Ground surveillance radars

[Lethaface]

8 hours ago, chuckdyke said:

Radar was used for counter artillery in the 60's. They could pick the shells in flight and compute the counter artillery. @Lethaface that's where the tactic shoot and scoot originated from. Till now they don't apply this in Combat Mission. Flying Command Centres aka AWACS woud make the game one-sided. 

The first man throwing a rock at something and than making a run for it, invented 'shooting & scooting'. 

[chuckdyke]

3 hours ago, Lethaface said:

The first man throwing a rock at something and than making a run for it, invented 'shooting & scooting'. 

The moment you stop in the open you're history. That much I found out playing this game, shoot and find a different location. We have no reference maps either, imagine playing with 50 TRP's per 1km². I don't think it would be much fun. We would soon have a system like the NVA fight from tunnels. 

[hank24]

The Bundeswehr PzAufklBtl (armored recon) had a radar platoon at that time, 4 Rasura on DKW jeep and 5 AN/TPS 33 on Spz kurz (Hotchkiss). As far as I remember moving targets only, you just see a spiky plot on a very small screen or a signal on your ears. Much depended on the skill of the operator. They were able to discriminate tanks from moving infantry and give an estimate on number of targets. The range was fairly long, though. So, as the name says, it was for surveillance, not more.

[Thewood1]

On 3/1/2021 at 8:29 PM, chuckdyke said:

The moment you stop in the open you're history. That much I found out playing this game, shoot and find a different location. We have no reference maps either, imagine playing with 50 TRP's per 1km². I don't think it would be much fun. We would soon have a system like the NVA fight from tunnels. 

One of micromanagement weaknesses in CM is the inability for the individual unit AIs to know enough to fire once or twice, back up, move 50 yards, move to hull down, and shoot again.  You can do it in wego, but it takes a little micro and its slow because you can't completely chain the orders to make it happen without waiting on human intervention between turns.  Not a huge weakness in WW2, but in modern battles, its pretty standard to have to operate like that.

I know in Steel Beasts, its a standard function of the built in AI tactics to only fire 1-2 times before moving into cover and repositioning for the next shots.  Its actually very cool to watch it all automatically.  Tanks also halt fire automatically on a path.  Similar to CM1's hunt command.

[The_MonkeyKing]

 

Indeed seems that the ground radar on the BMR-1 is not extended opposed to CMBS where it is extended. This indicates it is not going to be functional in CMCW.

[Erwin]

5 hours ago, Thewood1 said:

One of micromanagement weaknesses in CM is the inability for the individual unit AIs to know enough to fire once or twice, back up, move 50 yards, move to hull down, and shoot again.  You can do it in wego, but it takes a little micro and its slow because you can't completely chain the orders to make it happen without waiting on human intervention between turns.  Not a huge weakness in WW2, but in modern battles, its pretty standard to have to operate like that.

Yes, have long advocated for a new routine like the old "shoot 'n scoot" where one can order a unit to "wait in ambush, shoot, then deploy to a 2nd position".  This would also be useful for snipers and AT teams.

[chuckdyke]

I agree with your comment, @Erwin I would like to be able to do something like that thank you. @Thewood1 I achieve this by setting my fire on continues at several waypoints during a turn. The trick is not to stop in the open with 30 or more seconds to go in a turn. Yes, I agree to adopt a standard tactical procedure in the move command structure. Thanks for your input. 

Edited March 7, 2021 by chuckdyke

[Los]

US divisions in 70s -80s had a CEWI BN (combat electronic warfare and intelligence). It had three companies. One was a traditional MI company , one was a signal intercept company and one was a ground surveillance company.  The GS company had three platoons each supporting a brigade. Each platoon had ground surveillance radars ( first iirc an/pps5 (which they  pronounced it”Pepsi” 5,) then by early eighties an/pps-15. It also had remote sensors.( hand emplaced remotely monitored  unattended ground sensors using, depending on the type, seismic, acoustic, or and metal detecting.

Every line combat battalion typically had two three-man radar teams and one three-man sensor team attached. The radar guys could be employed depending on the terrain as early warning for attacks integrated into the battalion defensive schemes, ( this was before decent NVG capability) and in open terrain could pick up vehicles and infantry movement out to several kilometers if there was LOS. The down side being the radar’s emissions could bring in artillery. 

The sensor team could deploy sensor strings along trails (usually via dedicated sensor emplacement patrols) and other areas where observation was more problematic, could not be DF.d, and were accurate enough to detect infiltrators, attacks, and be used to call  in fire.

Both assets were controlled by the BN S-2 and integrated into the battalion’s reconnaissance and screening efforts provided that the S-2 knew what he was doing (many did not).

 

hope that helps.

 

Los