What Subject For The First CMCW Module?

[Sequoia]

2 minutes ago, Sequoia said:

Ah, my bad. I checked my source and it looks as if I misremembered the number of brigades stationed in Germany.

P.S. I think I confused the Dutch with the Belgians (forgive me both countries). My source (S&T 56) has two Belgian divisions in Germany but doesn't say where exactly as it does for other units,

[chuckdyke]

1 hour ago, Sequoia said:

I think I confused the Dutch with the Belgians

The Dutch in the 60's had their 4th Division stationed near a place called Lunenburg.

[Halmbarte]

3 hours ago, Sequoia said:

P.S. I think I confused the Dutch with the Belgians (forgive me both countries). My source (S&T 56) has two Belgian divisions in Germany but doesn't say where exactly as it does for other units,

Eh, roughly half the Belgians are really Dutch anyways. 
 

H

[Splinty]

On 5/25/2021 at 10:13 AM, Sequoia said:

Do you mean only one brigade had the long hair troops?

Yes. I may just have a fuzzy memory of the time. But IIRC the unionized, long haired Dutch Army was actually only one brigade and the rest of the Dutch Army followed standard type military regulations.

[Bulletpoint]

On 5/14/2021 at 3:42 PM, SpitfireXI said:

And some Danes?  But how much fun would a Norwegian module be?  Fighting in the fjords.

Danes for Cold War. Norwegians for a WW2 module. In my humble and somewhat Danish opinion.

[JM Stuff]

On 5/26/2021 at 12:04 AM, Sequoia said:

P.S. I think I confused the Dutch with the Belgians (forgive me both countries). My source (S&T 56) has two Belgian divisions in Germany but doesn't say where exactly as it does for other units,

The I. BE Corps was in the combat patrol of NORTHAG in the central German mountainous region. used between Harz in the north and Kassel in the south. The focus was on Göttingen ( "Stripes of Göttingen" ).

The corps was supposed to wage a delay battle near the border against armored forces of the Warsaw Pact .

The left neighbor of the I. BE Corps was the I. BR Corps and on the right border to Army Group CENTAG the III. DE Corps of the Bundeswehr . Similar to the I. NL Corps.

 The I. BE Corps was unfavorably deployed and needed a certain period of time to reach the GDP positions in its area of responsibility from Belgium and North Rhine-Westphalia ( Aachen , Cologne , Soest and Siegen ).

The main task of the 1st Belgian Corps was to repel tank attacks of the Warsaw Pact in the combat sector assigned to it and to bring them to a standstill.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NORTHAG_wartime_structure

 

JM

Edited May 27, 2021 by JM Stuff

[Stardekk]

I think East\West Germans will be next too. Also, mind you that because the battlfield  the Germans will have equipment from Leopard 2s to M47 (Patton), will be interesting to see how the terretorials will get introduced.

[Lethaface]

On 5/27/2021 at 3:11 PM, Splinty said:

Yes. I may just have a fuzzy memory of the time. But IIRC the unionized, long haired Dutch Army was actually only one brigade and the rest of the Dutch Army followed standard type military regulations.

https://isgeschiedenis.nl/nieuws/nederlandse-krijgsmacht-als-hippieleger

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=nl&tl=en&u=https://isgeschiedenis.nl/nieuws/nederlandse-krijgsmacht-als-hippieleger

 

By the way there are still 'unions' for army, police, etc.

Edit: it was all before I was born anyway (1982), so not an expert. However I think that perhaps there is a different appreciation for unions in different places.

Most professional sectors have 'unions' in the Netherlands. These negotiate, among other things, salary 'thresholds', benefits and other stuff on behalf of the whole sector. 
They don't have anything to say on the workfloor, but can call up their members (voluntary) for a strike as part of negotiations. Not that strikes are common here the last decades. Also newer sectors like IT don't really have unions or sectoral salary houses etc.

The long hair is just the result of a legal action filed by the union for drafted military personnel. This legal bit is still in affect although in the professional army nowadays long hairs aren't a thing really.

Edited May 28, 2021 by Lethaface

[Aragorn2002]

On 5/26/2021 at 3:38 AM, Halmbarte said:

Eh, roughly half the Belgians are really Dutch anyways. 
 

H

I wouldn't put it like that...

[Billythegoat]

I would like to see the module or modules

1. Soviet drive to Paris and Antwerp ( intro to NATO and Warsaw Pact forces) with airborne/air assault forces

2. Invasion America ( SPI's very popular game from 1976 ) - selected scenarios :i.e.    Canadian/US border  , invasion in southern/gulf area US from Cuba or Central America , crossing the Mississippi, strategic points, ect.

not asking too much for a new guy, Lol

i think maybe BS could expand into a modern Korea engagement (off topic)

[The_Capt]

1 hour ago, Billythegoat said:

I would like to see the module or modules

1. Soviet drive to Paris and Antwerp ( intro to NATO and Warsaw Pact forces) with airborne/air assault forces

2. Invasion America ( SPI's very popular game from 1976 ) - selected scenarios :i.e.    Canadian/US border  , invasion in southern/gulf area US from Cuba or Central America , crossing the Mississippi, strategic points, ect.

not asking too much for a new guy, Lol

i think maybe BS could expand into a modern Korea engagement (off topic)

Bil and I once bandied around an idea of recreating the War of 1812 in a dystopian future, Invasion America would nicely link into that concept.  Unfortunately that one is not currently on the books...but a lad can always dream.

[Billythegoat]

I know it's a dream , but a Cold War gone Hot - man it fits perfect, who doesn't want to invade the US , very popular with the " Modern Warfare" game crowd and who in the USA doesn't want to be a Wolverine ?

 

tried to quote , but failed 

Edited May 28, 2021 by Billythegoat
Tried to quote

[Erwin]

1 hour ago, The_Capt said:

2. Invasion America ( SPI's very popular game from 1976 ) - selected scenarios :i.e.    Canadian/US border  , invasion in southern/gulf area US from Cuba or Central America , crossing the Mississippi, strategic points, ect.

Hmmm.   That actually sounds like fun.  Are US buildings mods possible?

[Halmbarte]

On 5/28/2021 at 9:32 AM, Billythegoat said:

I know it's a dream , but a Cold War gone Hot - man it fits perfect, who doesn't want to invade the US , very popular with the " Modern Warfare" game crowd and who in the USA doesn't want to be a Wolverine ?

 

tried to quote , but failed 

Invasion USA would have to ignore the very real problem of logistics. 

How does the invading army get to the US? How are they resupplied? If the answer is 'by air*' you fail. 

H

 

*Yeah I know that they needed a premise for Red Dawn but the more you ignore the backstory in that movie the better your experience will be. 

[Artkin]

50 minutes ago, Halmbarte said:

*Yeah I know that they needed a premise for Red Dawn but the more you ignore the backstory in that movie the better your experience will be. 

Haha yup. Look at Britain. It's like 20 miles off the shore of France. Wasnt invaded.

Apples and oranges but relevant enough to make sense.

Edited May 30, 2021 by Artkin

[domfluff]

1 hour ago, Halmbarte said:

Invasion USA would have to ignore the very real problem of logistics. 

How does the invading army get to the US? How are they resupplied? If the answer is 'by air*' you fail. 

H

 

*Yeah I know that they needed a premise for Red Dawn but the more you ignore the backstory in that movie the better your experience will be. 

Whilst it's certainly not realistic, I do think there's some scope for this kind of thing.

The tabletop game Force on Force had a Cold War Gone Hot scenario book, which divided its scenarios into the situation as feared (more or less the scenario in CMCW), the situation with what we know now (so, lower-key scenarios, including things like US special forces as advisors fighting Soviets in Afghanistan), and then a section of scenarios which replicate films - so Red Dawn, Doctor Strangelove, Ice Station Zebra, etc.

Obviously the latter are going to be pretty silly, and probably not suitable as a formal BF release, but it wouldn't be out of the question for user scenarios.

Edited May 30, 2021 by domfluff

[Sequoia]

If and when we get a German module one could make scenarios based on this boardgame.

 

https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/5958/nato-nukes-nazis

[Combatintman]

Invasion America - so another module of Americans fighting the Soviets ... hmmm .... hmmm.  Not like people are going to buy it for the content is it?  I'm sure somebody if they really wanted to could make some pretty acceptable maps with what is in the game already.  And of course the base game already has US content in the form of the NTC.  As a first module for this title ... again I'll bet my two pensions on it not happening.

[Sequoia]

I assume you mean you'd bet your two pensions on an "Invasion America" module not being the first module and not that there won't be any modules right? If so, I'd agree.  I'd be surprised if we ever saw it. Didn't Mikey D do a CMSF module of a modern US Civil war scenario? I don't remember if he based his map on actual US terrain.

[Billythegoat]

While the premise of a North American invasion in the late 70’s - early 80’s was not practical as history has played out. That does not negate a “what if “. What if the oil embargo extended through the 80’s, ( would have made the colonial pipeline shutdown almost a life style )operation Eagle Claw succeeded , Reagan was defeated ( wife dabbled in the occult, frowned on by moral majority), unemployment rose even higher , interest rates stayed between 17-20 percent ( yes , they were that high once ) all the government spending goes out for social relief, half the fleet mothballed, Panama Canal becomes non navigational, Armed forces size cut in half , Central and South America democracies fail, dogs and cats living together , human sacrifices......

really what I was saying is Combat Mission is the PERFECT system for enjoying tactical warfare defending interstate 95 North to prevent Cuban/Warsaw Pact/Soviet forces for getting to DC. Point is  , this is a great gaming opportunity. And a generally popular theme.It would be a missed opportunity of gaming history. It’s not Red Dawn ( far too small a venue with partisans ) but the Airborne ambush of the US armored column to relieve “ Calumet” would be ( if you remember that from the movie ). As far as logistics go , be it Argentina/Brazil/Venezuelan alliance, with arms, oil , manpower from Central America, Extraterrestrial support - create your own theory.we would just have to deal with 3 Soviet tank corps crossing into the Montana/North Dakota boarder. 
 

IMHO

[Billythegoat]

1 hour ago, Sequoia said:

If and when we get a German module one could make scenarios based on this boardgame.

 

https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/5958/nato-nukes-nazis

[Holman]

Someone could create "Invasion America" right now with graphics mods alone. The US/Soviet data is already in the engine, and all you have to do is change some building textures and doodads.

You've got German terrain for the East and South and NTC terrain for Texas etc. Recolor it for Kudzu and gravel roads if you really want to go to town.

[Bil Hardenberger]

5 hours ago, Combatintman said:

As a first module for this title ... again I'll bet my two pensions on it not happening.

You can be t more than that Karl.  

[Halmbarte]

I’m coming around to wanting Germans 1st then BOAR. 

Who doesn’t want Leopards (1 & 2, thank you very much), Marders, Luchs, Milans, and Panzerfausts?

 

I really also want Chieftains and maybe some late mark Centurions, although I’m concerned about British infantry’s AT capability in this time frame. 

One thing I’m learning by playing the Sov scenarios is that the Sov rifle squads are very capable vs 1979 American armor. Tank hunting with infantry in woods and villages is a thing that can be done much more successfully than in Black Sea or Shock Force. 

H

[Artkin]

IF they were to invade the US, would Long Island make a good staging point?

I know Cuba would have been a staging point, but I feel like that part of the US would have been really tough to invade. Moving hard and fast into the dense NY environment seems like the better way to fight

Edited May 31, 2021 by Artkin