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The Sands of Iwo SC

Desert Dave

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Just got back from a week-long excursion to Durango... snow-boarding at Purgatory highly recommended for all you hell-bent Xers! :cool:

... tho, beware the Celebs who are slumming there, or, rather, make great haste to duck their kiss-a** entourage, who would bury you under the ice-floe merely to bask in the dim glow of their profane and glibly patronizing psuedo-saint, yes?

(... come to think on it, many false messiahs ALWAYS lurking 'round -- tossing witless bon-mots to them mee-moe-mindless followers, even on internet ether boards... :eek: keep an adze-honed eye out, yes?)

Anyhow, late last night and early this morning (... couldn't wait to get back to the game, you know how it can go?) I played Bill Macon's excellent '39 scenario mod. And I played it Expert +1.

All went according to the Manual of Grog (... Jeewees, what a MASSIVE tome... yee what's got spools of testosterone should add this gargantuan weight to your work-out regimen, right along with your usual dainty doses of 'roids)

And therein the problem.

The Allies could not land anywhere on the west coast of France! I say, I say again - COULD NOT.

(... and this has now happened three times in a row, so we are not in dilemma)

The AI bases its strategy almost exclusively on Air superiority. Adequate idea, and fairly historical.

However, if you have planned Rommel-like -- presuming he might be unhindered by raging, mental-age-3 sorts of lunatics, as were ALL Nazis, then and now, then you have got the situation under control.

Of course, you had foreseen Air Dementia and contested EVERY single Allied Strat Bombing campaign with your best 2 or 3 surviving Air from French annihilation + an experienced HQ, and so your defensive Interceptors can now prevent all attempts to punch out a hex or two on the Continent.

And, you had researched U-Boats so that they are now able to parry any Allied sorties in the Bay of Biscay. As we know, a Strat Bomber will also be helpful.

And you had purchased an Italian HQ along with 4 or 5 black shirt corps to help with the "hedgehog defense" of France, oh, north and northeast of Paris.

So. Whatever can the AI do? :eek:


Save, beat its hapless head against your authentic Fortress Europa.

Solution (... one among many, sure, let's hear it): for SC2 we create an Amphibious unit that can attack from the beaches of Iwo SC.

This would be pretty much necessary if there is to be any Pacific version of SC, since there are one-hex islands that must be assaulted, yes?

You can either do this with, or without stacking.

With stacking would allow shore bombardment, and/or two marine units storming the beach a la Audie Murphy or 'ol Sarge Stryker, Jon Wayne.

(... here I borrow from Bill Macon's long-ago idea that there can be "stacking points." Two to a hex. Army = 2; all others, including ships = 1.)

Otherwise, you could maintain the current schematic of one-unit-per-hex, as long as the Marine unit was OUTRAGEOUS enough to possibly dislodge the dug-in defender.

Of course, this powerful unit would cost a Croesus sort of arm and a leg. Perhaps even research into Higgins kinds of landing craft might be required.

See, you just cannot count on the Allies being able to establish SUFFICIENT air superiority (... anyway, against a capable Axis player). There needs be another tactical device so to get them gung-ho grunge-gyreens ashore.

Hence, and a long way to go I know, mea culpa, the absolute need, IMO, for a Marine unit in SC2. smile.gif

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Good to have you posting again and welcome back from Purgatory, even a short layoff from you is noticable.

Agreed 100%. This situation was hinted at before but I thought the attacker could always manage to blast a hex clean with BBs and carriers, except the invaders can't be adjacent 1 turn if a BB is bombarding.

I think all your suggestions are noteworthy and probably a combination of shoreline stacking and displacement would do the trick.

I'm sure there will be a lot of entries here so I'll keep mine brief and the three headed dragon can remain in the garage. smile.gif

I'm looking for a map of the Atlantic Wall from the Spanish border to Holland, but haven't found one on the web, this is a close second even though it leaves out the main German defenses at Pas de Calais.


[ January 04, 2003, 06:05 PM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

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With all due respect to Marines, regular Army units performed the lion's share of seaborne invasions during WWII. What is missing in SC is the simple ability of units on transports to attack coastal hexes and then unload. It should be like attacking from a river hex, with attacker strength halved, and then an automatic advance into the vacant hex if the defender is eliminated. HQs at sea could also provide their command bonus to units at sea, and would be another reason to include them in the invasion force.

Without knowing how the stacking issue will get addressed in SC2, we can at least push for units on transports to have combat capability. That shouldn't be too hard to make happen and would greatly help. And airborne units would also help.

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Originally posted by Bill Macon:

With all due respect to Marines,

From the Halls of Montezuma,

To the shores of Tripoli,

We fight our country's battles

In the air, on land and sea.

First to fight for right and freedom,

and to keep our honor clean;

We are proud to claim the tittle of


Our flag's unfurled to every breeze

From dawn to setting sun.

We have fought in every clime and place

Where we could take a gun.

In the snow of far off northern lands

and in sunny torpic scenes,

You will find us always on the job,


Here's health to you and to our Corps

Which we are proud to serve.

In many a strife we've fought for life

And never lost our nerve.

If the Army and the Navy

Ever look on Heaven's scenes,

They will find the streets are guarded by



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Personally, I think D-Day was a diaster. We (speaking as an American) threw away a bunch of young lives for nothing. We fought to free France, who wouldn't fight for themselves.

We landed a bunch of exposed transports, dumped young soldiers with a rifle onto a bore sited beach. Stupid.

Then all we here from the Europeans,"Oh, we're not Nazis". It's always somebody else fault. The Czechs, Romanians, Bulgarians, Yugos, Hungarians, Urkanians, etc, sure didn't have a problem being a Nazi when you were ahead in the war. Goose-stepping for the camera.

What we should have done was fire-bomb GERMANY! Don't land one American on the soil. Hit every city like Dresden. What was the point of North Africa? Who cares! Who cares about hitting German armies in France? BOMB THE GERMANS! BOMB THE HELL (HEAVEN) OUT OF GERMANY & GERMAN PEOPLE. That's it. Then supply the arms to Russia.

You never saw the Generals in the frontlines. They turned war & young men's lives into a football game of yards (meters for others).

Instead of a land-invasion, instead of landing tanks, instead of all that ground crap...I would have built 10,000 fighters & 10,000 bombers. Yes, we would take causalties in the air, yes, we wouldn't capture territory. But I would level every CITY IN GERMANY!

When it comes to today's world. I'd stick the American Flag (Old Glory) right beside every Israeli Flag (Star of David)...And have the Air-Force take care of business.


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