Failure to Fire

[Aco4bn187inf]

Here's a slightly odd occurence in CMAK which someone out there may be able to explain-

My opponent gives his Tiger an area fire order (use main gun) deep into a 2 storey house. Range 27 metres. I can see the yellow line at the beginning of the turn.

The tank rotates its turret in the correct direction. Then the barrel elevates to the level position. Then the tank does NOTHING for almost the whole turn. (It was not in 'shocked' status, because it had lost its commander 20 minutes earlier.)

In the last seconds of the turn, the tank takes a side turret partial penetration from a (probably unspotted) PIAT. Thereupon it loses its yellow targeting line, targets a British infantry squad in the house, and drives forward about a metre just as the turn ends.

There were several German infantry units in a trench between the house and the tank, some of which (the ones closest to the house) went KIA during the turn. The ground floor of the house was lower than the elevation of the tank.

My question is why didn't the tank execute its area fire order?

Is it because his friendly infantry was too close to the target? (About 13 metres, before they were killed.)

Some glitch about the elevation change that allowed the yellow line to 'stick' on the building's ground floor without allowing the tank to fire?

I understand that the PIAT hit would effectively override the Tiger's orders, and he reasseses his situation.

What do you all think about this situation? Pardon my longwinded description. My newbie opponent is all tied up in knots about it, and I'm not sure how to explain it to him.

[Aco4bn187inf]

NEVER MIND.

I just got a chance to do a test and it seems it's simply that the friendly infantry is too close.

I have to admit I'm surprised tho, I would have thought the friendlies would be safe enough in their trench. Guess the game doesn't see it that way, seems to base the fire prohibition on the Proximity rather than the Exposure of nearest friendlies.

Stop me before I drink coffee again!!!

[Shmavis]

I don't know if this is modelled in the game, but, if the Tiger was area-targetting the 2nd floor(which only seems possible if LOS to the 1st floor is blocked) and the friendlies were just below, there might have been a risk of the tank HE rounds exploding somewhat over the friendlies, kind of like a treeburst. That's my guess.

[Aco4bn187inf]

In this case the area fire line went down to the ground floor.

Which reminds me, I wish we had a choice in whether to area fire top or ground floor when we give the order. I don't think there is any way to choose.

The building-as-treeburst effect can certainly come in handy at times. It's nice to knock out light vehicles or even dug-in guns that are behind a building, just by getting shells to explode in the building itself.

[Joachim]

It's even better to target a 150mm sIG on the 2nd story of a house (no LOS to ground level as planned) when there are trenches around the building. Would have been better if the gun survived a little bit longer.

on topic:

If the target is just az the edge of LOS and a little bit of dirt or smoke is kicked up early in the turn blocking LOS then the tank won't shoot as

Gruß

Joachim

[Aco4bn187inf]

The yellow line will disappear if the LOS is obscured for a few seconds, no? I have to test that. I have seen units embark on vehicles and still retain their yellow tagetting lines, if I remember right.

Yes, shooting big HE at the tops of buildings is a great way to do fire support against a town. If it's a town on a hill, with the buildings arranged like steps, then it's easy to do it without exposure to direct return fire.

Just try not to destroy the building or you'll lose LOS. The heavily damaged buildings that result become dangerous 'no-go' zones for the enemy.

I've been using a pair of green M7 Preists to do this, I suppose I could even have purchased conscripts instead. They just sit there and pull the trigger. I keep them buttoned all the time so they save their .50 cal ammo. Plus, it's amazing how much HE ammo they carry. My opponent keeps saying, "Oh my God! You have no idea how many guys you are killing with those Preists!" Feels almost like cheating.

To get the same amount of hits from 105mm artillery batteries would cost HUGE amounts of points.

How did you lose your sIG, Joachim?

[Joachim]

I've got a 251/2 targetting some place it could never see. Now the spotting HQ that had LOS one turn ago can't see the spot, too. Yet the yellow line is still there - and I guess sooner or later the 251/2 will fire if I don't cancel it manually cause the target fled. 4 rounds fired in the last turn. Fire started early. Rate of fire for vets should be at least 7 per turn.

Interpretation: A yellow line is sticky even if LOS breaks due to dust.

Gruß

Joachim

[Joachim]

PS: I lost the sIG to the last round of an arty barrage targetted nearby. It ain't as stealthy as a spotter. But I had one sIG firing 1.5km across open flat ground that was not spotted/id'd in another scen. Worth much more than a spotter as it could fire "danger close" when my FOs often suffered from dust blocking their LOS and thus unspottet fire.

Gruß

Joachim