Silencer Posted February 11, 2000 Share Posted February 11, 2000 As seen on the CM HQ, the air raids are deadly against tanks. Dont't the heavy and medium tanks have AA-MG? All the pictures you see, the tanks had Anti-air later on in the war. Is this modelled in CM? Can the tank take advantages of the terrain, like hiding under trees, or in forests? In the PBEM game, the famous winter senario of Fionn on the CM HQ, there was a stug , way back. Fion positioned it aside on a forest road, under some trees, and still the planes saw it and destroyed it. Strange.... Some nice info on The Effects of Allied Air Power: http://home.swipnet.se/normandy/articles/article.html S. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted February 11, 2000 Share Posted February 11, 2000 Aye, that was an alpha bug though . It shouldn't have been targetted. Also, IIRC right that plane had twice the realistic bombload AND AAA fire was not coded in yet At that point in development airpower was about twice as deadly and invulnerable . It's not so any longer though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s bakker Posted February 11, 2000 Share Posted February 11, 2000 Silencer, a very intersting article indeed. I found this bit an eye-opnener; "An example of the swift recovery that was possible occurred on 29 June. Late in the afternoon the SPW battalion (III./SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt. 20) of the Hohenstaufen division had assembled for an attack together with Panther tanks from the panzer regiment. About 100 Lancaster planes bombed the assembly area. A huge dust cloud covered the area and those who observed the event were convinced that all units in the area must have been destroyed. However, by the evening 80% of the armoured vehicles were operational again. About twenty men had died during the bombing attack." hmmmm .... now how would that relate to the 16inch shelling in the other thread .... Aircraft were indeed deadly if they hit their mark, hitting their mark howevere was the main problem. When you're zooming past at 300+ km/h in a jabo you have little time to scout, aim, align and fire. And i agree with you that spotting afv's in folliage / depressions should be very hard for airborne treads. And then again, in pictures of German AFV's in 44/45 it's striking that most AFV's are heavily camo'd and the crews have their heads up .... looking for dots in the sky .... There should be a reason for that ' Dont't the heavy and medium tanks have AA-MG? All the pictures you see, the tanks had Anti-air later on in the war. Is this modelled in CM? ' Well, a single MG would make little chance of downing a jabo in 1944. Instead its purpose was to harass the jabo as it was aligning for its shot. Those tracer lines looked more nasty to pilots than they really were .... Grtz S Bakker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silencer Posted February 11, 2000 Author Share Posted February 11, 2000 ' Dont't the heavy and medium tanks have AA-MG? All the pictures you see, the tanks had Anti-air later on in the war. Is this modelled in CM? ' Well, a single MG would make little chance of downing a jabo in 1944. Instead its purpose was to harass the jabo as it was aligning for its shot. Those tracer lines looked more nasty to pilots than they really were .... true, one MG ain't gonna do it, but a goup of tanks shooting at 1 plane... But the most important thing was, that the tank commanders had something to shoot back with, even if it was just for morale. still, the AAmg can also be used for ground targets, like the 50cal. on the shermans. In the Beta-demo they can't be seen; for example on top of the tiger. I would like to know if that has been changed. Are they modelled in CM and do they now have a 3D model? S. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Germanboy Posted February 11, 2000 Share Posted February 11, 2000 In Ken Tout's 'Tank!' or 'A fine night for tanks' there is a nice picture of a Tiger I that was turned over by an air attack lying by the side of the road. Quite impressive, especially since it did not look too damaged. ------------------ Andreas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Beman Posted February 11, 2000 Share Posted February 11, 2000 Silencer, I always thought that most Tigers didn't have MGs mounted to the TC's cupola. DjB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tss Posted February 11, 2000 Share Posted February 11, 2000 According to what I've read Germans lost a quite small amount of tanks directly to aircraft attacks. I don't remember the actual figures but it was somewhere along 3-4 percent of losses. (Most often (over 60%) tanks were abandoned by their crews and most of the rest were destroyed by direct fire). However, Jabos were much more important than the kill figures would indicate, since a large part of the abandonments happened because the tanks had run out of fuel after the supply vehicles had been destroyed by fighters. Additionally, inexperienced crews were prone to bail out of their tanks and run when Jabos attacked. - Tommi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Lucke Posted February 12, 2000 Share Posted February 12, 2000 This isn't specifically on topic, but I was curious whether air attacks in CM will always be spot-on the target? I mean, is there an possibility of pilot-error induced "friendly fire" against your own units? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Babra Posted February 12, 2000 Share Posted February 12, 2000 I don't recall the thread, but it was specifically mentioned that friendly fire from air attack was a distinct possibility. ------------------ Floreat Jerboa ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Madmatt Posted February 12, 2000 Share Posted February 12, 2000 DONT RECALL THE THREAD!!! ACK man! You need to head over to CMHQ and go into the Special Events Section. I have a whole big feature there that covers just about every facet of Fighter-Bombers and their usage in Combat Mission. To answer your question there are quite alot of pilot errors! They can strafe the wrong targets (friendlies).. Continue to attack abandoned vehicles... Go and look at that feature, its all in there... BTW Friendly fire doesnt just affect air planes either. Your own units can misindentfy and fire on your own units as well...Check out the NEw Feature called Dynamic Friendly Fire for that one, what the hell check out the whole site...Well over 300 pages of content all about Combat Mission!!! Madmatt... ------------------ If it's in Combat Mission, it's on Combat Mission HQ! combathq.thegamers.net [This message has been edited by Madmatt (edited 02-11-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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