Struggling with the community

[BuzzCutPsycho]

On 8/18/2021 at 10:10 PM, dbsapp said:

Pretty much sums up the thread. Observing senile boomers yelling at computers remains a timeless pleasure of mine.

[BuzzCutPsycho]

On 8/18/2021 at 5:48 PM, slysniper said:

well, I will apologize to those young forum members that do not fill this statement as to its qualifications. And are working and doing something productive

But for all those that do, I have no need to, any person, no matter the age, which has the desire for the government to take care of them and want to do nothing to help mankind progress on by personally doing something to be of service can take my comment as offensive all they want. (which there is way too many of out there in the world presently).

As for a retired person having the same status. Incorrect

if that person has worked their whole life, paid into a system that takes way more over those years of work and gives some of it back once they qualify for it in their older years when working is not logical. They are not the same at all.

But no need to worry, because before long, the whole system is  going to adjust and its not going to be pretty when it does. 

I consider most modern military "veterans" to be indistinguishable from the people "living off the government" and doing "nothing to help mankind" you are whinging about.

[mjkerner]

Edu-ma-cate me, Millennial airhead, lol!

[Aragorn2002]

On 8/16/2021 at 11:17 AM, G. Smiley said:

Thanks domfluff!

I remembered I actually downloaded the Discord app for some reason a while ago, so I fired it up - but was unable to locate the Combat Mission group? What is it called?

 

Great name, George!

[Thewood1]

Boy, sure is good that everyone tries to welcome a younger generation of players.  Lets not worry about BFC's future just so we can fell good about ourselves by putting down people who play and communicate a different way.

[danfrodo]

yo all, why hostility to young people?  It just makes you look foolish.  YOU WERE ALL YOUNG ONCE TOO and not endowed with the decades of experience and wisdom you now possess.  I bet many of you smoked pot, binge drank, watched way too much TV, wore nylon pants and danced to michael jackson, or banged your heads to crap like Kiss (I did like Kiss in ~7th grade, but one day realized "these guys kinda suck musically" -- fortunately moved on to Allman Brothers multi-year binge (I genuflect and make sign of cross here, blessed be Thine Allmans, may they jam in peace w good soundman)).  So yes, you once looked silly to an older generation back in the day. 

So maybe we let the kids do their thing while they can -- they'll all have kids and mortgages and endless bills and be grumpy soon enough.

[Aragorn2002]

1 hour ago, danfrodo said:

yo all, why hostility to young people?  It just makes you look foolish.  YOU WERE ALL YOUNG ONCE TOO and not endowed with the decades of experience and wisdom you now possess.  I bet many of you smoked pot, binge drank, watched way too much TV, wore nylon pants and danced to michael jackson, or banged your heads to crap like Kiss (I did like Kiss in ~7th grade, but one day realized "these guys kinda suck musically" -- fortunately moved on to Allman Brothers multi-year binge (I genuflect and make sign of cross here, blessed be Thine Allmans, may they jam in peace w good soundman)).  So yes, you once looked silly to an older generation back in the day. 

So maybe we let the kids do their thing while they can -- they'll all have kids and mortgages and endless bills and be grumpy soon enough.

Indeed, I love young people, especially women. 

[BuzzCutPsycho]

The dislike for "young people" in gaming is understandable especially if you look at the trend of modern AAA or even AA games but the wargaming community has always had an issue with gate keeping and quite frankly Combat Mission itself does not do itself any favors when it comes to attracting and growing a player base.

The fact that "PBEM +++" or whatever it is called is being touted as this amazing breakthrough is comical in of itself. A true lobby system and genuine support of a proper multiplayer would do wonders in facilitating a healthy MP community albeit a niche one.

This PBEM garbage was outdated back when CM was first released and it's even more outdated today. The group I play CM with (about 30 people on a Discord) all play direct connect either turn based or real time. PBEM is antiquated garbage and players interested in the series are right to mock and laugh at it being touted as a feature.

[Ultradave]

The technology may be old, but PBEM has its place. Many people cannot set aside a long stretch of uninterrupted time to play a direct CM game. The reasons are varied - young families demand a player's time, where it's easy to fit in a PBEM turn here and there. Older people, while not occupied with young children, may have varied interests and demands on their time.

It's cool you have 30 people who CAN do that. That's pretty cool. Personally, I can't, and PBEM for me is the way to go. Calling it garbage, IMO is a bit over the top. 

Dave - battening down the hatches for tomorrow's hurricane/tropical storm. We're about 5 miles east of the projected path they just showed on the 6pm news.

 

Edited August 21, 2021 by Ultradave

[Zveroboy1]

Anything that divides a community and pits one group against another one is inherently stupid and harmful especially in the case of a small niche community like ours. It works both ways though. As much as having a grumpy old person raging on young people is comical, the reverse can be just as bad. Yeah you will be old too one day and it is going to happen sooner than you think, so better watch that karma.

Now here is my totally in depth and unbiased take on discord.

The good :

- It is more casual, I mean this in a good way, relaxed and also interactive than the forums
- It is good if you want to shoot the **** with other players and fans of the CM games, get to know them etc
- If you have a question that needs answered right now, you can often get a reply within a minute
- lots of knowledgeable people there too
- the memes

The bad :

- the memes

[Sgt.Squarehead]

3 minutes ago, Zveroboy1 said:

a grumpy old person raging on young people

You called? 

[BuzzCutPsycho]

1 hour ago, Ultradave said:

The technology may be old, but PBEM has its place. Many people cannot set aside a long stretch of uninterrupted time to play a direct CM game. The reasons are varied - young families demand a player's time, where it's easy to fit in a PBEM turn here and there. Older people, while not occupied with young children, may have varied interests and demands on their time.

It's cool you have 30 people who CAN do that. That's pretty cool. Personally, I can't, and PBEM for me is the way to go. Calling it garbage, IMO is a bit over the top. 

Dave - battening down the hatches for tomorrow's hurricane/tropical storm. We're about 5 miles east of the projected path they just showed on the 6pm news.

 

I do not feel like calling it garbage is over the top given the technological standard for multiplayer games now.

No amount of fanciful excuses are going to make up for the fact that PBEM is an obsolete relic of the past that is mocked by PC players in the year 2021 and a PBEM "lobby" system is not going to change that. While I personally have nothing against the addition of such a lobby since it will benefit players such as yourself I cannot help but feel that unless a direct player option is also included a bit of the mark is being missed here.

I keep reading that "one turn a day" is the standard but I cannot help but notice that people are grossly overexaggerating the amount of time required to play or finish a H2H combat mission game. Most battles I play are set to "large" in Cold War and take around one and a half to two hours in turn based mode. The longest match I played was three hours set to huge in Black Sea. These are no different than going to a hobby shop on the weekend for a game of Battletech or Warhammer 40k which can take much, much longer.

Additionally nearly every battle I have played in CW (A total of 70 so far) has been decided relatively early in the game on meeting engagements. I guess if you decide to fight to the last man and the last round it could potentially take you a very long time but I have more respect for my opponents as they do me to draw out a game with zero chance of victory.

Do not misunderstand what I write as vitriol hatred or anything of the sort. I am a passionate fan of the entire CM franchise and have been involved since it was first released. It replaced Close Combat for me back in the day and I've been here ever since. Because I have been here ever since the stagnation of the series in the technological department pains me in more ways than just the multiplayer system.

The game's multiplayer was antiquated back then and it is even more so now two decades later.

[Ultradave]

Well,  I gave my reasons politely. PBEM fits my life. That’s all. Have fun. 
 

Dave

[BuzzCutPsycho]

Poor time management doesn't change the fact that PBEM is an antiquated and outdated system. That's all. Have fun.

Buzz

Edited August 22, 2021 by BuzzCutPsycho

[Ultradave]

I’m not sure what your deal is but enough with the gratuitous insults
 

 

[z1812]

15 minutes ago, BuzzCutPsycho said:

Poor time management doesn't change the fact that PBEM is an antiquated and outdated system. That's all. Have fun.

Buzz

I couldn't care less what you think. I wonder who made you an expert? PBEM is a choice people sometimes make because it suits them........................if you don't like it, don't use it. 

[BuzzCutPsycho]

You cared enough to respond.

And since you do care I am pleased to inform you that I don't use it. That doesn't change the fact that it is antiquated. That isn't up for debate. It's a fact. And the experience many have had where people just "disappear" and games abruptly end is one of many reasons why the system is inferior to direct play.

Simple as.

Edited August 22, 2021 by BuzzCutPsycho

[Artkin]

No hate for PBEM here.. it works for me.. some days I wanna send a few turns. Some days I wanna rest up. Its old, but there still isn't anything like it, especially down the war game alley. 

I agree though. It is indeed about time we get a real multiplayer. Which means real time support, and direct connections handled by a centralized server. 

It was definitely nice hearing that multiplayer is being focused on. But this is just a small step in my opinion. 

[BuzzCutPsycho]

5 minutes ago, Artkin said:

No hate for PBEM here.. it works for me.. some days I wanna send a few turns. Some days I wanna rest up. Its old, but there still isn't anything like it, especially down the war game alley. 

I agree though. It is indeed about time we get a real multiplayer. Which means real time support, and direct connections handled by a centralized server. 

It was definitely nice hearing that multiplayer is being focused on. But this is just a small step in my opinion. 

I would genuinely be shocked to see anything other than a lobby system which admittedly is more than enough. Most players seem to play CM using WEGO which doesn't require complex micro movements so it can get away with games being direct play peer-to-peer as opposed to dedicated servers.

[Erwin]

19 minutes ago, BuzzCutPsycho said:

Most players seem to play CM using WEGO which doesn't require complex micro movements

Have to disagree with this.   Am playing a H2H game right now.  It takes me about 4 hours to do a turn, and my oppo sometimes takes a couple of days due to RL issues.  When one has other things going in life, other responsibilities,,one cannot devote a certain amount of time to play at a certain time of day.

[BuzzCutPsycho]

LOL.

[Artkin]

If I understand correct you mean the amount of information that's stored during the 1 minute turns for pbem isn't a whole lot.

Well I guess so, one of our games is 100mb per turn, so that is kind of a pain in the azz to move around nowadays. Just barely gets by for my taste..

Edited August 22, 2021 by Artkin

[chuckdyke]

Playing a game in the Cloud on a central server? All what you mail are the references of your moves. Will be CM by subscription. Doesn't matter or a player quits you can take his or her place. 

[Monty's Mighty Moustache]

5 hours ago, BuzzCutPsycho said:

Poor time management doesn't change the fact that PBEM is an antiquated and outdated system. That's all. Have fun.

Buzz

Poor time management? Really? I play PBEM because I have a full time job and two kids under 5 so I “manage” maybe an hour a day if I’m lucky. Without PBEM I wouldn’t be able to play multiplayer at all. Guess that’s my fault for managing my time poorly, who knew?

Sweeping generalisations aren’t going to do you any favours.

I do however think it should offer more alternatives for multiplayer for those that want it. 

MMM

[Bulletpoint]

5 hours ago, BuzzCutPsycho said:

Most players seem to play CM using WEGO which doesn't require complex micro movements

I'm a bit confused about what you mean here. I would argue the exact opposuite: that playing WeGo needs much more careful order giving, since you're stuck with those orders for a whole minute, so they need to work, and you can't reply on the AI to find a path out of a telefone booth - if you're old enough to remember those

 

Edited August 22, 2021 by Bulletpoint