and that because it was too NEW!!

The QE class had been extensively modified during teh wars, buthte RS class had not - but they could still sail faster then the convoys they were part of hte escorts for in 1940 and 41!!

Certainly there was a shortage of yards to repair damage, but that's a function of battle!!

[Guest Mike]

Remember there's an eastern Fleet too -

Ships attached to the Eastern Fleet include:

* HMS Hermes - Sunk 9 April 1942

* HMS Victorious

* HMS Illustrious

* HMS Indomitable

* HMS Newcastle

* HMS Prince of Wales - Sunk 10 December 1941

* HMS Repulse - Sunk 10 December 1941

* HMS Electra - Sunk 27 February 1942

* HMS Express

* HMS Cornwall - Sunk 5 April 1942

* HMS Dorsetshire - Sunk 5 April 1942

* HMAS Vampire - Sunk 9 April 1942

* HMS Adamant (F64) - Submarine Depot Ship

The USS Saratoga also served with the Eastern Fleet.

(from Wiki)

So when Japan enters the war the British should be required to remove an apporpriate number of ships to this unit - effectively they are out of hte war in Europe.

There should be a limit tho - probably not more than 1/3rd the RN, and some of them should be returned if things get sticky in Europe.

Plus there should be a chance that some of them are sunk in the East as events - not sure that the system is up to this, but we can always hope.....

[Gérard Le Poer Trench]

Well actually only a third of this fleet was ever ready for fighting for more than half the fleet was destroyed by german subs and cruisers.

[Blashy]

I have no problems dominating with the huge UK navy we start off with.

Its huge!

[Guest Mike]

Originally posted by Gérard Le Poer Trench:

Well actually only a third of this fleet was ever ready for fighting for more than half the fleet was destroyed by german subs and cruisers.

What are you talking about?

The losses are listed above - 1 QE BB of 5, 1 RS BB, Hood by Bismark, POW & Repulse by the Japs - that's 5 BB's and BC's sunk during the whole war from all causes - none of them by German cruisers!!

5 out of 20 built or building were sunk.

Several were damaged - most notably by Italian frogmen in Alexandria Harbour - but they all looked OK from aerial recconaissance so hte Axis never knew the damage they did!!