Jump to content

AAR or advice on Rune scenario Jaegermeister anyone?


Nolloff
 Share

Recommended Posts

Spoiler

I´m trying to tackle Jaegermeister from the Russian side. My first mistake was that I considered my JS2s worthy opponents for the AIs Panthers. Basically what happens is that I get blown to pieces by Panthers in the trees on the right side of the village and additional tanks lurking on the ridge behind the right part of the town when attempting an all out assault.

Getting my tanks in hull-down position on the 2nd ridge does also not work. Once an enemy is in sight my tank crews reverse.

I managed to fast-move my assault guns, two JS and some infantry into town using the road and had hoped to be able to take the town and tempt the Panthers to attack me and in the process expose their flanks on open ground. Unfortunately once an opportunity for firing at them arises I´m getting the impression my gunners would even miss the village´s church from a 50m distance.

Well, the plan sounded good to me at first and seemed to my only option but I can´t gain much ground there without seeing my assault guns receiving flank shots from the Panthers while trying to support my infantry against the defenders.

I´ve tried this one from the German side, to get a better idea what to do but I´ve just seen the same results and the Panther front gave the AI the same special treatment I had received before.

I´d be grateful if someone could give some advice how to deal with this and similar situations.

Thanks

Matthias

Link to comment
Share on other sites

All I can say is that the tutorial gives you a pretty good "set-up" to work with, if you follow its initial timetable.

I did that and came away losing like 4 of my IS-2s and one immobilized in return for all the enemy AFVs. I fully admit to getting a lucky drop on all the Tigers. I lost one IS for all three of them.

As for the Panthers, the tutorial gives a good place to ambush them. I sent my best tank platoons over for that job (2 reg, 1 vet, 1 green). I ended up losing three of those, due in part to my own stupidity ;) But they held the Panthers at bay and whittled them down.

Shoot & Scoot is your friend.

Sorry I'm not of more help, but since I'd just be rehashing the battleplan given in the manual, I figure it wouldn't be worth it to re-write it ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Cameroon, could you perhaps explain the briefing in the manual? I found it incredibly confusing, and I can't make heads or tails of it.

SPOILER:

First of all, the manual says that as part of the attack plan, a platoon of troops should ride on a company of IS-2s.

Well, a platoon plus the HQ is 5 units and a company of IS-2s is only 4 tanks. So either one must leave a unit behind or take an extra tank or two along. The manual is not clear.

Then, the manual seems to use the terms "left" and "right" interchangeably. While I generally admire an attempt to be creative with language, in this case, its bewildering.

The basic plan seems to be to have three task forces: A, B and the Recon force.

A is not confusing. A is the main assault force. It moves to the ridge near the scattered trees and the lone hut.

B is a doozy. In the setup, page 210 of the manual, paragraph 1, B is designated to "speed to the hills on the right." I see some hills on the right, past the ridge. They are wooded...

The recon detatchment is set to occupy the "wooded area to the right". Is this the same as B's area? It doesn't say.... But later on, the recon detatchment is mentioned as "reaching woods on the ridge to the far right" (also page 210 and 211)

By turn 10, we have real confusion. In spite of designating the "hills on the right" as B's goal, the manual NOW says that "By turn 10, task force B should have reached the hills on the left side?"

Are these the hill on the left side of the hill on the right that B was assigned to attack earlier? Or a different hill?

Later on the manual says that B will have LOS to the area behind the village from its arrival point. But is this the rocky hilltop on the left or the other hill waaaay over on the right? Both could have LOS to the village, it seems.

I THINK that B is actually intended to move to the hill on the left, cause that seems to be a better place to attack any Berman reinforcement, but Im really not clear. Anyone got any ideas?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Nolloff, not stupid at all. Personally if someone has won Jaegermeister some other way than the tutorial in the manual, I'd love to hear it.

Terence, yeah I forgot to say that the tactics in the tutorial need to be "fixed" when you read them ;)

**SPOILERS**

.

.

.

.

You've got the "fixes" right. TF B is supposed to head all the way to the far left hill. I was confused too, but when they mention TF B and the left hill, I figured it had to be that one. Your tanks can, indeed, reach that by turn 10 with fast move. They may not look like it when they are crawling through those trees, but they can. Oddly enough, I would probably have sent my infantry on foot. They would get there a LOT sooner (I think) and could make sure all is clear for your IS-2s.

As for the tank riding infantry, I sent 3 squads and the HQ. I left the other squad with the Coy CO.

Regarding TF A, that is easy... but if I play it again I would not put all my forces right there at the scattered woods & hut. I'd spread them out some along the back of the ridge all the way between the left side of the road & the hut. With the new supression model, if all your troops crest and descend in the same place then fire on one squad in the midst will affect everyone around too.

There you need to make sure your SUs have local superiority so that your troops can advance over the crest without being slaughtered. TF B should hopefully be in position to attract the Panthers' attention. Also, the 6 or so remaining IS-2s I had were doing shoot & scoot or seek hulldown to the Tigers to take them out. That actually worked quite well, but I think I was lucky.

BTW, Terrence, did you see those SU-152s that you get as reinforcements before the game was over? I only noticed them at the end game screen.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah, the manual seems to mean the hill on the left. And when it talks about having the tank-riding infantry search the woods, it means the woods in front of that hill. Found that out the hard way.

I had a hard time getting my tanks over to that hill on time - one of them got bogged in the trees near the start position when I tried to use Fast Move as recommended. Maybe better to stay in open ground as much as possible, and hunt through trees?

Anyway, I also got whaled the first time I tried it, and haven't tried it again yet.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

After starting to read the tutorial I became confused too and this is what worked for me. I assume it´s more or less close to the manual´s instructions, maybe a slight variation here and there.

I moved the initial force to the second ridge with the first flag, just below the hill where you start. I split my forces, moving all assault guns and two JS 2 to the area on the left flank, where the street goes over the ridge into town.

I placed my infantry in the trees on the ridge to the left and right of the road. I occupied the lone building with a Maxim. Two JS2 where put into position behind the ridge in the area of the building. The 5 JS2 on the right which transport a complete platoon I moved to the right flank and lined tem up in positions behind the ridge, the right tank being close to the woods on the right. The infantry disembarked and moved into the woods getting into jump-off positions to move towards the town/graveyard once the time was right. I moved my arty spotters there too.

My left flank, two JS2, four Assault guns fast moved over the ridge, downhill into town once everybody had arrived behind the ridge, the tank riding infantry disembarking once I was close enough to the woods and first buildings and cleared the woods to the right and left of the street. This force slowly progressed along the road further into town. Blowing up houses or occupying them.

Additional infantry, the pioneer force and infantry reinforcements also moved to the second ridge and then ran into town downhill left and right of the road. I slowly expanded my perimeter to the left and right into the woods until the right flank was in the buildings on the left side of the street with the church and graveyard.

In the meantime my tanks I had left behind had started to fight it out with the Tigers. I moved the SU152s there too and in the end I had killed the Tigers loosing 4 or 5 of my own vehicles.

The infantry on the far right flank also moved forward towards the church, and finally made it there.

In the meantime the Panthers had arrived. They got engaged by my two JS2s and the Assault guns in town, still in the area before the street coming down from the ridge meets the other road through town. At this point in time I considered it safe for the rest of my armor which was still on the right crest of the second ridge to move forward. I moved everything into town and put it to the left and right of the church and in the graveyard, hoping to get flank shots at the Panthers.

I managed to kill all Panthers but two which then hid in the woods on the right of the street with leads out of town towards the two remaining victory flags. Losing patience I mounted a human wave attack with a considerable infantry force which found the tanks and killed them both.

Excellent scenario.

Cheers

Nolloff

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks to Cameroon and Nolloff for the discussion here.

I'm blasting away at this one and having a great time. The AI hasn't given me a battle like this in quite some time.

I take it its best to try to engange the Panthers and Tigers in detail, from the side at closer range? IE. Many IS-2s shooting at one or two Panthers flanks at closer range?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

First off, what a great scenario design. I played this scenario last night TCP as the Germans double-blind with EFOW.

SPOILERS (of course)

*

*

*

*

*

*

*

*

*

*

*

*

*

*

*

*

*

The result was a Tactical german victory (though it may have been a Major if I had bothered to place a unit next to a flag well behind the lines tongue.gif ).

I was expecting and was prepared for my opponent to advance anywhere along the length of the map. It turns out he advanced basically head on over that ridge that has that first flag on it.

I had 2 AT guns and 3 Panthers directly covering that approach. A full Platoon + AT gun + HMG were lined up on the extreme right flank covering a flanking move which never eventuated.

I basically sparsely occuppied the town itself. There was a SMG platoon and HMG unit in the town but it was destroyed by the rocket barrage (was that impressive) and the advancing hordes of ussian infantry through the woods. The remaining platoon was lined up on the outskirts of the town to prevent any further infantry advance.

My basic plan was to forfiet the first flag (of course) and the Church flag and contest the other flag further in the town. My AT guns and Panthers of course were to ambush any armor at the most opportune moment.

I have never had an ambush and subsequent shoot out go so well!!! :eek:

At the end of the day, I think all but 1-3 Russian tanks remained for the loss of 2 Tigers (who I sent on a flanking move around those woods on the German left)and 1 Panther (who I sent ambitiously on a solo right flanking move).

My opponent advanced a full platoon of IS-2s to find hull down at the wall near the Church. It was at this momemnt that my ambush commenced. it was a beautiful sight. I had my ambushing Panthers set on Shoot n Scoot confusing the heck out of the Russian armor trying to target. Unbelievably, one of my AT guns survived with 4 tank kills and 14 infantry kills! They got the Knights Cross for that effort.

I was very surprised that my Russian opponent had terrible luck trying to KO my AT guns with his 122mm and 152mm guns!! It just didnt seem right that so many shots were ineffective. I checked the blast of a 152mm. It is about 350!And several shells came the way of the AT gun.

It is amazing how INVISIBLE infantry in EFOW can be!! He basically got in a whole battalion of infantry into the town when it looked like he only had maybe a depleted company.

If I were to play that again but as Russians, I would defintely investigate a left flank attack. Crossing that ridge on the right/centre is a nighmare it seems. I would even suggest sending a platoon of infantry with AT capability to clear the woods on the german left flank and sweep right around the scattered trees where my Panthers lay (and where the Tigers appear).

A memorable battle.

Lt Bull

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A truely challenging scenario. I played the first time and lost (as the Germans). The second time I only lost one tank and had 18 casualties.

My tactic was like others, to forfeit the first flag. I had my art. spotter aim for the hill, which eventually dislodged most of the riding infantry. I kept my infantry in the woods to prevent entry in the town, with some HMGS in the town itself.

I allowed the first wave of Russian armor to pass over the hill when I launched a flanking attack with my Panthers from the woods of the German right flank. The key is distance - my first game I tried the same thing but kept creeping up closer, negating their superior optics.

At a safe distance, and in force the panthers made quick work of 2nd wave of tanks along the ridge. Between the artillery attack and my Panthers, the whole russian assault broke down. However I did let a few through. Further back in the woods across the road I had the two AT guns waiting, and as the armor started heading towards the town, I hit them in the rear and knocked them out.

Russian infantry was annhilated in the woods, so they never made it to the town. Some additional units started breaking through the German left flank, but by then my tigers were on the way (my mistake last time was to expose them, so they got killed while getting into position). This time I took the longer, less visible route and was able to push back the few intruders that made it across the road.

By the end, I launched a counter attack a retook the hill - all Russian armor had been destroyed and infantry was in a panic. The key - keep the panzers at a safe distance, and use them enmasse to achieve devistating results.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 months later...
Originally posted by Cameroon:

Personally if someone has won Jaegermeister some other way than the tutorial in the manual, I'd love to hear it.

Sure, why not. I deliberately did *not* read the manual, once I noticed it was going to tell me what to do, figuring that the manual would always be there, but a virgin test would not. Still haven't read it, actually.

There's a nice road leading from the Communist Valley to BattleTown. Take it. Redline your armor up to it's maximum landspeed before appearing in Fascist-LOS, zoom over hilltop, and arrive in B'Town behind buildings/trees while Panzer boy slings hopeless pathetic rounds past your contrails...

From there, two widely disparate approaches, (at least!) on the same enemy tank means KO, whether it's uber-armor or not. Piece O' Cake.

Eden

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
  • 2 years later...

Damn, never thought of that. Get your tanks up to mach 1 speed, and ZOOM over the crest. Giving less time for Adolph and his boys to take shots at my commie tanks.

I usually park my IS-2's just my side of the ridge. If anything the gun in the cemetary can see the TC's head but not much else. And when I begin the assualt, I just do it from there, and they lumber over the ridge, and get creamed.

If they were going balls out when they go over the ridge, that would help minimize their time of exposure until they get to their next cover. I'll have to try this tonight.

Damn I'm a newb.

This game should not be able to be acquired without a prescription its so addicting. It's all I can think of here at work.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Also, don't forget that tanks can go through scattered trees.

Push your armor through the scattered trees to the left of the road, and Panzer Boy never gets a shot at them at all.

This is part of what I did on my first (blind) crack at this one against the AI, -- this let me get one group of armor (the 2 SU-122s, plus the KV-8s & 2 IS-2s, IIRC) into the town without loss of a single tank.

My other IS-2s, I split into two groups. One played peek-a-boo from the ridge and managed to get the Germans to reveal the ATG in the churchyard and the Kitties without a loss (though I did loose 1 crewman to a partial penetration). The other group went on a wide flanking run around to the left of the town. Once it got there, I had the Kitties trapped between the armored groups, and it was "Shoot and Scoot" time. Note that I had spotting infantry in cover on the crests for my IS-2s, so I always had them spotted, and knew which way their turrets were facing.

The ATG in the churchyard I nailed by hitting it with area fire from 2 MGs from the trees on the right (it had "gone quiet" after first revealing itself by firing at one of my "peek-a-boo" IS-2s). Then, I used the "Seek Hull Down" command and I timed it so that 2 of my IS-2s popped up on the far right of the open space of the ridge, just behind the pine trees, where they had LOS to the spot where the gun was, but not the Panzers. Then I had them "Area Fire" on the Gun's location. It never got a shot off -- the first salvo of 122mm fire (plus the area firing MGs) must have pinned the gun crew, and by the third salvo, I could see crew running away from the gun.

The Panzers were much tricker, but I could afford to be patient because my infantry attack into the town was moving just fine with the SU-122s & KV-8s in support -- I just made sure to to keep them out of LOS of the Kitties and ATG by using the buildings and trees as shields. All my IS-2s had to do was keep the Kitties busy so they couldn't interfere with my attack into the town. So I played "Spin the Tiger Turret" with my 2 groups of IS-2s. And eventually I got all the Kitties, too, partially because I think the AI started of move the Kitties forward in an attempt to engage my forces taking control of the town (the AI HATES to lose control of VLs!), and in the process gave my IS-2s on the ridge choice flank shots. Tiger go Boom!

I did lose 1 SU-122 to a Shreck or Faust er sumfink, and 2 IS-2s, one to one of the kitties, and one to an ATG. I think I had another IS-2 get gun damaged, too. But this still gave me plenty of armor to run roughshod over the rest of his defenses. I almost made it to the last VL way back in the corner, but got held up by some infantry along the way, and rather than trying to rush the VL and risk losing another tank to an infantry team, I spent the last few turns of the battle using up the rest of my HE blasting the cr@p out of his remaining infantry and racking up my casualty points. I suspect the Germans would have auto-surrendered in another turn or two if the battle hadn't ended.

Now, against a good human opponent, things would probably be much different. For starters, a smart human would better position his Panzers so they couldn't get caught in a crossfire, and try to take on the Soviet armor groups one at a time. But the basic concept -- use the most covered route into the town, to get infantry & support armor forward, and then use your other armor to keep the enemy armor engaged, works well against humans, too (I've since played the scenario multiple times against humans).

Cheers,

YD

Link to comment
Share on other sites

YES!!!!

Tried going around the left last night with the armor. HUGE difference. You can go ALL the way left, and come around to the back of the germans in the village, and use the buildings for cover as you advance toward the church/cemetary. If you try and advance over the open from the ridge to the church/cemetary, you get shredded.

By going all the way left, you can also get shots on the german tanks waaaaaay behind the church, PLUS, if you still leave 1 or 2 tanks on hte ridge right in front of the setup, on the right hand side, you can play "sping the turret" with the panzers and tigers with them and your tanks that went all the way to the left.

I never thought of sending them that far around the left. I'm pretty sure Adolph and company are finished tonight.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...