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First Release Predictions?


J Ruddy

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Originally posted by _Axe_:

Good god man, enough already! Just come out and say what the first one will be or don't say anything at all! :mad: :mad: :mad:

I can't take anymore of this forum!!!11!!!1 :mad: :mad: :mad:

May I make a small sidenote at this point and comment that you have a very polite demeanor when posting on this forum. If everyone who posted was as cordial as you, reading this forum would be a sheer delight.

<font size=1>This Forumcrapper 2000 is awesome. Thanks Axe!</font>

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Games = Titles? ;)

I am not going to argue with you about the direction of your company and risk. There is risk and there is risk though. The amount of risk associated with devoting your time and resources into this type of entreprenuership is considerable compared to working for The Man and getting a regular paycheck. The rewards of reaping the success you have sown along with the independence make the risk worthwhile.

So I am not suggesting BFC has risk aversion. I am simply basing my WAG on what seems to make the most sense as a reasonable risk given the current situation.

I still think my logic makes good sense, but I am not going to be living in a box beneath an overpass if the next game is a disasterous bomb. :D

All I am saying is that IMMO, the best chance for grabbing 5 out of 5 sales from most CM fans is to START with a WWII TITLE. Obviously the flexibility in the new engine is a great and wonderful thing. I am genuinely excited about the possibilities. I am most excited about seeing how the new engine refreshes the CM standard of excellence for WWII combat simulation.

The last reason I am still betting on a WWII initial release is that otherwise you are ceding the genre to the crap RTS games for another year. I just don't think you would want Wartime Command or whatever it is going to be called to be the uncontested WWII game of 2006.

BDH

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I just don't think you would want Wartime Command or whatever it is going to be called to be the uncontested WWII game of 2006.
We don't base our decisions on making sure we do what the other guys are doing :D

Now, the thing is if you guys would stop speculating, and wait until we're ready, there wouldn't be anything for me to comment on. But no... ya can't tongue.gif We aren't quite ready yet. Juuuust about, but not quite yet. And as I have said a hundred times over, it isn't because we like stringing this along. We have our reason to wait, just as you have your reasons for not wanting us to wait.

Steve

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But the speculation is part of the fun. It passes the time as I wait interminably for news on a job offer.

You should consider the intense curiousity a good thing.

If the general reaction was, "Meh" there might be a bigger risk of living in the cardboard box and neither of us want to see that.

I understand there must be some good reason for waiting on the announcement and I sure would like to hear about it. In fact I would welcome the opportunity to have you unburden yourself of any detail you're just bursting to tell someone.

I can be trusted. Rune will vouch for me. ;)

BDH

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OK!

Now this should spawn a WHOLE new thread

We have our reason to wait,
Speculation...

What possible reason (external infuence?) would cause this "wait" to thrust upon us....

Now I am curious!??

Is it another as yet unannounced game in development that could decide the fate of the first CMx2 release?

Is Steve waiting for devine inspiration?

Is Charles secretly fasting on a cyber spirit quest up at Walden Pond? (that's near Maine isn't it?)

Enquiring Minds Want to Know!

:D

-tom w

[ September 14, 2005, 08:34 PM: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]

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Reason #1: Steve converted to Wicca and is waiting for Samhain or some other Autumnal/Harvest related date to ritualistically make the announcement.

Reason #2: Charle's nutrient bath was contaminated by someone associated with Duke Nukem Forever.

Reason #3: They haven't yet decided and plan on pulling a couple all-nighters to finish it up as a nostalgic nod to college days

Reason #4: Nobody has yet said the magic word.

Reason #5: They forgot the magic word.

BFS5

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Oh, I don't mind people speculating. Human nature. People won don't want to speculate should, however, not be reading and posting to threads about speculation :D

Until I can say what the game is my very sporadic postings to the speculation threads is simply designed to remind people that they are speculating, and therefore remind them that "sound logic" that drives people to a conclusion isn't necessarily all that sound. i.e. the people that are sure that the only thing in the world we should be doing is WWII, ergo the only thing we are going to produce is WWII, ergo the first game will be WWII. Since I've stated clearly that we're not only going to do WWII this sort of thinking obviously has a small flaw to it :D

Oh, and I've also said that we expect people are going to be disapointed with the some of the games (titles) we put out. Especially the "WWII only" crowd. While you guys might play a lot of WWII games, we have to make them. You can put aside WWII at any time of your choosing, whether it be for a few days or a few years. We can't unless we go to do something different. For CMx1 that means we spent roughly 18,720 hours doing nothing but think about WWII and only WWII. That is like staying awak reading about WWII, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 365 days a year for just about 2 whole years. So yeah, we occasionally think "gee... maybe there is something else we'd rather be doing" :D

Steve

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Could be worse...you could be upgrading accounting software.

Oh I can fully relate with the desire to explore different venues...I have been married for several years now..ha cha cha...

My speculation has everything to do with the implementation of the new engine not my interest in only playing WWII. I want all types of interesting and exciting settings making use of all of the cool design features allowed by the new engine. Iron Chef would not be so cool if it were Battle Chicken every night so I truly look forward to what comes next.

Buuuttt...tired as you may be of chicken, what other setting would best allow the gang to perfect the concept and solidify the new engine like WWII? You will know if something 'feels' right or wrong much more intuitively than having to incorporate a bunch of new research?

But hey, I've been wrong before and I may be completely offbase here for a whole bunch of reasons. My bet is still that the first title will be the Guano War.

BDH

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The great thing about WWII is that it is the perfect setting for armored battles on this scale. Its not just the rich historical setting, but the tanks and armies were varied and well matched. The weapons were at the perfect state of development. Modern combat, with its much greater firepower, guns, missles, laser bombs, etc etc, would not be as interesting on this scale. Plus, there is no way you can do it realistically without helicopters (there was a comment earlier that helicopters are not in the works). Plus, who really wants to fight hundreds of battles of US v Iraq, or the modern US Army v any other realistic foe for that matter? It can't be both realistic and well balanced. I think the scale of TacOps is more suited for this kind of combat, and the fictional setting of NATO types vs Soviet bloc armies is perfect for it. Just my two cents.

Finally, I really don't understand how its even possible to get bored with WWII. :D

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Personally I would like one of two titles....BFC please feel free to rip them off and run.

1. Hammer's Slammers...Its got tanks, artillery, APCs (combat cars), infantry, etc. Plus its new and a lot of fun...something no one has done well or in a long time.

2. XCOM. While I know the actual XCOM is untouchable, there are a set of books by Harry Turtledove where Aliens with modern day tech come in a try to take over the world in WWII (1941-42) time frame. Very fun to read. Something about manuvering my armored units to contain and then crush an alien horde sound fun.

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A setting is only as interesting as the game system that simulates it. A simulation is only as interesting as the setting it recreates. They are linked together. A good sim designer can make ANY setting interesting if the sim is set up correctly. Conversely, if the simulation is great but the setting dull.. that ain't going to work.

One of the problems I have with the "WWII Bigots" (hehe...) is that they think no other setting offers the same possibilities for interesting gameplay. I disagree completely. It's just that some of the other topics, like Vietnam or WWI for example, are more difficult to make fun and interesting because the subject matter isn't so straight forward as WWII is. Meaning, a mediocre developer has a better chance of making a decently realistic WWII game that is at least enjoyable to play than with other settings. Therefore, it isn't the setting that is the problem... it is the skill which it takes to make some of these settings interesting. If realism is compromised, then it becomes much easier since the developer can fudge their way around the issues.

BTW, I never said helos were not in the cards for CMx2. What I said is we have no plans on doing hot LZ type helo ops where you have troops loaded transported and deployed by air. That's a big deal thing to do and we don't see any reason to do it in the near future.

Steve

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Finally, I really don't understand how its even possible to get bored with WWII.
Put nearly 19,000 hours of your life into it, without a break, then face hundreds of people nitpicking every single little thing you did during that time. If you made it that long, perhaps you might understand ;) Oh, and yes Tom... that is just my hour count. As a team we are probably at... 62,000 hours of nothing but WWII. That comes out to be about 7+ years of 24/7/365 work on nothing but WWII.

Wildman, I think those are excellent (though copyright protected :D ) game systems. In a way they offer unlimited possibilities, while WWII offers only the same possibilities as what everybody else does. The only way we can differentiate our WWII games from others is by the attention to realism, scale, and overall quality. We can do all of that and a heck of a lot more of all the rest of the elements are up for grabs.

One thing I know I'd enjoy as a designer... being able to say to whiners who question the effectiveness of the Mk. IV Plasma Mortar "sorry you have a difference of opinion, but it is 100% accurately simulated. Or do you have a refference to cite that proves we're mistaken. No? I thought not. Next question..." :D Instead we can discuss how to make the game more fun and tactically challenging instead of how important it is to simulate the coax hull MGs on a tank that saw combat for a couple of weeks in numbers that can be counted on two hands.

Steve

[ September 14, 2005, 11:37 PM: Message edited by: Battlefront.com ]

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Originally posted by Battlefront.com:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Finally, I really don't understand how its even possible to get bored with WWII.

Wildman, I think those are excellent (though copyright protected :D ) game systems. In a way they offer unlimited possibilities, while WWII offers only the same possibilities as what everybody else does. The only way we can differentiate our WWII games from others is by the attention to realism, scale, and overall quality. We can do all of that and a heck of a lot more of all the rest of the elements are up for grabs.

Steve </font>

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A-HA!!!!!!!

I am now more convinced of a WWII will be the initial release than ever. After I lowered the lid to the laptop last night, it struck me as I reflected on the palpable "development fatigue" in Steve's post about the number of hours put into the project.

It could be a feint of course, but I tend to think the passionate explanation of the number of hours gives away something important.

IF they had been researching and designing something other than WWII for the past two years, would there be A) this amount of hours coming so readily to the mind and B) the expressed weariness over a subject that hasn't been worked on in over two years.

As I said, this could be a head fake from a wily target, but I think its a genuine expression. Since I choose to believe this, I would also like to express that the dedication the BFC team puts into these projects does engender a reflected loyalty and passion from a fan base that truly appreciates the effort despite the occasional whining.

BDH

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barrold. be careful, if you push steve to far they will just drop a ww2 title out of the cmx series completly.

(if there is goijng to be one anyway).

Infact the way it sounds like is that they were planning to do a ww2 game but they just got constantly bugged so they just changed their minds, and are doing something else in spite.

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LOL...right. One speculation thread is going to divert the direction of the company and they will trash 7 years of research and design because a fan is excited about their next project. It is to laugh.

If Steve ever gave the impression he was thin-skinned enough to allow the above post irritate him, I certainly missed it.

If Steve blows the Horn of Shut Yer Piehole, I will go along, especially if in hindsight I had been rude in any way. Until then, I will continue to politely speculate and look forward to whatever product comes out.

So there, nyah.

BDH

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