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Bear claws


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Just finished Bear Claws, great fun dropping the buildings with the Sturmpanzers to get LOS/LOF to tanks and clear out those pesky US infantry.  Thanks to @MeatEtr

All Sturmpanzers survived but my infantry took some sorry punishment.

Was interested in the Allied air support which was new to me, and which buzzed around for what seemed like ages.  What the heck did it drop here?

image.thumb.png.3570a5c947eeb12ef9dd2112acf70bce.png

Anyway it appeared, just as my flakvierling was moving up.  First turn with it on attack, strafed my infantry with little result.  Second turn, same again a bit more damage this time.  Third turn, strafed its own infantry, say no more but I was grateful.  Fourth turn flakvierling fired twice on it, and it strafed distractedly with no results.  Fifth turn, with no obvious reason my flakvierling crew dismounted and ran off (perhaps ground fire from a long way away).  Sixth turn, as per picture above, no damage done at least to my troops.  Seventh turn, a more nasty straf on my infantry.  Eighth turn still buzzing around.  Ninth (I think) had turned for home.  I suppose 9 minutes on target is not a lot but it seemed like forever?

 

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54 minutes ago, Vergeltungswaffe said:

An AN-M64 bomb is the typical USAAF 500 lber.

I wonder the manual says 238kg instead of 227kg?

It's 227kg for British aircraft.

You spotted my deliberate mistake - the manual does say 238 not 283 (was a bit of a grainy image in my defence).  Don't know about 227 though (which is the conversion of 500 lb), but it was on a US Warhawk if that makes any difference - as you can probably tell I'm not a bomb expert 🙃.

Edited by Vacilllator
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1 hour ago, Vergeltungswaffe said:

some of the British aircraft are shown to have 2227 kg bombs!

 Would need a slightly bigger hole in the ground for that as well 💣💥🕳️

1 hour ago, Vergeltungswaffe said:

Not going to be any fighter bombers hauling anything like that. 🤣

Yes, I thought even 2 * 500 lbs sounds like a bit of a load.  Perhaps BFC can introduce the Lancaster to the game for those situations where you just need to level a bridge or perhaps a sink a battleship.  Sorry I'm getting carried away now  😉 .

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In another scenario, I once had a 500lbs bomb dropped directly in front of a Jagdpanzer. It did not do any damage, but it was an amazing sight. I watched the scene from the Jagpanzer and was surprised by a shaking screen and whiteout for a second or two. Can't quite remember, if even the sound was muted after the "big bang".

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 10/27/2020 at 7:00 PM, Vacilllator said:

 Would need a slightly bigger hole in the ground for that as well 💣💥🕳️

Yes, I thought even 2 * 500 lbs sounds like a bit of a load.  Perhaps BFC can introduce the Lancaster to the game for those situations where you just need to level a bridge or perhaps a sink a battleship.  Sorry I'm getting carried away now  😉 .

 

With that you would probably level the entire map 😅

Anyway I'm not sure at all you'd see a lancaster in a battle, typically heavy bombers lack the flexibility to operate at a tactical level, which is reserved to the more nimble and faster airplanes like light bombers or fighters.

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The He-111, JU-88, Pe-2, etc all performed bombing like that, high speed and low level against suspected or known enemy positions. You'd rarely see something like a Lancaster or B-17 at those levels yeah since they were by design Strategic Bombers intended for high-level bombing and far more role-specific. They'd never be used in a CM sort of situation because CM's biggest maps would still have them attacking targets dangerously close to friendlies and their circular-error-probability was measurable in many miles at normal bombing altitudes. 

Although their preferred targets were things like rally areas, supply dumps, and local transportation hubs like railyards and bridges. The favorite targets were things like airfields and field HQs. They flew high enough to avoid light anti-aircraft and fast enough to present a challenging target for anti-aircraft artillery. Tactical level bombers were used against frontline positions a lot of the time, but their missions would be tightly planned and scripted at much higher levels than the player could reasonably affect. Their effects could be "abstracted" in other ways though. 

As engines got better single engine airplanes began to get much bigger, and payloads correspondingly increased leading to the "Fighter-Bomber" which eventually took over the Medium Bomber's job. Fighters were just way less vulnerable, and their smaller payloads could be offset by using more of them. 

Here's a full mission brief and debrief for the 351st Group's attack on the St. Lo marshalling area for instance, which includes references to nearby friendly positions and standing orders.

25 July 1944 Target: St. Lo to Periers, France Area Bombing (German Front Lines) (351st.org)

Edited by SimpleSimon
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3 hours ago, SimpleSimon said:

they were by design Strategic Bombers intended for high-level bombing

And also used en mass in hundreds and eventually thousands to destroy square miles of real estate/buildings - almost like tactical nukes.  One would never see one or two assigned to support troops as in CAS.  

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Strategic bombers got most of their survivability from their formation and its massed defensive fire. One or two were very easy targets for interceptors. The Allies did use Strategic Bombers occasionally in missions directed against frontline troops, such as the huge raid on Panzer Lehr's positions west of St Lo prior to Operation Cobra. That still involved something like 3,000 airplanes of which 351st bombardment group was only one formation. 

One exception is that the USAAF did practice level bombing by lone or small groups of B-17s against enemy shipping, usually with disappointing results but they did manage to sink a few submarines and merchants during the war. 

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Good comments with which I totally agree, but my original comment was 'tongue in cheek'

On 10/27/2020 at 6:00 PM, Vacilllator said:

 for those situations where you just need to level a bridge or perhaps a sink a battleship.  Sorry I'm getting carried away now  😉 .

Wasn't expecting BFC to add large bombers, the fighter bombers are bad enough as I'm usually on the receiving end.

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5 hours ago, SimpleSimon said:

 The Allies did use Strategic Bombers occasionally in missions directed against frontline troops, such as the huge raid on Panzer Lehr's positions west of St Lo prior to Operation Cobra. 

That raid was conducted against the German defenses in general. Panzer Lehr was just a remnant of it's June 6th self by that stage.

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