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Hulldown/Hunt Bug?


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I noticed, that in V 1.01 it often happens, that a tank moves to hull down position behind a hill/ridge, as ordered by either the HUNT or the HULLDOWN order, stops and fires, but only hits the hill crest a few meters in front of it.

Checking the orders phase, the tank has hulldown position to the target, with a clear LOS, but still hits the crest in front of it, instead the target.

Only workaround is to manually move the tank some meters towards the crest in the next turn.

I never experienced this behaviour in V 1.0, but in 1.01 it happens quite often.

Usually 2 out of 4 tanks that HUNT from behind a hill towards an enemy stop to soon; they are hulldown, but to no avail, as the only thing they hit, is the ground in front of them.

Is this a new bug in V 1.01?

Tankist

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I've observed this. Frustrating when it's a IS-2 with limited HE to begin with, and the errant shells casue friendly casualties.

Is it related to the "double hull down" effect, where even though one tank is on a reverse slope, peeking over the crest, and the other is on flat terrain for a hundred meters in all directions, both show as "hull down"?

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This also happens to me all the time. It is a good question, I don't know why no one will address it . . . probably because you refer to it as a "bug" in the post title (after the bitc*ing that went on after CMBB was released, a lot of folk in here find the over-use of words like "bug" irritating).

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Yup, this is a nasty little problem when you have an HE chucker with a high blast rate, and a low HE load because you cannot afford one turn of waste like this. One or two shots landing 10 meters in front of you in the dirt would seem a realistic possability on occasion, but you would think these virtual guys would "learn" after that. I don't want to whine because often I find I'm just missing something that is actually more realistic, however inconvenient, but this one seems to defy common sense. Help?

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Originally posted by tigger:

This also happens to me all the time. It is a good question, I don't know why no one will address it . . . probably because you refer to it as a "bug" in the post title (after the bitc*ing that went on after CMBB was released, a lot of folk in here find the over-use of words like "bug" irritating).

I think you've got that right!

I prefer the term "undocumented feature" :D myself

-tom w

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Yes, this is definitely a problem in my opinion as well. I've upgraded to 1.01 and noticed this the other day while playing one of the scenarios in the Stalingrad Pack: Into the Void.

I ordered my PZ II's into the gully in the middle of the map, and on their way there they began to take fire from a light gun located in the small village on the right side. I ordered them to hull down in the gully using the location of the light gun icon so they could attempt to shell it with a minimum of exposure.

Although they had LOS to the light gun, and were being repeatedly shelled (and knocked out) by the light gun, I observed one of the MK II's put 4 consecutive shells into the top of the gully right in front of him while attempting to shoot at the gun. He was then knocked out. Others were knocked out after less shots, but also suffered from this same phenomenon.

Please fix or do somefink! :D

ianc

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I might be missing something here, but shouldn't you check the LOS after the tank has positioned itself hulldown? Then move up to the next hump in the ground if it's blocked relative to your desired field of fire. I don't remember reading anywhere that the field of fire was guaranteed to be clear only that the tank would be hull down in the direction that you selected. So is there another hump between your tanks and the target that is blocking LOF? Or are you guys trying to say that the firing unit itself is having problems firing correctly once it is hull down and that it should be able to hit the target but can't?

[ December 26, 2002, 12:28 PM: Message edited by: StellarRat ]

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OK, I get it now. There is no intervening terrain. Definitely sounds like a bug. I don't know if BFC takes the shell arc into account, but that could cause a problem if you are trying to shoot uphill. In theory there is a dead zone behind the top of a hill that certain weapons could never hit.

[ December 26, 2002, 01:19 PM: Message edited by: StellarRat ]

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The more I think about it more possible it seems that you couldn't hit a position that is slightly back from the crest of a hill, not from below anyway. This might not be a bug, but a realistic outcome when firing flat trajectory weapons uphill at a target. Most of the shells would hit short or go right over the top of the position. Another thought, what if the gun of your vehicle can't elevate high enough hit something up on the hill? If you were too close to the base of the hill this could happen.

[ December 26, 2002, 04:57 PM: Message edited by: StellarRat ]

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Originally posted by StellarRat:

The more I think about it more possible it seems that you couldn't hit a position that is slightly back from the crest of a hill, not from below anyway. This might not be a bug, but a realistic outcome when firing flat trajectory weapons uphill at a target. Most of the shells would hit short or go right over the top of the position. Another thought, what if the gun of your vehicle can't elevate high enough hit something up on the hill? If you were too close to the base of the hill this could happen.

Yeah, but whenever it's happened to me, I've been hull down shooting at something close to my own elevation and my tank just fires round after round right into the ground (sounds like a kids song).

You would think after the first one, someone might say, "Oops! Maybe we should elevate the gun a degree or so". But no, my tankers just blissfully continue to waste ammo. Maybe they think they're supposed to be digging latrines.

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Originally posted by Boo_Radley:

Yeah, but whenever it's happened to me, I've been hull down shooting at something close to my own elevation and my tank just fires round after round right into the ground (sounds like a kids song).

You would think after the first one, someone might say, "Oops! Maybe we should elevate the gun a degree or so". But no, my tankers just blissfully continue to waste ammo. Maybe they think they're supposed to be digging latrines.

I suppose there could be something wrong with BFC's miss routines. If they didn't remember to take the lower level of the gun into account it's possible the random factor they use to make HE fire slightly variable is poughing all the shots into the ground. This is only a problem with HE fire right? Maybe BFC would care to comment on this, but I have a feeling they aren't working this week.
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I've also seen the same thing and just thought my tankers had been spending too much time on vodka in stead of on target practise. It's is a shame to see that all of your carefull moving into position ends in trying to shoot the top of the hill you're on. :D

Mies

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