Tokar Posted March 19, 2001 Share Posted March 19, 2001 All 7 Shermans have a clear vuw down a vary wide road. The ground is flat, all shermans are in fixed positions. A Panther shows up at about 1500m. ALL OF THE SHERMANS RUN THE BLANK AWY!!! The line up was: one green Panther, two vet shermans, three reg Shermans and two green Shermans. Can any one explaine this. The Shermans had the Panther, BUT thay all took one shot (on the run) fired smoke and raced for the nearist cover. If thay fought like this in WW2 I,d be speaking German!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullethead Posted March 19, 2001 Share Posted March 19, 2001 Very easy to explain. The Shermans realized they had no chance in this situation so took cover to avoid dying uselessly. Basically, Panthers have about the best gun in the game and it's able to kill most Shermans pretty easily at nearly all CM battlefield ranges. At the same time, the Panther's frontal armor is essentially immune from the guns of most Shermans even at point blank range. Thus, Shermans will do everything to avoid a frontal confrontation with a Panther--it's a no-win situation. Would you have been happier if they'd tried and died? ------------------ -Bullethead In wine there is wisdom, in beer there is strength, in water there is bacteria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warmaker Posted March 19, 2001 Share Posted March 19, 2001 First of all, what type of Shermans did you have? If they were the pea shooter 75mm then forget it. From what I can piece together from your description you were trying to engage a Panther from it's very strengths: Long range and a very excellent sloped frontal armor. Your Shermans are doing what the tanks do when they come across something superior to them, they'll back up to safety. Happens to Panthers too sometimes when they come across those rare M26 Pershings... sometimes. Just remember, German tank guns were often superior to Allied ones in penetration. Try and engage the Panthers with a flank or better shot since their armor is considerably thinner there. Doing that is easier said than done in your example since the Panther's engaging you at long range. That's where the Big Cats' game lies. Oh, and I'll say hello to the "Big Cats" for ya! ------------------ "Uncommon valor was a common virtue"-Adm.Chester Nimitz of the Marines on Iwo Jima Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtweasle Posted March 19, 2001 Share Posted March 19, 2001 That's the truth, that Panther front armor is pretty robust. Just played a game in the fog and had a Firefly ping 3 shots off the Panther only to get toasted, and I do mean toasted! At the same time I had two Cromwells at the sides, and now that the Panther turned to the Firefly on of the Cromwells pasted the Panther in the backside. Got to get those big cats in the sides, or back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokar Posted March 19, 2001 Author Share Posted March 19, 2001 Originally posted by Bullethead: Very easy to explain. The Shermans realized they had no chance in this situation so took cover to avoid dying uselessly. Basically, Panthers have about the best gun in the game and it's able to kill most Shermans pretty easily at nearly all CM battlefield ranges. At the same time, the Panther's frontal armor is essentially immune from the guns of most Shermans even at point blank range. Thus, Shermans will do everything to avoid a frontal confrontation with a Panther--it's a no-win situation. Would you have been happier if they'd tried and died? I had 4 M-10s closeing from the rear planed for next turn wile the panther was bussy. This shows a minor limitaion of the program. It will not happen again! "Seven virgins and a mule" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtweasle Posted March 19, 2001 Share Posted March 19, 2001 Originally posted by Tokar: This shows a minor limitaion of the program. It will not happen again! "Seven virgins and a mule" Yes the game tries to limit things to reality when practical. ------------------ You hand in your ticket And you go watch the geek Who immediately walks up to you When he hears you speak And says, "How does it feel To be such a freak?" And you say, "Impossible" As he hands you a bone. - Bob Dylan Copyright © 1965 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Wildman Posted March 19, 2001 Share Posted March 19, 2001 It all reality. Had the greatest CM moment two days ago. Was trying to save a Chaffee from a King Tiger by fast moving to behind a house. Well it almost made it, however, the KT was killed by a rear turret shot from a M8. An M8. Made my day! Reality....Run away...run away... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokar Posted March 19, 2001 Author Share Posted March 19, 2001 Originally posted by Dirtweasle: Yes the game tries to limit things to reality when practical. It is vary likely that in reality the tankers would orginize the attack using the radio. With 11 to one odds thay should be considerd just a little dangerous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtweasle Posted March 19, 2001 Share Posted March 19, 2001 Originally posted by Tokar: You lost me. What were you reffering to as a minor limitation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokar Posted March 19, 2001 Author Share Posted March 19, 2001 Originally posted by Dirtweasle: You lost me. What were you reffering to as a minor limitation? Just that CM can only do so much. It was my mistake to asssume that I could plan so detailed of an attack. Next time my plan will take this in to account. {strategy is the art of avoiding a fair fight} I mistakenly though I had achieved this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homba Posted March 19, 2001 Share Posted March 19, 2001 Hehe... I set up a fight last night, 3 KTs vs 30 sherman 75s on a flat, open, 1 km length map. I set my KTs spaced, one right, one center, one left. The shermans fired on me of course to no effect, they also smoked my tanks like crazy. Two KTs were immobilized and one had the gun disabled, but that was after about 5 rounds, and 10-15 of them were burning by then. (All these tanks were Regulars). Every now and then my KTs would get a shot through the smoke, or the smoke would thin- and another sherman would burn. After about 20 sherms were knocked out without making any move forward (two were huddled behind a small house), I quit the exercise. Next I played the Sherms, which I of course rushed at the KTs. The computer made my job easier by grouping the KTs close together- tho I dont belive this altered the ultimate result. As my sherms rolled across the open at full speed, a few were picked off, but they helped themselves by hiding the KTs in a cloud of smoke. Once I had closed the range, the KTs were finished off with point blank side shots. I had lost about 5 tanks. I found this all an interesting illustration of the AI's strengths (auto-smoke) and weaknesses (lack of active/offensive tactical intelligence) admittedly in one limited situation. Homba Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vergeltungswaffe Posted March 19, 2001 Share Posted March 19, 2001 And therein lies the problem (if you want to call it a problem). The AI acts like real human beings. Despite the fact that you could rush the KT's and eventually kill them, no one wants to be the bait that gets killed while everyone else advances. In WWII, when confronted with 3 KT's, 99% of allied tankers would have smoked and reversed off the CM map. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olle Petersson Posted March 20, 2001 Share Posted March 20, 2001 Originally posted by Tokar: I had 4 M-10s closeing from the rear planed for next turn wile the panther was bussy.Had you done the opposite; put the M-10s (sporting some more potent guns) up front, and had the Shermans encircle, you'd probably made it... The M-10s are just as probable to get toasted if the Panther hit, but they do have a chance to knock out the Panther first... Cheers Olle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warmaker Posted March 20, 2001 Share Posted March 20, 2001 The standoff with the M10s sounds better while the Shermans maneuver. If the Panther turns its turret to the Shermans then the M10s could get a flank turret shot. ------------------ "Uncommon valor was a common virtue"-Adm.Chester Nimitz of the Marines on Iwo Jima Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andrew Hedges Posted March 21, 2001 Share Posted March 21, 2001 Also, you should flank with the Sherms because they have a fast turret and the M-10 does not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LimShady Posted March 21, 2001 Share Posted March 21, 2001 Originally posted by Vergeltungswaffe: The AI acts like real human beings. I dunno about you, but if I were a routed MG team, I would've dropped the .50 cal a LONG time ago instead of lugging it all over the map (Although the AI's desire to not misapproprate government resources is commendable).... LimShady Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Posted March 21, 2001 Share Posted March 21, 2001 Me finks we oughta get this guy, Tokar, and Rob/1 together...they'll make a beautiful couple. [Evil Laugh] [This message has been edited by Maximus (edited 03-21-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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