Spears Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 I just finished a game in the desert dawn open map where i was attacking. I managed to get a sniper onto a hill overlooking the enemy positions he used all his ammo so i used his as eyes and ears. I cleared a enemy trenchline and guns on the first small hills (there where 2 set of hills with reverse slopes) When my tanks carried on over the other small hill a enemy gun opened up and killed 2 of my last 4 tanks. I was in shock as this gun was in a trench in the open in front of my sniper 150m away. Yet my sniper never saw the trench. The gun fair enough, but the trench............. it made me angry to find out my ears are blind and a sniper isnt worth alot apart from tc killing. Not a hapy bunny as this proved to be my downfall. Question. Why didnt my sniper see trench he was overlooking, did he take a porn mag with him?????? because he is what im thinking he is, if hes doing what i think he is doing!!!! tosser anything else have better eyes than a sniper!?!?!?!?!!??! HELP! my sniper is blind!!! he was vet pure visability (clear blue) when gun appeared. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falcon988 Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Attribute it to human error. He may very well have been looking at a dirty magazine. Or day dreaming. Or watching the other action. He's only one man after all so who knows what happened. You can always court martial him. And don't complain too much about that trench. I'm PBEMing an attack where I have to deal with an anti tank gun in a trench which is also located IN a heavy stone building. I don't even think that's realistically possible, but I can tell you it's very annoying. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philippe Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 There's a very famous WWI photograph of a german machine gun position during the battle of the Masurian lakes that shows exactly that. They cut a horizontal slit in the wall just where it meets the ground so the machine gun could swivel. I seem to recall that there was a surprising amount of lumber in the photograph -- part of it may have been to keep the house (which they had effectively undermined) from collapsing. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seanachai Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Bah! I wave my hand at you. A sniper's job isn't standing up like a prairie dog on a mound, scanning the landscape for threat signatures. Not to mention that using one as such is simply taking excessive advantage of 'Borg Spotting'. Did he go out there with a radio, and, after using up his ammo, settle down to phoning in sightings to Central Control? I think not. What you're complaining about is that the game engine didn't put you in a position to use your resources unrealistically. Frankly, after using up his ammo, he'd likely hunker down and try to be as inconspicuous as possible until he was able to make his way back for a hot meal, some hideous raisinjack brewed forgetfulness, and more ammo. What you're saying is that, after discharging his given mission, he should have been sending semaphores about enemy positions. That didn't happen in the Real World, and it would be even more wrong to do it in the game. Don't rely on gamey unit placement to achieve unrealistic results, and you'll never be disappointed, eh? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joachim Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Trench in a house? Why not. If there is a cellar you just have to stabilize the wall for the slit with some logs, add some sandbags and overhead protection (more logs) and voila- a nice little bunker comparable to a wooden bunker. But with better camo. Trenches are discovered from 150-200m. Given that spotting is rather deterministic in CM, I'm a bit surprised. Did the sniper have LOS to the trench line or did he just see the firing gun (which is a bit higher than the trench)? Gruß Joachim 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenAsJade Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Whoa - I thought I better put on record a rare time when I agree with Seanachai! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave H Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Originally posted by Seanachai: Bah! I wave my hand at you. A sniper's job isn't standing up like a prairie dog on a mound, scanning the landscape for threat signatures. Not to mention that using one as such is simply taking excessive advantage of 'Borg Spotting'. Did he go out there with a radio, and, after using up his ammo, settle down to phoning in sightings to Central Control? I think not. What you're complaining about is that the game engine didn't put you in a position to use your resources unrealistically. Frankly, after using up his ammo, he'd likely hunker down and try to be as inconspicuous as possible until he was able to make his way back for a hot meal, some hideous raisinjack brewed forgetfulness, and more ammo. What you're saying is that, after discharging his given mission, he should have been sending semaphores about enemy positions. That didn't happen in the Real World, and it would be even more wrong to do it in the game. Don't rely on gamey unit placement to achieve unrealistic results, and you'll never be disappointed, eh?Who'd have ever expected cogent thought from this source? There must have been a serious downturn in sales last night at the Twin Cities liquor stores. I find myself in absolute agreement with Seanachai. I must admit I've tried using the sharpshooter (not sniper) for the same scouting function. However, I only try that while the sharpshooter is still armed. When they run out of ammo, it's time to get them to the rear. Most recently I selected a handful of British sharpshooters for a PBEM, only to discover that visibility was less than 200 meters. This pretty well eliminated the most important function of sharpshooters, so I've used them as scouts attached to infantry platoons. I did send one green sharpshooter off alone, just to wander around on a flank in the empty desert. He was apparently captured, disappearing without a trace and AFAIK without firing. Even his capture did provide me with a bit of gamey/Borg information, since there had to be some enemy unit nearby to capture him. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seanachai Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Originally posted by GreenAsJade: Whoa - I thought I better put on record a rare time when I agree with Seanachai! It happens, don't reproach yourself. You'll weather this storm of sudden approval and come through thinking I'm as full of ****e as ever, lad. Until then, know that everyone's thoughts are with you. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THumpre Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Zounds! Coherent thought from the Uber-Gnome I couldn't agree more, and it pains me to say so... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seanachai Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Originally posted by THumpre: Zounds! Coherent thought from the Uber-Gnome I couldn't agree more, and it pains me to say so... Stop it! Everyone stop agreeing with me! Don't you understand that you're destroying yourselves? I'm an insane non-grog with less to contribute than your average ground squirrel. You people are doing irreparable harm to your credibility by agreeing with me. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Originally posted by Seanachai: I'm an insane non-grog with less to contribute than your average ground squirrel.I totally agree! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walpurgis nacht Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 BAh! talk of gamey behavoirs again. . . it's a game! Using units to spot enemy positions is routine with a good player. Binocs help, especially with specific IDs, as opposed to generic ("infantry?", "stuart?"), so sharpshooters are excellent for this. Spears, trenches are spotted at 200 meters or less. However, you cannot see what you cannot see. Were weather conditions clear enough? Was the trench buried behind cover or a hill? Otherwise you should have seen it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieseltaylor Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 You have not said whether the sniper had a hide order, you had specified a zone to look at, there was enemy infantry nearby, or if the sniper was elite or green. These things might all bear on the answer. Also the size of the ATG. I always think the 37mm is easier to hide than the 88mm ATG : ) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stikkypixie Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Originally posted by Walpurgis Night: BAh! talk of gamey behavoirs again. . . it's a game! Using units to spot enemy positions is routine with a good player. Binocs help, especially with specific IDs, as opposed to generic ("infantry?", "stuart?"), so sharpshooters are excellent for this. Spears, trenches are spotted at 200 meters or less. However, you cannot see what you cannot see. Were weather conditions clear enough? Was the trench buried behind cover or a hill? Otherwise you should have seen it. I consider the challenge of the game that it tries to mimick real life, the game does that for a very large part, but sometimes you have to give it a hand too, so i try to avoid gamey tactics. That's not to say i don't use them . 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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